From borzou at falconprintandcopy.com Fri Feb 1 00:36:15 2008 From: borzou at falconprintandcopy.com (Borzou Azabdaftari) Date: Fri Feb 1 00:36:51 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <595C76DC63BE481B86ACEFF9ABA39F1B@BEDROOM> References: <00ad01c8642d$0fff61c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <00db01c8645c$33404d00$0b01a8c0@CharXP> <595C76DC63BE481B86ACEFF9ABA39F1B@BEDROOM> Message-ID: Um, I'd like to see some video of your custom made machines. Or pictures. Borzou Azabdaftari Falcon Print and Copy 1921 Gallows Road Suite 150 Vienna, VA 22182 t.703.442.0124 f.703.442.0134 borzou@falconprintandcopy.com On Jan 31, 2008, at 8:09 PM, xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charlene Sims" > > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 5:54 PM > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> So Wayne what is this technology you have been using for years. >> I actually saw this video of the Memjet about two years ago and put >> it >> online here, but it was not actually on the market selling. Maybe >> I am >> skeptical but what are we missing here. If this is so good, so >> fast, so >> inexpensive, why doesn't everyone have one. It is pretty amazing. >> I can't >> see where it runs envelopes. Are you running envelopes on yours >> Wayne. I >> would sure be interested in looking at more about this, like from >> people who >> are actually using it. >> >> Charlene Sims > > The technology I've been using for the last several years is > something that > I but together myself using a combination of existing technologies. > It is basically the same as what you see happening with the memjet > videos. > I guess it is my background as a service technician with several > different > companies as well as a 15 year career with the Xerox organization > that has > kept me interested in following and inventing better ways of putting > ink on > paper. I was a teenager when I landed my first technician job with > an english > company called Gestetner. In some ways the RISO machine of today is a > more automated Gestetner of days gone by. I've seen a lot of > different > ways to put ink on paper over the years and what memjet is up to was > only a matter of time. I know for a fact that Canon and others > could offer > today, production machines that will change the entire landscape of > printing > as we know it. But, for now, it would only result in them shooting > themselves in the foot. They are not about to offer you hi speed > production > machines that cost next to nothing and cost next to nothing to > operate, while > they can still sell laser colour and it's supplies at much greater > margins. But > that is all about to change now that memjet is proceeding full speed > ahead. > > I put this experiment together about 6 years ago at home until I felt > comfortable enough to bring it into my shop and put it into real > life testing. > I began producing colour in house with the very same orders I was > producing > on either laser or offset. It was a mere six months into selling > colour from the > technology I put together and the positive feedback I was getting > from my > clients that convinced me to get rid of my press and laser. I have > been exclusively > producing full colour from these self made units ever since and have > never looked > back, and yes ... full colour envelopes included. > > What have I been able to accomplish with this ? > > No more skilled labour, no more chemicals, better more accurate full > colour > reproductions than laser and most offset, extremely low machine > overhead, > extremely low supply costs, the ability to run full colour at speeds > I choose from > 10 a minute to 120 a minute or more should I need more. I can't > even factor in > my machine costs or ink costs as they are just to low. > > Do the machines I use have limitations: > > Yes, as with any technology. I stay away from producing 100% full > coverage on > lower grade papers. The appearance of the prints on ordinary papers > are more like > offset without the shine you may get from oil based inks and some > laser colour machines. > To overcome these limitations I must run higher grade papers. > > I'm a small shop owner, as many of you already know and a typical > day for me is sitting > in front of a computer in the front office of the store, designing > almost all of the products > I produce and then hitting file/print and sending the jobs off in > behind me to a hidden > from public veiw room where my uniquely designed machines are all > sitting. It is normal > for me to produce sets business cards, letterheads or envelopes in > full colour within an hour > from being given the go ahead from the client. I often let the > products sit for a day just > because I don't want my customers to expect this all the time! > > What is becoming foreign to me now about this printowners list and > some of the questions > commonly posted here are .... "Where can I get full colour envelopes > produced?" .... > "What should I be charging for press washups?" .... "What are you > click charges for colour?" > etc etc > > All I can say is, keep an eye open on what's coming. Will memjet > based products show up > in 2008? ... possible. Will they show up by 2009 ... likley. > > Regards, > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From paula at curryprint.com Fri Feb 1 06:21:18 2008 From: paula at curryprint.com (Paula Smith) Date: Fri Feb 1 07:22:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. In-Reply-To: <200801311640.m0VGe8Sf015377@i2bnetworks.com> References: <47A1F45F.9080905@sugarloafprint.com> <200801311640.m0VGe8Sf015377@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <002101c864c4$91a5f800$9701a8c0@curry.local> Hi, Scott: I am still getting my feet wet with LinkedIn...what is the boorish behavior you've alluded to? TIA! Paula Smith Curry Printing & Copy Center 314 North Charles Street Baltimore, Maryland 21201 410.685.2679 410.685.1018 fax www.curryprint.com paula@curryprint.com "IMPOSSIBLE DEADLINES MET" > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners- > bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 11:36 AM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > Well, I've meaning to get around to this, and > since I have an hour before my first meeting this > morning, now is about as good a time as any. > > LinkedIn is.....Facebook for business people. > > It is the fastest growing social network for > business people and allows you to connect with others and stay connected. > > I have invited many on this list to join my > network, some have responded and joined, others > have not, one guy refused (maybe he'll change his mind). > > If you would like to join my network and I > haven't asked you, sent me a private email and > I'll invite you in, which will require you to > establish an account. Its free, has excellent > privacy controls and has paid version upgrades > with gives you more visibility and flexibility. > > Here is the power.... > > Once you are in my network, I have my account set > to allow you to see my other connections, and > then when you look up their profile, and you want > them to be in your network, you send them an > invite, and if they accept, and they have their > account set up for you to see their connections, you can (most do) > > Its all about degrees of separation. > > So you build a foundation for connections. If you > see someone who is connected to someone you want > to meet, you ask for an online introduction from > your connection to the one you want to connect to. And so on and so on. > > If you are in sales...its golden. You will be > able to access more people you want to meet than you can dream. > > But their is an etiquette that must be followed > or you will be perceived as boorish. > > Google LinkedIn and read about it. > > It is the most powerful sales tool that I have > deployed since that other thing I won't talk about. > > Once you join me network, check out the > recommendations I've received from others. I alluded to this a few days > ago. > > There is no more powerful tool I have in the > sales process, then to show prospects I meet with > for the first time, what others have to say about > their experience working with my company. > > One more thing...read this http://tinyurl.com/yvyktp > > Thats enough for now, maybe more later..... > > S. > > > > > At 08:16 AM 1/31/2008, you wrote: > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > >I'm getting a bunch of invites to join, I gather > >it's like FaceBook but for us old folks. > > > >-- > >Ron Sardo > >Sugarloaf Print Shop > >mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > >www.sugarloafprint.com > >570-788-5099 . Fax: 570-788-6077 > > > >_______________________________________________ > >PrintOwners Discussion List > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2840 (20080131) Information __________ > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > >http://www.eset.com > > > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From smc at sorrentomesa.com Fri Feb 1 08:08:42 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Fri Feb 1 08:13:34 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. In-Reply-To: <002101c864c4$91a5f800$9701a8c0@curry.local> References: <47A1F45F.9080905@sugarloafprint.com> <200801311640.m0VGe8Sf015377@i2bnetworks.com> <002101c864c4$91a5f800$9701a8c0@curry.local> Message-ID: <200802011313.m11DD8qO029153@i2bnetworks.com> I think this describes it much better than I could: http://tinyurl.com/99t46 S. At 03:21 AM 2/1/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Hi, Scott: > >I am still getting my feet wet with LinkedIn...what is the boorish behavior >you've alluded to? > >TIA! > >Paula Smith >Curry Printing & Copy Center >314 North Charles Street >Baltimore, Maryland 21201 >410.685.2679 >410.685.1018 fax >www.curryprint.com >paula@curryprint.com >"IMPOSSIBLE DEADLINES MET" > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners- > > bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > > Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 11:36 AM > > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > > > > Well, I've meaning to get around to this, and > > since I have an hour before my first meeting this > > morning, now is about as good a time as any. > > > > LinkedIn is.....Facebook for business people. > > > > It is the fastest growing social network for > > business people and allows you to connect with others and stay connected. > > > > I have invited many on this list to join my > > network, some have responded and joined, others > > have not, one guy refused (maybe he'll change his mind). > > > > If you would like to join my network and I > > haven't asked you, sent me a private email and > > I'll invite you in, which will require you to > > establish an account. Its free, has excellent > > privacy controls and has paid version upgrades > > with gives you more visibility and flexibility. > > > > Here is the power.... > > > > Once you are in my network, I have my account set > > to allow you to see my other connections, and > > then when you look up their profile, and you want > > them to be in your network, you send them an > > invite, and if they accept, and they have their > > account set up for you to see their connections, you can (most do) > > > > Its all about degrees of separation. > > > > So you build a foundation for connections. If you > > see someone who is connected to someone you want > > to meet, you ask for an online introduction from > > your connection to the one you want to connect to. And so on and so on. > > > > If you are in sales...its golden. You will be > > able to access more people you want to meet than you can dream. > > > > But their is an etiquette that must be followed > > or you will be perceived as boorish. > > > > Google LinkedIn and read about it. > > > > It is the most powerful sales tool that I have > > deployed since that other thing I won't talk about. > > > > Once you join me network, check out the > > recommendations I've received from others. I alluded to this a few days > > ago. > > > > There is no more powerful tool I have in the > > sales process, then to show prospects I meet with > > for the first time, what others have to say about > > their experience working with my company. > > > > One more thing...read this http://tinyurl.com/yvyktp > > > > Thats enough for now, maybe more later..... > > > > S. > > > > > > > > > > At 08:16 AM 1/31/2008, you wrote: > > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > >Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > > >I'm getting a bunch of invites to join, I gather > > >it's like FaceBook but for us old folks. > > > > > >-- > > >Ron Sardo > > >Sugarloaf Print Shop > > >mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > > >www.sugarloafprint.com > > >570-788-5099 . Fax: 570-788-6077 > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > >PrintOwners Discussion List > > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2840 (20080131) Information __________ > > > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > > >http://www.eset.com > > > > > > > _____________________________________________ > > > > Scott Cappel > > > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > > 7398 Trade Street > > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > > 858-527-0800 > > 858-527-1740 FAX > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > > > Direct Links for Learning: > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2843 (20080201) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From paula at curryprint.com Fri Feb 1 08:20:52 2008 From: paula at curryprint.com (Paula Smith) Date: Fri Feb 1 08:21:48 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. In-Reply-To: <200802011313.m11DD8qO029153@i2bnetworks.com> References: <47A1F45F.9080905@sugarloafprint.com><200801311640.m0VGe8Sf015377@i2bnetworks.com><002101c864c4$91a5f800$9701a8c0@curry.local> <200802011313.m11DD8qO029153@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <005701c864d5$4621efe0$9701a8c0@curry.local> Perfect, thanks Scott!! Paula Smith Curry Printing & Copy Center 314 North Charles Street Baltimore, Maryland 21201 410.685.2679 410.685.1018 fax www.curryprint.com paula@curryprint.com "IMPOSSIBLE DEADLINES MET" > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners- > bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 8:09 AM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > I think this describes it much better than I could: > > http://tinyurl.com/99t46 > > S. > > > > At 03:21 AM 2/1/2008, you wrote: > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >Hi, Scott: > > > >I am still getting my feet wet with LinkedIn...what is the boorish > behavior > >you've alluded to? > > > >TIA! > > > >Paula Smith > >Curry Printing & Copy Center > >314 North Charles Street > >Baltimore, Maryland 21201 > >410.685.2679 > >410.685.1018 fax > >www.curryprint.com > >paula@curryprint.com > >"IMPOSSIBLE DEADLINES MET" > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners- > > > bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > > > Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 11:36 AM > > > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > > > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, I've meaning to get around to this, and > > > since I have an hour before my first meeting this > > > morning, now is about as good a time as any. > > > > > > LinkedIn is.....Facebook for business people. > > > > > > It is the fastest growing social network for > > > business people and allows you to connect with others and stay > connected. > > > > > > I have invited many on this list to join my > > > network, some have responded and joined, others > > > have not, one guy refused (maybe he'll change his mind). > > > > > > If you would like to join my network and I > > > haven't asked you, sent me a private email and > > > I'll invite you in, which will require you to > > > establish an account. Its free, has excellent > > > privacy controls and has paid version upgrades > > > with gives you more visibility and flexibility. > > > > > > Here is the power.... > > > > > > Once you are in my network, I have my account set > > > to allow you to see my other connections, and > > > then when you look up their profile, and you want > > > them to be in your network, you send them an > > > invite, and if they accept, and they have their > > > account set up for you to see their connections, you can (most do) > > > > > > Its all about degrees of separation. > > > > > > So you build a foundation for connections. If you > > > see someone who is connected to someone you want > > > to meet, you ask for an online introduction from > > > your connection to the one you want to connect to. And so on and so > on. > > > > > > If you are in sales...its golden. You will be > > > able to access more people you want to meet than you can dream. > > > > > > But their is an etiquette that must be followed > > > or you will be perceived as boorish. > > > > > > Google LinkedIn and read about it. > > > > > > It is the most powerful sales tool that I have > > > deployed since that other thing I won't talk about. > > > > > > Once you join me network, check out the > > > recommendations I've received from others. I alluded to this a few > days > > > ago. > > > > > > There is no more powerful tool I have in the > > > sales process, then to show prospects I meet with > > > for the first time, what others have to say about > > > their experience working with my company. > > > > > > One more thing...read this http://tinyurl.com/yvyktp > > > > > > Thats enough for now, maybe more later..... > > > > > > S. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At 08:16 AM 1/31/2008, you wrote: > > > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > > > >Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > > > > >I'm getting a bunch of invites to join, I gather > > > >it's like FaceBook but for us old folks. > > > > > > > >-- > > > >Ron Sardo > > > >Sugarloaf Print Shop > > > >mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > > > >www.sugarloafprint.com > > > >570-788-5099 . Fax: 570-788-6077 > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > >PrintOwners Discussion List > > > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2840 (20080131) Information __________ > > > > > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > > > >http://www.eset.com > > > > > > > > > > _____________________________________________ > > > > > > Scott Cappel > > > > > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > > > 7398 Trade Street > > > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > > > 858-527-0800 > > > 858-527-1740 FAX > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > > > > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > > > > > Direct Links for Learning: > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > > > > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > > > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > > > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > > > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > > > > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >PrintOwners Discussion List > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2843 (20080201) Information __________ > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > >http://www.eset.com > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From jdaghir at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 08:49:23 2008 From: jdaghir at gmail.com (Jeff Daghir) Date: Fri Feb 1 08:49:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <8CA3275EC601732-E00-A4B@webmail-da07.sysops.aol.com> References: <00ad01c8642d$0fff61c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <00db01c8645c$33404d00$0b01a8c0@CharXP> <8CA3275EC601732-E00-A4B@webmail-da07.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <83d5b9620802010549r39924588qaeb860796f57e7ff@mail.gmail.com> Actually something similar to this technology was at Graph Expo. HP had their CM8000 series high-speed inkjet printer at Graph Expo last year. They utilize an 8.5" wide inkjet head to hit speeds of up to 70 ppm. Here's a link to HP's info about the CM8000 series: http://tinyurl.com/2du3z9 I spent about a half-hour at the booth playing with the machine and talking to the product manager. Here's what I had to say about it after the show: "HP had their new high-speed inkjet at the show - the HP CM8060 with Edgline Technology. Very, very interesting - blazing fast for an inkjet. Averages around 60 ppm, with up to 72 ppm. Like most inkjets the speed varies with the total ink coverage. Uses CMYK inks plus a clear primer that it lays down before the inks. It can print on most normal uncoated stocks and some uncoated ones. Like other inkjets heavy stocks and textured stocks are no problem. They were printing on some heavily textured almost cloth-like stock at the show. And because there's no fuser you don't have problems with dry, wavy, statically charged output. Color doesn't vary at all. Color output was like most other inkjets - mediocre at high speeds, stunning at low speeds. Since it's an inkjet it has a wider color gamut than a press or a color copier but it has trouble with graininess in light screens. The machine is mechanically pretty simple - basically just paper transport and the imaging head. It's aimed solely at the office market right now - not print for pay. The large capacity stacker can only accept 8.5x11. 11x17 has to go through the bypass tray which is limited to about 50 sheets. And it only has a low power embedded rip with PCL and emulated PostScript. They don't really have a service contract available for it and your ink costs will vary with coverage. And its print head is only 8.5" inches wide so it runs 8.5x11 portrait through the machine. When it does 11x17 it has to shift the head sideways and make 2 passes to completely cover 11" wide paper, so 11x17 runs almost 1/4 the speed of letter. But the product manager I spoke to was very keen to hear what changes/improvements I thought would be necessary for it to be acceptable to the print for pay market. I think this technology is worth watching very closely as it neatly bypasses many of the inherent disadvantages of toner-based copiers. Improving the paper handling and the rip are basically slam-dunks because HP can simply transplant technology from existing copiers. If they can widen the print head and improve the ink/paper compatibility I think there is a very real possibility this technology could completely replace toner-based copiers in 5-7 years." -- Jeff Daghir MPS Printing, Inc. "The Ink & Paper People" Madison, IN www.mpsprinting.com jeff_daghir@mpsprinting.com Tommy said: > I know if I would of seen this technology at Graph Expo, there would of been a buzz in our conference referencing this technology.? That booth would have been in possible to not be seen.? Still very curious to see this in action. From swiftyprinting at mac.com Fri Feb 1 09:45:30 2008 From: swiftyprinting at mac.com (Chuck) Date: Fri Feb 1 09:47:07 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <83d5b9620802010549r39924588qaeb860796f57e7ff@mail.gmail.com> References: <00ad01c8642d$0fff61c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <00db01c8645c$33404d00$0b01a8c0@CharXP> <8CA3275EC601732-E00-A4B@webmail-da07.sysops.aol.com> <83d5b9620802010549r39924588qaeb860796f57e7ff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1005ADCA-B378-490C-9B48-7E7F410FE459@mac.com> On Feb 1, 2008, at 8:49 AM, Jeff Daghir wrote: > I think there > is a very real possibility this technology could completely replace > toner-based copiers in 5-7 years." What it will come down to, as it has with toner/ oil versus toner/wax, is how much it costs to produce the supplies to feed these machines. This is critical to the manufactures because this is where they make the money. The lower they can bring the costs dow to produce the ink, then the more profit per impression. This is the driving force. It is the main reason we have gone from fuser oil based toner to wax based toner machines. It is simply cheaper to make the wax base toner. Don't be fooled that the paper is not "damaged". It is just damaged in a different way than toner based. Instead of heat it is moisture (liquid). The fibers once again change and new finishing problems arise. When liquid touches dry the size of the dry changes (stretch/ shrink). Our problems do not go away. Also watch the paper companies. They will be the key to knowing when this technology is ready. Chuck Pappas Arlington Swifty Printing 1386 Massachusetts Avenue Arlington, MA 02476 781-646-8700 www.arlingtonswifty.com Member: National Association of Quick Printers Print Industry of New England GATF Adobe Service Network Quark Alliance Microsoft Publisher Provider From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 10:15:48 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Fri Feb 1 10:17:00 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology References: <00ad01c8642d$0fff61c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><00db01c8645c$33404d00$0b01a8c0@CharXP><8CA3275EC601732-E00-A4B@webmail-da07.sysops.aol.com><83d5b9620802010549r39924588qaeb860796f57e7ff@mail.gmail.com> <1005ADCA-B378-490C-9B48-7E7F410FE459@mac.com> Message-ID: <002601c864e5$5407e0f0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> >> I think there >> is a very real possibility this technology could completely replace >> toner-based copiers in 5-7 years." WAYNE: It's already here! I am proof of that. I suspect things to really change our industry in 2009. Don't sign any 3-5 year leases! > What it will come down to, as it has with toner/ oil versus toner/wax, > is how much it costs to produce the supplies to feed these machines. This > is critical to the manufactures because this is where they make the > money. The lower they can bring the costs dow to produce the ink, then > the more profit per impression. This is the driving force. It is the main > reason we have gone from fuser oil based toner to wax based toner > machines. It is simply cheaper to make the wax base toner. WAYNE: There is no such thing as fuser oil based toner. Oil and the electrostatic xerographic process do not mix. The reson for wax based toner is to reduce the expense of fuser components. No fuser oil needed, not as much heat required and most importantly it prolongs the life of fuser components as well as reducing the cost to make the heat rollers. > Don't be fooled that the paper is not "damaged". It is just damaged in a > different way than toner based. Instead of heat it is moisture (liquid). > The fibers once again change and new finishing problems arise. When > liquid touches dry the size of the dry changes (stretch/ shrink). Our > problems do not go away. WAYNE: The size of one picoliter ink droplets on paper not only substantially reduces the amount of ink needed, it also has little affect on the paper fibers and thus has no affect on finishing. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > Chuck Pappas > Arlington Swifty Printing > 1386 Massachusetts Avenue > Arlington, MA 02476 > 781-646-8700 > www.arlingtonswifty.com > Member: National Association of Quick Printers > Print Industry of New England > GATF > Adobe Service Network > Quark Alliance > Microsoft Publisher Provider > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From swiftyprinting at mac.com Fri Feb 1 10:43:40 2008 From: swiftyprinting at mac.com (Chuck) Date: Fri Feb 1 10:44:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <002601c864e5$5407e0f0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> References: <00ad01c8642d$0fff61c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <00db01c8645c$33404d00$0b01a8c0@CharXP> <8CA3275EC601732-E00-A4B@webmail-da07.sysops.aol.com> <83d5b9620802010549r39924588qaeb860796f57e7ff@mail.gmail.com> <1005ADCA-B378-490C-9B48-7E7F410FE459@mac.com> <002601c864e5$5407e0f0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: <71B6EB20-B136-4724-A546-84083F596257@mac.com> On Feb 1, 2008, at 10:15 AM, wrote: > There is no such thing as fuser oil based toner. Oil and the > electrostatic xerographic process do not mix. The reson for wax > based toner is to > reduce the expense of fuser components. No fuser oil needed, not as > much heat required and most importantly it prolongs the life of > fuser components > as well as reducing the cost to make the heat rollers. I did not mean the oil is in the toner, I am talking about the processes: There are 2 process: 1) Toner base that uses a fuser that contains fuser oil 2) Toner base that uses wax within the toner mix and requires no fuser oil in the fuser. Chuck Pappas Arlington Swifty Printing 1386 Massachusetts Avenue Arlington, MA 02476 781-646-8700 www.arlingtonswifty.com Member: National Association of Quick Printers Print Industry of New England GATF Adobe Service Network Quark Alliance Microsoft Publisher Provider From robin at protypeonline.com Fri Feb 1 10:57:59 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Fri Feb 1 10:58:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Carlson Craft Wedding Album Message-ID: <04AA8977-D33A-43E5-B21E-25574F56463A@protypeonline.com> Anybody still dealing with wedding albums and have a current CC album and dealership. I need help. You can contact me directly so the list doesn't get clogged up. :) robin p.s. LET IT SNOW -- 10+" and still coming down....and of course BLOWING. Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From char at themasterspress.com Fri Feb 1 11:18:23 2008 From: char at themasterspress.com (Charlene Sims) Date: Fri Feb 1 11:18:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <200802010457.m114v11U062017@i2bnetworks.com> References: <00ad01c8642d$0fff61c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><00db01c8645c$33404d00$0b01a8c0@CharXP><595C76DC63BE481B86ACEFF9ABA39F1B@BEDROOM> <200802010457.m114v11U062017@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <007801c864ee$18313050$0b01a8c0@CharXP> One of the things for the last year I have been thinking about is the incredible ink jet market. There are so many companies now that are growing by leaps and bounds selling this ink. And the manufacturers like, HP, Epson, Canon etc do not move on the prices. I think we all know that it can't cost $18.00 to make a little bitty cartage that goes in your printer and last for a few hundred sheets. So the possibilities that this is affording can be mind boggling. If our customers can buy a machine and print for that much less than we can even print it much less sell it - it will indeed change the face of our industry. We can talk about the quality issue but the reality is the customer will accept things even at a lesser quality just like they did the 300 dpi HP lasers that last forever. Just sure makes me wonder - I guess what no one really knows in this world - where will we be even in two years from now. Just plain flat scary. Now I don't even want to get in the ink jet business. Maybe John Stewart and I can open a computer technical consulting business. :-) ch Charlene Sims The Master's Press, Inc 14550 Midway Road Dallas, Tx 75244 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 char@themasterspress.com www.themasterspress.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 10:53 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I was reading an article from Frank Romano a few weeks ago, here is the link to the digital version http://tinyurl.com/2rkqp7 Apparently Frank thinks this year's Drupa will be Inkjet Drupa where technology like Memjet has the potential to eventually displace the current digital and litho technologies we all use today. Wayne, you just may be ahead of the curve on this one. S. From John at mpcny.com Fri Feb 1 11:36:25 2008 From: John at mpcny.com (John Henry) Date: Fri Feb 1 11:36:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Please do not use LinkedIn In-Reply-To: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <001601c864f0$96958890$c3c099b0$@com> Please do not use this service. Just like when the web was a new thing and other things S has used to separate himself. I have applied some of the things S does and with WORK they will open new doors for you. You see we get better results the less our competition knows and uses this type of networking. With type of networking your area is virtual so we all are competition to a greater or lesser degree. So please do not use this and stop listening to anything S says. John M. Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company 125-129 East First Street Oswego, New York 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 Fax www.mpcny.com John@mpcny.com No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1254 - Release Date: 1/31/2008 8:30 PM From smc at sorrentomesa.com Fri Feb 1 11:43:39 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Fri Feb 1 11:48:27 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Please do not use LinkedIn In-Reply-To: <001601c864f0$96958890$c3c099b0$@com> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <001601c864f0$96958890$c3c099b0$@com> Message-ID: <200802011648.m11Gm48I069240@i2bnetworks.com> Nice profile John, very original. S. At 08:36 AM 2/1/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Please do not use this service. Just like when the web was a new thing and >other things S has used to separate himself. I have applied some of the >things S does and with WORK they will open new doors for you. > >You see we get better results the less our competition knows and uses this >type of networking. With type of networking your area is virtual so we all >are competition to a greater or lesser degree. > >So please do not use this and stop listening to anything S says. > >John M. Henry >Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company >125-129 East First Street >Oswego, New York 13126 >(315) 343-3531 >(315) 343-3577 Fax >www.mpcny.com >John@mpcny.com > >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1254 - Release Date: 1/31/2008 >8:30 PM > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 12:24:58 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Fri Feb 1 12:25:20 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] The REAL cost of inkjet ink ! $$$ References: <00ad01c8642d$0fff61c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><00db01c8645c$33404d00$0b01a8c0@CharXP><595C76DC63BE481B86ACEFF9ABA39F1B@BEDROOM><200802010457.m114v11U062017@i2bnetworks.com> <007801c864ee$18313050$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Message-ID: <005701c864f7$5f0ac460$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Can I pull a John Stewart and play with numbers? 1 Imperial gallon = 4 546.09188 ml A Canon colour ink cartridge is 13ml at about the cost of $20 each X 4 ( CMYK ) would cost you about $80 for every 280 prints you make. Not the way to make money if you are trying to sell colour! About 28 cents worth of ink per copy! Therefore, a gallon of Canon colour ink if bought one cartridge at a time would cost you $6993.84 or about $28,000.00 for all 4 gallons. Fortunately I deal with a lab that produces inkjet inks and pay $40 per gallon. So I have figured out a way to print full colour pages at .00082 cents worth of ink at 5% coverage! The Lab is also making a profit so we can all imagine what the true cost of inkjet ink is. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > One of the things for the last year I have been thinking about is the > incredible ink jet market. There are so many companies now that are > growing > by leaps and bounds selling this ink. And the manufacturers like, HP, > Epson, Canon etc do not move on the prices. I think we all know that it > can't cost $18.00 to make a little bitty cartage that goes in your printer > and last for a few hundred sheets. > > So the possibilities that this is affording can be mind boggling. If our > customers can buy a machine and print for that much less than we can even > print it much less sell it - it will indeed change the face of our > industry. > We can talk about the quality issue but the reality is the customer will > accept things even at a lesser quality just like they did the 300 dpi HP > lasers that last forever. > > Just sure makes me wonder - I guess what no one really knows in this > world - > where will we be even in two years from now. Just plain flat scary. Now > I > don't even want to get in the ink jet business. Maybe John Stewart and I > can open a computer technical consulting business. :-) > ch > > Charlene Sims > > The Master's Press, Inc > 14550 Midway Road > Dallas, Tx 75244 > 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 > char@themasterspress.com > www.themasterspress.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 10:53 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > I was reading an article from Frank Romano a few weeks ago, here is > the link to the digital version http://tinyurl.com/2rkqp7 > > Apparently Frank thinks this year's Drupa will be Inkjet Drupa where > technology like Memjet has the potential to eventually displace the > current digital and litho technologies we all use today. > > Wayne, you just may be ahead of the curve on this one. > > S. > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From John at mpcny.com Fri Feb 1 12:25:40 2008 From: John at mpcny.com (John Henry) Date: Fri Feb 1 12:25:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> Wayne how many cpm and units per month are doing? We know your smaller, how many can you produce per hour? Char Kodak has positioned they new products as costing 50-75% less in ink cost. They did the whole Trump apprentice show based on that. Kodak and others have bull's-eye on making this market work and all will have products showing at Drupa. Do count toner out. They also make loads on money on it. The future is it will cost less than .01 for color and BW toner, at some point less. The big 3 know this and will make profits to the new inkjet take market place then reduce. I am told Kodak and Xerox are both about to announced lower cost per copy on the igen and nexpress. John M. Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company 125-129 East First Street Oswego, New York 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 Fax www.mpcny.com John@mpcny.com We are an Adobe Authorized Service Provider Microsoft Publisher Service Provider We offer the Oswego area's only full service mailing for First, Second and Standard Class mailings. We handle everything from concept... to printing...to mailing! Ask us how YOU can SAVE money!!! -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of printowners-request@printweb.org Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 10:17 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 2 Send PrintOwners mailing list submissions to printowners@printweb.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to printowners-request@printweb.org You can reach the person managing the list at printowners-owner@printweb.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of PrintOwners digest..." ***** This is a PrintOwners List Digest ***** Today's Topics: 1. RE: Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. (Scott Cappel) 2. RE: Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. (Paula Smith) 3. Re: New High Speed Ink Jet Technology (Jeff Daghir) 4. Re: New High Speed Ink Jet Technology (Chuck) 5. Re: New High Speed Ink Jet Technology (Wayne) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2008 05:08:42 -0800 From: Scott Cappel Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Message-ID: <200802011313.m11DD8qO029153@i2bnetworks.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed I think this describes it much better than I could: http://tinyurl.com/99t46 S. At 03:21 AM 2/1/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Hi, Scott: > >I am still getting my feet wet with LinkedIn...what is the boorish behavior >you've alluded to? > >TIA! > >Paula Smith >Curry Printing & Copy Center >314 North Charles Street >Baltimore, Maryland 21201 >410.685.2679 >410.685.1018 fax >www.curryprint.com >paula@curryprint.com >"IMPOSSIBLE DEADLINES MET" > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners- > > bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > > Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 11:36 AM > > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > > > > Well, I've meaning to get around to this, and > > since I have an hour before my first meeting this > > morning, now is about as good a time as any. > > > > LinkedIn is.....Facebook for business people. > > > > It is the fastest growing social network for > > business people and allows you to connect with others and stay connected. > > > > I have invited many on this list to join my > > network, some have responded and joined, others > > have not, one guy refused (maybe he'll change his mind). > > > > If you would like to join my network and I > > haven't asked you, sent me a private email and > > I'll invite you in, which will require you to > > establish an account. Its free, has excellent > > privacy controls and has paid version upgrades > > with gives you more visibility and flexibility. > > > > Here is the power.... > > > > Once you are in my network, I have my account set > > to allow you to see my other connections, and > > then when you look up their profile, and you want > > them to be in your network, you send them an > > invite, and if they accept, and they have their > > account set up for you to see their connections, you can (most do) > > > > Its all about degrees of separation. > > > > So you build a foundation for connections. If you > > see someone who is connected to someone you want > > to meet, you ask for an online introduction from > > your connection to the one you want to connect to. And so on and so on. > > > > If you are in sales...its golden. You will be > > able to access more people you want to meet than you can dream. > > > > But their is an etiquette that must be followed > > or you will be perceived as boorish. > > > > Google LinkedIn and read about it. > > > > It is the most powerful sales tool that I have > > deployed since that other thing I won't talk about. > > > > Once you join me network, check out the > > recommendations I've received from others. I alluded to this a few days > > ago. > > > > There is no more powerful tool I have in the > > sales process, then to show prospects I meet with > > for the first time, what others have to say about > > their experience working with my company. > > > > One more thing...read this http://tinyurl.com/yvyktp > > > > Thats enough for now, maybe more later..... > > > > S. > > > > > > > > > > At 08:16 AM 1/31/2008, you wrote: > > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > >Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > > >I'm getting a bunch of invites to join, I gather > > >it's like FaceBook but for us old folks. > > > > > >-- > > >Ron Sardo > > >Sugarloaf Print Shop > > >mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > > >www.sugarloafprint.com > > >570-788-5099 . Fax: 570-788-6077 > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > >PrintOwners Discussion List > > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2840 (20080131) Information __________ > > > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > > >http://www.eset.com > > > > > > > _____________________________________________ > > > > Scott Cappel > > > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > > 7398 Trade Street > > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > > 858-527-0800 > > 858-527-1740 FAX > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > > > Direct Links for Learning: > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2843 (20080201) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2008 08:20:52 -0500 From: "Paula Smith" Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Message-ID: <005701c864d5$4621efe0$9701a8c0@curry.local> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Perfect, thanks Scott!! Paula Smith Curry Printing & Copy Center 314 North Charles Street Baltimore, Maryland 21201 410.685.2679 410.685.1018 fax www.curryprint.com paula@curryprint.com "IMPOSSIBLE DEADLINES MET" > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners- > bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 8:09 AM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > I think this describes it much better than I could: > > http://tinyurl.com/99t46 > > S. > > > > At 03:21 AM 2/1/2008, you wrote: > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >Hi, Scott: > > > >I am still getting my feet wet with LinkedIn...what is the boorish > behavior > >you've alluded to? > > > >TIA! > > > >Paula Smith > >Curry Printing & Copy Center > >314 North Charles Street > >Baltimore, Maryland 21201 > >410.685.2679 > >410.685.1018 fax > >www.curryprint.com > >paula@curryprint.com > >"IMPOSSIBLE DEADLINES MET" > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners- > > > bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > > > Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 11:36 AM > > > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > > > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, I've meaning to get around to this, and > > > since I have an hour before my first meeting this > > > morning, now is about as good a time as any. > > > > > > LinkedIn is.....Facebook for business people. > > > > > > It is the fastest growing social network for > > > business people and allows you to connect with others and stay > connected. > > > > > > I have invited many on this list to join my > > > network, some have responded and joined, others > > > have not, one guy refused (maybe he'll change his mind). > > > > > > If you would like to join my network and I > > > haven't asked you, sent me a private email and > > > I'll invite you in, which will require you to > > > establish an account. Its free, has excellent > > > privacy controls and has paid version upgrades > > > with gives you more visibility and flexibility. > > > > > > Here is the power.... > > > > > > Once you are in my network, I have my account set > > > to allow you to see my other connections, and > > > then when you look up their profile, and you want > > > them to be in your network, you send them an > > > invite, and if they accept, and they have their > > > account set up for you to see their connections, you can (most do) > > > > > > Its all about degrees of separation. > > > > > > So you build a foundation for connections. If you > > > see someone who is connected to someone you want > > > to meet, you ask for an online introduction from > > > your connection to the one you want to connect to. And so on and so > on. > > > > > > If you are in sales...its golden. You will be > > > able to access more people you want to meet than you can dream. > > > > > > But their is an etiquette that must be followed > > > or you will be perceived as boorish. > > > > > > Google LinkedIn and read about it. > > > > > > It is the most powerful sales tool that I have > > > deployed since that other thing I won't talk about. > > > > > > Once you join me network, check out the > > > recommendations I've received from others. I alluded to this a few > days > > > ago. > > > > > > There is no more powerful tool I have in the > > > sales process, then to show prospects I meet with > > > for the first time, what others have to say about > > > their experience working with my company. > > > > > > One more thing...read this http://tinyurl.com/yvyktp > > > > > > Thats enough for now, maybe more later..... > > > > > > S. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At 08:16 AM 1/31/2008, you wrote: > > > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > > > >Can someone tell me about LinkedIn. > > > > > > > >I'm getting a bunch of invites to join, I gather > > > >it's like FaceBook but for us old folks. > > > > > > > >-- > > > >Ron Sardo > > > >Sugarloaf Print Shop > > > >mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > > > >www.sugarloafprint.com > > > >570-788-5099 . Fax: 570-788-6077 > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > >PrintOwners Discussion List > > > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2840 (20080131) Information __________ > > > > > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > > > >http://www.eset.com > > > > > > > > > > _____________________________________________ > > > > > > Scott Cappel > > > > > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > > > 7398 Trade Street > > > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > > > 858-527-0800 > > > 858-527-1740 FAX > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > > > > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > > > > > Direct Links for Learning: > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > > > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > > > > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > > > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > > > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > > > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > > > > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >PrintOwners Discussion List > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2843 (20080201) Information __________ > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > >http://www.eset.com > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2008 08:49:23 -0500 From: "Jeff Daghir" Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Message-ID: <83d5b9620802010549r39924588qaeb860796f57e7ff@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Actually something similar to this technology was at Graph Expo. HP had their CM8000 series high-speed inkjet printer at Graph Expo last year. They utilize an 8.5" wide inkjet head to hit speeds of up to 70 ppm. Here's a link to HP's info about the CM8000 series: http://tinyurl.com/2du3z9 I spent about a half-hour at the booth playing with the machine and talking to the product manager. Here's what I had to say about it after the show: "HP had their new high-speed inkjet at the show - the HP CM8060 with Edgline Technology. Very, very interesting - blazing fast for an inkjet. Averages around 60 ppm, with up to 72 ppm. Like most inkjets the speed varies with the total ink coverage. Uses CMYK inks plus a clear primer that it lays down before the inks. It can print on most normal uncoated stocks and some uncoated ones. Like other inkjets heavy stocks and textured stocks are no problem. They were printing on some heavily textured almost cloth-like stock at the show. And because there's no fuser you don't have problems with dry, wavy, statically charged output. Color doesn't vary at all. Color output was like most other inkjets - mediocre at high speeds, stunning at low speeds. Since it's an inkjet it has a wider color gamut than a press or a color copier but it has trouble with graininess in light screens. The machine is mechanically pretty simple - basically just paper transport and the imaging head. It's aimed solely at the office market right now - not print for pay. The large capacity stacker can only accept 8.5x11. 11x17 has to go through the bypass tray which is limited to about 50 sheets. And it only has a low power embedded rip with PCL and emulated PostScript. They don't really have a service contract available for it and your ink costs will vary with coverage. And its print head is only 8.5" inches wide so it runs 8.5x11 portrait through the machine. When it does 11x17 it has to shift the head sideways and make 2 passes to completely cover 11" wide paper, so 11x17 runs almost 1/4 the speed of letter. But the product manager I spoke to was very keen to hear what changes/improvements I thought would be necessary for it to be acceptable to the print for pay market. I think this technology is worth watching very closely as it neatly bypasses many of the inherent disadvantages of toner-based copiers. Improving the paper handling and the rip are basically slam-dunks because HP can simply transplant technology from existing copiers. If they can widen the print head and improve the ink/paper compatibility I think there is a very real possibility this technology could completely replace toner-based copiers in 5-7 years." -- Jeff Daghir MPS Printing, Inc. "The Ink & Paper People" Madison, IN www.mpsprinting.com jeff_daghir@mpsprinting.com Tommy said: > I know if I would of seen this technology at Graph Expo, there would of been a buzz in our conference referencing this technology.? That booth would have been in possible to not be seen.? Still very curious to see this in action. ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2008 09:45:30 -0500 From: Chuck Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Message-ID: <1005ADCA-B378-490C-9B48-7E7F410FE459@mac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes On Feb 1, 2008, at 8:49 AM, Jeff Daghir wrote: > I think there > is a very real possibility this technology could completely replace > toner-based copiers in 5-7 years." What it will come down to, as it has with toner/ oil versus toner/wax, is how much it costs to produce the supplies to feed these machines. This is critical to the manufactures because this is where they make the money. The lower they can bring the costs dow to produce the ink, then the more profit per impression. This is the driving force. It is the main reason we have gone from fuser oil based toner to wax based toner machines. It is simply cheaper to make the wax base toner. Don't be fooled that the paper is not "damaged". It is just damaged in a different way than toner based. Instead of heat it is moisture (liquid). The fibers once again change and new finishing problems arise. When liquid touches dry the size of the dry changes (stretch/ shrink). Our problems do not go away. Also watch the paper companies. They will be the key to knowing when this technology is ready. Chuck Pappas Arlington Swifty Printing 1386 Massachusetts Avenue Arlington, MA 02476 781-646-8700 www.arlingtonswifty.com Member: National Association of Quick Printers Print Industry of New England GATF Adobe Service Network Quark Alliance Microsoft Publisher Provider ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2008 10:15:48 -0500 From: "Wayne" Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Message-ID: <002601c864e5$5407e0f0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response >> I think there >> is a very real possibility this technology could completely replace >> toner-based copiers in 5-7 years." WAYNE: It's already here! I am proof of that. I suspect things to really change our industry in 2009. Don't sign any 3-5 year leases! > What it will come down to, as it has with toner/ oil versus toner/wax, > is how much it costs to produce the supplies to feed these machines. This > is critical to the manufactures because this is where they make the > money. The lower they can bring the costs dow to produce the ink, then > the more profit per impression. This is the driving force. It is the main > reason we have gone from fuser oil based toner to wax based toner > machines. It is simply cheaper to make the wax base toner. WAYNE: There is no such thing as fuser oil based toner. Oil and the electrostatic xerographic process do not mix. The reson for wax based toner is to reduce the expense of fuser components. No fuser oil needed, not as much heat required and most importantly it prolongs the life of fuser components as well as reducing the cost to make the heat rollers. > Don't be fooled that the paper is not "damaged". It is just damaged in a > different way than toner based. Instead of heat it is moisture (liquid). > The fibers once again change and new finishing problems arise. When > liquid touches dry the size of the dry changes (stretch/ shrink). Our > problems do not go away. WAYNE: The size of one picoliter ink droplets on paper not only substantially reduces the amount of ink needed, it also has little affect on the paper fibers and thus has no affect on finishing. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > Chuck Pappas > Arlington Swifty Printing > 1386 Massachusetts Avenue > Arlington, MA 02476 > 781-646-8700 > www.arlingtonswifty.com > Member: National Association of Quick Printers > Print Industry of New England > GATF > Adobe Service Network > Quark Alliance > Microsoft Publisher Provider > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 2 ****************************************** No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1254 - Release Date: 1/31/2008 8:30 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1254 - Release Date: 1/31/2008 8:30 PM From sos at olympus.net Fri Feb 1 13:03:55 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Fri Feb 1 13:04:22 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> Message-ID: <040001c864fc$cf825320$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Kodak has positioned they new products as costing 50-75% less in ink > cost. ================ OCE Videostream, I think it was called, is on the market with a duty cycle of 60,000,000 Sixty million copies per month. Article in American Printer magazine I was reading, not very carefully, I was watching Lost at the time, last night. This technology is out there, although not aimed at small printshops yet. I remember seeing the big roll fed inkjet printers at Graph Expo last year but not paying much attention to them or the huge mail handling machines, since they wouldn't physically fit in my building. Nor do I have any need of such high volume equipment. It was fun to watch the Heidelberg XL105 run as well, but I won't be buying one. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 13:24:33 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Fri Feb 1 13:24:49 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> Message-ID: <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> > Wayne how many cpm and units per month are doing? We know your smaller, > how > many can you produce per hour? Whatever I want ... there is no limit to my setup. 120 per minute is enough for me to complete the work I have. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net From tufelkinder at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 13:30:04 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Fri Feb 1 13:30:42 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 1, 2008 1:24 PM, Wayne wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > Wayne how many cpm and units per month are doing? We know your smaller, > > how many can you produce per hour? > > > Whatever I want ... there is no limit to my setup. 120 per minute is enough > for me to complete the work I have. Wow... That is truly the most phenomenal thing I've heard in... I can't remember when. What is the specific make/model of the unlimited speed/production machine that you are using? Thanks! Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net 800-955-3902 tufelkinder@gmail.com -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 13:42:50 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Fri Feb 1 13:43:31 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net><003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com><007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <008901c86502$3f7ebe70$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> >> Whatever I want ... there is no limit to my setup. 120 per minute is >> enough >> for me to complete the work I have. > > Wow... That is truly the most phenomenal thing I've heard in... > I can't remember when. What is the specific make/model of > the unlimited speed/production machine that you are using? It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other posts to find out more. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net From cpc at clearnet.net Fri Feb 1 13:44:36 2008 From: cpc at clearnet.net (Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc.) Date: Fri Feb 1 13:45:08 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: <47A36894.8080403@clearnet.net> Wayne, I believe I remember years ago you posting about using cluster printing (similar to the TR system) with several inkjets to accomplish these speeds. Are you using multiple printers to achieve these production speeds? Randy Hurley Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc. 17 South Third Street P.O. Box 23 Clearfield, PA 16830 814-765-4731 Fax: 814-765-1380 cpc@clearnet.net Wayne wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >> Wayne how many cpm and units per month are doing? We know your >> smaller, how >> many can you produce per hour? > > > > Whatever I want ... there is no limit to my setup. 120 per minute is > enough for me to > complete the work I have. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > _______________________________________________ From slb at inkspot.net Fri Feb 1 14:00:09 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:00:46 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Need source In-Reply-To: <040001c864fc$cf825320$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <47A325E9.22920.107026D4@slb.inkspot.net> We're printing menus for a local restaurant. The sample has a plastic piece bound into it that holds four 3.25"x 4" sheet of paper in one vertical column (the menu is 14" tall at the binding). It's used for their "specials." The piece looks a lot like a holder for name badges, and is very similar to the sheets that hold cds or disks in 3- ring binders. The customer wants one bound in with each menu. Any thoughts on a source? I've looked at the office supply store web sites, so far with negative results. TIA, Steve Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From joy at libertyprintgreen.com Fri Feb 1 14:00:17 2008 From: joy at libertyprintgreen.com (Joy Downing) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:05:27 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Need source References: <47A325E9.22920.107026D4@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <00b601c86504$b032e860$1401a8c0@JOY2> I just ordered something similar. Try Rochester 100. Their number is 585-475-0200. Joy Downing Liberty Bowling Green, KY ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Blatman" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 1:00 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] Need source > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > We're printing menus for a local restaurant. The sample has a plastic > piece bound into it that holds four 3.25"x 4" sheet of paper in one > vertical column (the menu is 14" tall at the binding). It's used for > their "specials." The piece looks a lot like a holder for name > badges, and is very similar to the sheets that hold cds or disks in 3- > ring binders. The customer wants one bound in with each menu. > > Any thoughts on a source? I've looked at the office supply store web > sites, so far with negative results. > > TIA, > Steve > > Steve Blatman > Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. > 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA > Tel: 610-647-0776 > Fax: 610-647-4560 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From tufelkinder at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 14:05:06 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:05:49 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <008901c86502$3f7ebe70$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com> <008901c86502$3f7ebe70$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802011105p3a71083u7d734ff90daf8c1a@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 1, 2008 1:42 PM, Wayne wrote: > > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other > posts to find out more. I've been reading your other posts, but unfortunately, aside from a link to the memjet video (which you said you aren't using, and certainly costs well over $49) and a request in July for information about cluster-printing software, I'm unable to find any mention of specific manufacturer or equipment model. Apologies if I'm just not reading closely enough... What's the quality/consistency across 12 printers? What do you utilize to manage color and maintain accuracy? Thanks, Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net 800-955-3902 tufelkinder@gmail.com -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From slb at inkspot.net Fri Feb 1 14:08:05 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:11:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Laser printer dimensional accuracy? In-Reply-To: <47A325E9.22920.107026D4@slb.inkspot.net> References: <040001c864fc$cf825320$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <47A327C5.15447.107769CA@slb.inkspot.net> We've noticed that our HP5100 laser printer is less dimensionally accurate than I'd thought. What seems counterintuitive, though, is that the dimensions seem accurate along the length of the print, but run a bit long across the width. Since the drum doesn't change length as it rotates, I'd expect the opposite. Any thoughts on what's reasonable to expect for dimensional accuracy? Any pointers to a work-around or software solution, if this is normal behavior for laser printers? TIA, Steve Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 14:26:48 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:27:06 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802011126v4a3953eq8b78e22a516efd73@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 1, 2008 1:30 PM, Walt wrote: > > > Whatever I want ... there is no limit to my setup. 120 per minute is > enough > > for me to complete the work I have. > > Wow... That is truly the most phenomenal thing I've heard in... > I can't remember when. What is the specific make/model of > the unlimited speed/production machine that you are using? > I think Wayne already said that he built it himself.. The technology, however, since Wayne appears to be "first to market" with it (even though it's a market of one), is "xeroidography." Very impressive all around. Hey Wayne -- how 'bout posting some pictures of this beast (and the beast in action) on that "other" list? > > -- > Michael Vogel > Sir Speedy Printing > 9 Research Drive > Milford, CT 06460 > tel 203-877-1231 > fax 203-878-2679 > mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com > www.eSirSpeedy.com > ==================================== > Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to > criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. > ~Lord Bacon From brianoday at eprint.us Fri Feb 1 14:34:53 2008 From: brianoday at eprint.us (Brian O'Day) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:37:04 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Please do not use LinkedIn In-Reply-To: <001601c864f0$96958890$c3c099b0$@com> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <001601c864f0$96958890$c3c099b0$@com> Message-ID: <008a01c86509$84b75ea0$800101df@eprint.local> John Could you enlighten me as to why one would want to use LinkedIn although you thinks we shouldn't! I have received a few of their invitations but usually say no, however I did say yes when s asked me to join but I still don't understand this service. Brian O'Day ePrint 9970 SW Greenburg Rd Portland, Oregon brianoday@eprint.us 503-684-2679 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of John Henry Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 8:36 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Please do not use LinkedIn Importance: High ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Please do not use this service. Just like when the web was a new thing and other things S has used to separate himself. I have applied some of the things S does and with WORK they will open new doors for you. You see we get better results the less our competition knows and uses this type of networking. With type of networking your area is virtual so we all are competition to a greater or lesser degree. So please do not use this and stop listening to anything S says. John M. Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company 125-129 East First Street Oswego, New York 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 Fax www.mpcny.com John@mpcny.com No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1254 - Release Date: 1/31/2008 8:30 PM _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From brianoday at eprint.us Fri Feb 1 14:39:41 2008 From: brianoday at eprint.us (Brian O'Day) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:41:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Please do not use LinkedIn In-Reply-To: <200802011648.m11Gm48I069240@i2bnetworks.com> References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net><001601c864f0$96958890$c3c099b0$@com> <200802011648.m11Gm48I069240@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <008b01c8650a$30582320$800101df@eprint.local> Sorry for the last post I just read down and see there are great explanations already. Thanks Brian O'Day ePrint 9970 SW Greenburg Rd Portland, Oregon brianoday@eprint.us 503-684-2679 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 8:44 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Please do not use LinkedIn ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Nice profile John, very original. S. At 08:36 AM 2/1/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Please do not use this service. Just like when the web was a new thing and >other things S has used to separate himself. I have applied some of the >things S does and with WORK they will open new doors for you. > >You see we get better results the less our competition knows and uses this >type of networking. With type of networking your area is virtual so we all >are competition to a greater or lesser degree. > >So please do not use this and stop listening to anything S says. > >John M. Henry >Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company >125-129 East First Street >Oswego, New York 13126 >(315) 343-3531 >(315) 343-3577 Fax >www.mpcny.com >John@mpcny.com > >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1254 - Release Date: 1/31/2008 >8:30 PM > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From kevin at proprinters.ca Fri Feb 1 14:43:57 2008 From: kevin at proprinters.ca (Kevin at PRO Printers) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:44:16 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing source in India Message-ID: <00b801c8650a$c8ed6aa0$1f00a8c0@promerivale1> I have a regular client in need of some relatively simple black and white output in India. (Typically we do less than twenty copies of three or four pdf documents consisting of anywhere from a dozen pages or up to over 600 pages, so less than 10,000 copies total) I spent several minutes on Google to no avail. I would like to recommend him to one of the print franchises that may have branches there but come up empty. Can anyone help? Kevin Kerr Imprimeurs PRO Printers Inc. 1900 Merivale Rd. Ottawa, ON K2G 4N4 Tel 613-727-9444 Fax 613-727-1945 kevin@proprinters.ca www.proprinters.ca From printian at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 14:46:16 2008 From: printian at gmail.com (Ian Franks) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:46:41 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Laser printer dimensional accuracy? In-Reply-To: <47A327C5.15447.107769CA@slb.inkspot.net> References: <040001c864fc$cf825320$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47A325E9.22920.107026D4@slb.inkspot.net> <47A327C5.15447.107769CA@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: Steve We are have the same problems on kimoleks also known as laser positives. The paper prints are fine. We are now running them as paper and not board it is better. On 01/02/2008, Steve Blatman wrote: > > We've noticed that our HP5100 laser printer is less dimensionally > accurate than I'd thought. What seems counterintuitive, though, is > that the dimensions seem accurate along the length of the print, but > run a bit long across the width. Since the drum doesn't change length > as it rotates, I'd expect the opposite. > > Any thoughts on what's reasonable to expect for dimensional accuracy? > > Any pointers to a work-around or software solution, if this is normal > behavior for laser printers? > -- Regards Ian Franks Print Image 3 Corlett Drive, Illovo, JHB Ph 011 447 3133 Fax 011 447 0642 sales@printimage.co.za www.printimage.co.za From jacemeister at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 14:52:41 2008 From: jacemeister at gmail.com (Jace Prejean) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:53:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Large Format Job Message-ID: Would anyone be interested in giving me a price to print and fold a brochure? Trim size is 11" x 24.5" tri-folded to 8.5" x 11". It's 4/4 on 80# Enamel Gloss Cover. I will provide digital file. I used to print these in-house but sold my 4-up press last year. BTW, it's one of a series so color match and consistency are important. TIA --- Jace Prejean Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc 922 Sunset Ave Houma, LA 70360 Phone 985-868-8273 www.BayouPrinting.com From mail at myprinter.biz Fri Feb 1 14:54:00 2008 From: mail at myprinter.biz (mail@myprinter.biz) Date: Fri Feb 1 14:55:44 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <98f5b19a0802011126v4a3953eq8b78e22a516efd73@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: "Hey Wayne -- how 'bout posting some pictures of this beast (and the beast in action) on that "other" list?" Michael Vogel Michael - Based on what I've read so far, Wayne's printer is so fast that all you'd see is a blur. Dan Sir Speedy Printing Center 5845 Hollywood Boulevard Hollywood, FL 33021 tel. 954.962.1309 fax 954.962.1366 dan@myprinter.biz www.myprinter.biz -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org]On Behalf Of Michael Vogel Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 2:27 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** On Feb 1, 2008 1:30 PM, Walt wrote: > > > Whatever I want ... there is no limit to my setup. 120 per minute is > enough > > for me to complete the work I have. > > Wow... That is truly the most phenomenal thing I've heard in... > I can't remember when. What is the specific make/model of > the unlimited speed/production machine that you are using? > I think Wayne already said that he built it himself.. The technology, however, since Wayne appears to be "first to market" with it (even though it's a market of one), is "xeroidography." Very impressive all around. Hey Wayne -- how 'bout posting some pictures of this beast (and the beast in action) on that "other" list? > > -- > Michael Vogel > Sir Speedy Printing > 9 Research Drive > Milford, CT 06460 > tel 203-877-1231 > fax 203-878-2679 > mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com > www.eSirSpeedy.com > ==================================== > Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to > criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. > ~Lord Bacon _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From slb at inkspot.net Fri Feb 1 15:02:10 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Fri Feb 1 15:11:18 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Need source In-Reply-To: <00b601c86504$b032e860$1401a8c0@JOY2> Message-ID: <47A33472.221.10A8ED66@slb.inkspot.net> Thanks for pointing them out to me. Unfortunately, this would be a custom job for them. They suggested H Risch, but I don't see what I need there, either. Any other suggestions, anyone? TIA, Steve > > I just ordered something similar. Try Rochester 100. Their number is > 585-475-0200. > > Joy Downing > Liberty > Bowling Green, KY > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Steve Blatman" > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 1:00 PM > Subject: [PrintOwners] Need source > > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > We're printing menus for a local restaurant. The sample has a plastic > > piece bound into it that holds four 3.25"x 4" sheet of paper in one > > vertical column (the menu is 14" tall at the binding). It's used for > > their "specials." The piece looks a lot like a holder for name > > badges, and is very similar to the sheets that hold cds or disks in 3- > > ring binders. The customer wants one bound in with each menu. > > > > Any thoughts on a source? I've looked at the office supply store web > > sites, so far with negative results. > > > > TIA, > > Steve > > > > Steve Blatman > > Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. > > 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA > > Tel: 610-647-0776 > > Fax: 610-647-4560 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From cpc at clearnet.net Fri Feb 1 15:17:31 2008 From: cpc at clearnet.net (Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc.) Date: Fri Feb 1 15:17:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Laser printer dimensional accuracy? In-Reply-To: <47A327C5.15447.107769CA@slb.inkspot.net> References: <040001c864fc$cf825320$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47A327C5.15447.107769CA@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <47A37E5B.5050909@clearnet.net> Steve, We have the HP LaserJet 8100 and it is extremely accurate for a laser printer. This printer is nearly nine years old and has about 500,000 copies on it. I just drew a 10"x16" box on a 11x17 document page in Indesign and printed it on 20# commodity copy paper. The printed box measures 9 31/32" x 16". Try turning off any resolution enhancement or level of grays enhancement in the print dialog box and see it your accuracy improves. Randy Hurley Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc. 17 South Third Street P.O. Box 23 Clearfield, PA 16830 814-765-4731 Fax: 814-765-1380 cpc@clearnet.net Steve Blatman wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >We've noticed that our HP5100 laser printer is less dimensionally >accurate than I'd thought. What seems counterintuitive, though, is >that the dimensions seem accurate along the length of the print, but >run a bit long across the width. Since the drum doesn't change length >as it rotates, I'd expect the opposite. > >Any thoughts on what's reasonable to expect for dimensional accuracy? > >Any pointers to a work-around or software solution, if this is normal >behavior for laser printers? > >TIA, >Steve > > From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 15:43:29 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Fri Feb 1 15:42:41 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com><007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A36894.8080403@clearnet.net> Message-ID: <532ED0BAF2F148AD926C310305135351@BEDROOM> > Wayne, > > I believe I remember years ago you posting about using cluster printing > (similar to the TR system) with several inkjets to accomplish these > speeds. Are you using multiple printers to achieve these production > speeds? Yes indeed ... multiple engines. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net From digitalgraphics at sbcglobal.net Fri Feb 1 15:46:42 2008 From: digitalgraphics at sbcglobal.net (Chris Barton) Date: Fri Feb 1 15:46:49 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling us YOU'VE created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the guys pumping MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring to market? That is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per sheet and runs at 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive about any real details regarding what you have... I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right now.....you know what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? Chris Barton Digital Color Graphics, Inc. 3209 W. Warner Avenue Santa Ana, CA 92704 (714) 241-8443 www.digitalcolorgraphics.com > > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other > posts to find out more. ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 ****************************************** No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 9:59 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 9:59 AM From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 16:01:12 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Fri Feb 1 15:59:41 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net><003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com><007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com><008901c86502$3f7ebe70$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <84f70d5e0802011105p3a71083u7d734ff90daf8c1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > I've been reading your other posts, but unfortunately, aside > from a link to the memjet video (which you said you aren't > using, and certainly costs well over $49) and a request in > July for information about cluster-printing software, I'm unable > to find any mention of specific manufacturer or equipment > model. Apologies if I'm just not reading closely enough... > > What's the quality/consistency across 12 printers? What > do you utilize to manage color and maintain accuracy? Memjet based products should hit the market in the $300 per engine range for speeds of 60 per minute for a machine that will do 8.5 X 14. What I have today is something I built myself, so you will not find these anywhere else. The quality and consistency is excellent. It's all in the ink you run through the engines. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net From kellycrom at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 16:09:59 2008 From: kellycrom at gmail.com (Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:10:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> Message-ID: <008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> For one who has 3 different desktop inkjet printers that I print certain projects on a regular basis, I can see how it is feasible. Let me make some assumptions/observations from what Wayne has already posted. 1. He is using off-the-shelf desktop color inkjet printers(ie canon, epson, but probably not HP because of their horrendous paper path) 2. He is using a bulk/continuous ink supply system(see here for example www.continuousink.com - it's a UK site but you'll get the idea) to save on the outrageous cost of those tiny ink cartridges. And 3. He has purchased or programmed a software package that allows all of the printers to be seen as one device(or that is why he was checking into TR System cluster printing a while back). Although, all you would really have to do is send the file individually to each printer. It is a plausible system, and the quality and speed of inexpensive desktop inkjets has gotten dramatically better over the last few years. As long as you are using the same printers, inks, and drivers for each of the multiple printers/engines, color consistency should not be a problem. Maybe I'll clear out a room and set up my own(someday). Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Chris Barton > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 2:47 PM > To: printowners@printweb.org > Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling > us YOU'VE > created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the > guys pumping > MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring > to market? That > is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per > sheet and runs at > 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive > about any real > details regarding what you have... > > I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right > now.....you know > what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... > > Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? > > Chris Barton > > > > > Digital Color Graphics, Inc. > 3209 W. Warner Avenue > Santa Ana, CA 92704 > > (714) 241-8443 > > www.digitalcolorgraphics.com > > > > > > > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put > together, > > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are > > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to > > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other > > posts to find out more. > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 > ****************************************** > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release > Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release > Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 16:12:29 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:11:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> Message-ID: <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> > Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? That has certainly crossed my mind. Think what you may .... but I am certainly telling you the truth. If your asking me to simply disclose all the details of what I have .... it isn't going to happen for obvious reasons. But with a little research, and determination, you may be able to figure out what I have years ago. This isn't the first time I have brought this to the attention of the list. Several years ago I hinted on this very same topic, but sceptics like yourself just laughed it off. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > Chris Barton > > > > > Digital Color Graphics, Inc. > 3209 W. Warner Avenue > Santa Ana, CA 92704 > > (714) 241-8443 > > www.digitalcolorgraphics.com > > > >> >> It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, >> starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are >> linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to >> produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other >> posts to find out more. > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 > ****************************************** > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From tufelkinder at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 16:12:12 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:12:42 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net> <003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com> <007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com> <008901c86502$3f7ebe70$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <84f70d5e0802011105p3a71083u7d734ff90daf8c1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802011312x4cb442dk15cc49a803c26594@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 1, 2008 4:01 PM, xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > What I have today is something I built > myself, so you will not find these anywhere else. He previously wrote: > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, > starting with $49 print engines... Wayne, I'm just curious where you were able to purchase the print engines for $49 or are you saying you built them yourself for that money? Did you code the software yourself or is it a commercial package? Also, are you saying that if you use the correct inks, the system requires no color management at all to maintain perfect consistency/accuracy? Thanks, Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net 800-955-3902 tufelkinder@gmail.com -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 16:17:38 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:17:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802011317j29db5090w259070a71db86590@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 1, 2008 3:46 PM, Chris Barton wrote: > > Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling us YOU'VE > created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the guys pumping > MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring to market? That > is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per sheet and runs at > 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive about any real > details regarding what you have... > > I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right now..... I don't know, Chris. It sounds a whole lot more plausible than it did at first glance. I'm getting a picture of a bunch of small inkets, strung together with cluster-printing software, with they key being refillable printheads and access to the inks in bulk, the way the inkhead mfgrs get it before adding their enormous markups. The "Gillette model" of ongoing high-margin consumables falls apart when one has true wholesale access to them. But it's hard to image that Wayne's is a scalable scenario, as it would require the industry to find a way to make up for its lost margin -- to gain what? -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From slb at inkspot.net Fri Feb 1 16:16:40 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:18:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Laser printer dimensional accuracy? In-Reply-To: <47A37E5B.5050909@clearnet.net> References: <47A327C5.15447.107769CA@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <47A345E8.13093.10ED2240@slb.inkspot.net> Randy, Thanks. I hadn't thought of that. I expected the dimension to be off along the length of the copy, because of imprecision in roller traction, or whatever. I couldn't think of what would cause what I'm actually getting, which is inaccuracy across the width of the print. The resolution enhancement might be the culprit. Steve > > Steve, > > We have the HP LaserJet 8100 and it is extremely accurate for a laser > printer. This printer is nearly nine years old and has about 500,000 > copies on it. I just drew a 10"x16" box on a 11x17 document page in > Indesign and printed it on 20# commodity copy paper. The printed box > measures 9 31/32" x 16". > > Try turning off any resolution enhancement or level of grays enhancement > in the print dialog box and see it your accuracy improves. > > Randy Hurley > Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc. > 17 South Third Street > P.O. Box 23 > Clearfield, PA 16830 > 814-765-4731 > Fax: 814-765-1380 > cpc@clearnet.net > > Steve Blatman wrote: > > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >We've noticed that our HP5100 laser printer is less dimensionally > >accurate than I'd thought. What seems counterintuitive, though, is > >that the dimensions seem accurate along the length of the print, but > >run a bit long across the width. Since the drum doesn't change length > >as it rotates, I'd expect the opposite. > > > >Any thoughts on what's reasonable to expect for dimensional accuracy? > > > >Any pointers to a work-around or software solution, if this is normal > >behavior for laser printers? > > > >TIA, > >Steve > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From kevin at proprinters.ca Fri Feb 1 16:19:33 2008 From: kevin at proprinters.ca (Kevin at PRO Printers) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:19:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <010601c86518$23c67bd0$1f00a8c0@promerivale1> Hey, Wayne. I'm only a couple of hours away up in Ottawa. (That would be about 5 hours on a day like today!) How about I drive down to Kingston next week and check out your system? I'm not technically knowledgeable enough to steal your ideas, but I would love to report back to the list that what you have works as advertised. Kevin Kerr Imprimeurs PRO Printers Inc. 1900 Merivale Rd. Ottawa, ON K2G 4N4 Tel 613-727-9444 Fax 613-727-1945 kevin@proprinters.ca www.proprinters.ca ----- Original Message ----- From: "xeroid" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:12 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >> Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? > > That has certainly crossed my mind. > > Think what you may .... but I am certainly telling you the truth. If your > asking me to simply disclose all the details of what I have .... it isn't > going to happen for obvious reasons. But with a little research, and > determination, you may be able to figure out what I have years ago. > > This isn't the first time I have brought this to the attention of the > list. > Several years ago I hinted on this very same topic, but sceptics like > yourself just laughed it off. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > >> Chris Barton >> >> >> >> >> Digital Color Graphics, Inc. >> 3209 W. Warner Avenue >> Santa Ana, CA 92704 >> >> (714) 241-8443 >> >> www.digitalcolorgraphics.com >> >> >> >>> >>> It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, >>> starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are >>> linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to >>> produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other >>> posts to find out more. >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 >> ****************************************** >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: >> 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: >> 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 16:32:30 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:31:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: Kelly, you are close ... The site www.continuousink.com you point out is using mass produced products from china and they simply are not good enough. Almost everything you will find on the net is just not reliable enough. I have been fine tuning my project over the past few years and am fortunate to have had the Engineering Department at a local University study and improve upon areas of my system I felt needed it. You are right, same print engines, same ink, produces consistant results across the entire set up. Picking out a PMS colour is a matter of simply selecting it. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:09 PM Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > For one who has 3 different desktop inkjet printers that I print certain > projects on a regular basis, I can see how it is feasible. > Let me make some assumptions/observations from what Wayne has already > posted. > 1. He is using off-the-shelf desktop color inkjet printers(ie canon, > epson, > but probably not HP because of their horrendous paper path) > 2. He is using a bulk/continuous ink supply system(see here for example > www.continuousink.com - it's a UK site but you'll get the idea) to save on > the outrageous cost of those tiny ink cartridges. > And > 3. He has purchased or programmed a software package that allows all of > the > printers to be seen as one device(or that is why he was checking into TR > System cluster printing a while back). Although, all you would really have > to do is send the file individually to each printer. > > It is a plausible system, and the quality and speed of inexpensive desktop > inkjets has gotten dramatically better over the last few years. As long as > you are using the same printers, inks, and drivers for each of the > multiple > printers/engines, color consistency should not be a problem. > > Maybe I'll clear out a room and set up my own(someday). > > > > Kelly Crom > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > > We've Moved!!! > 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 > Plymouth, MN 55441 > New Phone: (763)231-6970 > kellycrom@gmail.com > www.applied-graphics.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Chris Barton >> Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 2:47 PM >> To: printowners@printweb.org >> Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling >> us YOU'VE >> created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the >> guys pumping >> MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring >> to market? That >> is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per >> sheet and runs at >> 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive >> about any real >> details regarding what you have... >> >> I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right >> now.....you know >> what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... >> >> Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? >> >> Chris Barton >> >> >> >> >> Digital Color Graphics, Inc. >> 3209 W. Warner Avenue >> Santa Ana, CA 92704 >> >> (714) 241-8443 >> >> www.digitalcolorgraphics.com >> >> >> >> > >> > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put >> together, >> > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are >> > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to >> > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other >> > posts to find out more. >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 >> ****************************************** >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release >> Date: 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release >> Date: 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From sos at olympus.net Fri Feb 1 16:31:31 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:32:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> Message-ID: <048701c86519$cfe6b410$6900a8c0@DANIEL> > Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? =================== That same thought has crossed my mind. Did you notice he has them hidden in a back room. Does the name Rube Goldberg come to mind. If it works, it works though. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From kellycrom at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 16:37:51 2008 From: kellycrom at gmail.com (Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:38:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: <008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Thought so... My big question is how do you handle printing on gloss/enamel papers with aqueous based inks? Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of xeroid > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 3:33 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Kelly, you are close ... > > The site www.continuousink.com you point out is using mass > produced products > from china and they simply are not good enough. Almost > everything you will > find on the net is just not reliable enough. I have been > fine tuning my > project over the past few years and am fortunate to have had > the Engineering > Department at a local University study and improve upon areas > of my system I > felt needed it. > > You are right, same print engines, same ink, produces > consistant results > across the entire set up. Picking out a PMS colour is a > matter of simply > selecting it. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics" > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:09 PM > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > For one who has 3 different desktop inkjet printers that I > print certain > > projects on a regular basis, I can see how it is feasible. > > Let me make some assumptions/observations from what Wayne > has already > > posted. > > 1. He is using off-the-shelf desktop color inkjet > printers(ie canon, > > epson, > > but probably not HP because of their horrendous paper path) > > 2. He is using a bulk/continuous ink supply system(see here > for example > > www.continuousink.com - it's a UK site but you'll get the > idea) to save on > > the outrageous cost of those tiny ink cartridges. > > And > > 3. He has purchased or programmed a software package that > allows all of > > the > > printers to be seen as one device(or that is why he was > checking into TR > > System cluster printing a while back). Although, all you > would really have > > to do is send the file individually to each printer. > > > > It is a plausible system, and the quality and speed of > inexpensive desktop > > inkjets has gotten dramatically better over the last few > years. As long as > > you are using the same printers, inks, and drivers for each of the > > multiple > > printers/engines, color consistency should not be a problem. > > > > Maybe I'll clear out a room and set up my own(someday). > > > > > > > > Kelly Crom > > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > > > > We've Moved!!! > > 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 > > Plymouth, MN 55441 > > New Phone: (763)231-6970 > > kellycrom@gmail.com > > www.applied-graphics.com > > > > > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Chris Barton > >> Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 2:47 PM > >> To: printowners@printweb.org > >> Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > >> > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >> > >> Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling > >> us YOU'VE > >> created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the > >> guys pumping > >> MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring > >> to market? That > >> is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per > >> sheet and runs at > >> 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive > >> about any real > >> details regarding what you have... > >> > >> I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right > >> now.....you know > >> what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... > >> > >> Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? > >> > >> Chris Barton > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Digital Color Graphics, Inc. > >> 3209 W. Warner Avenue > >> Santa Ana, CA 92704 > >> > >> (714) 241-8443 > >> > >> www.digitalcolorgraphics.com > >> > >> > >> > >> > > >> > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put > >> together, > >> > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per > minute and are > >> > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to > >> > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other > >> > posts to find out more. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------ > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> PrintOwners Discussion List > >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >> > >> > >> > >> End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 > >> ****************************************** > >> > >> No virus found in this incoming message. > >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. > >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release > >> Date: 2/1/2008 > >> 9:59 AM > >> > >> > >> No virus found in this outgoing message. > >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. > >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release > >> Date: 2/1/2008 > >> 9:59 AM > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> PrintOwners Discussion List > >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 16:40:31 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:38:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <010601c86518$23c67bd0$1f00a8c0@promerivale1> Message-ID: <4BB11978F8EA4E1EAC8117AF09C3639E@BEDROOM> > I'm only a couple of hours away up in Ottawa. (That would be about 5 hours > on a day like today!) How about I drive down to Kingston next week and > check out your system? I'm not technically knowledgeable enough to steal > your ideas, but I would love to report back to the list that what you have > works as advertised. Like I have said in an earlier post, I have my set-up out of view from the public in a closed room in the back of my shop. That's the way I intend to keep it. Read the post from Kelly Crom ..... and then my followup to that post. It's not Rocket Science ! > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > Kevin Kerr > Imprimeurs PRO Printers Inc. > 1900 Merivale Rd. > Ottawa, ON K2G 4N4 > Tel 613-727-9444 > Fax 613-727-1945 > kevin@proprinters.ca > www.proprinters.ca > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "xeroid" > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:12 PM > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> >>> Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? >> >> That has certainly crossed my mind. >> >> Think what you may .... but I am certainly telling you the truth. If >> your >> asking me to simply disclose all the details of what I have .... it isn't >> going to happen for obvious reasons. But with a little research, and >> determination, you may be able to figure out what I have years ago. >> >> This isn't the first time I have brought this to the attention of the >> list. >> Several years ago I hinted on this very same topic, but sceptics like >> yourself just laughed it off. >> >> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >> xeroid@kos.net >> >>> Chris Barton >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Digital Color Graphics, Inc. >>> 3209 W. Warner Avenue >>> Santa Ana, CA 92704 >>> >>> (714) 241-8443 >>> >>> www.digitalcolorgraphics.com >>> >>> >>> >>>> >>>> It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, >>>> starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are >>>> linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to >>>> produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other >>>> posts to find out more. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >>> >>> >>> End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 >>> ****************************************** >>> >>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: >>> 2/1/2008 >>> 9:59 AM >>> >>> >>> No virus found in this outgoing message. >>> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >>> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: >>> 2/1/2008 >>> 9:59 AM >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From tufelkinder at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 16:39:01 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:39:15 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802011339m43802266w3ade2cf5780a352b@mail.gmail.com> Six months ago you were posting asking for software to run a cluster saying you were doing it manually, so it's somewhat unlikely that you've doing this for "years," as you suggest. If I seem skeptical, it's less about the technology and more about the (in)consistency of the story/specs in your posts. Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net 800-955-3902 tufelkinder@gmail.com -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From slb at inkspot.net Fri Feb 1 16:39:03 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:39:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <47A34B27.6183.1101A0BD@slb.inkspot.net> I know there have been issues in the past between Wayne and others on the list. This is not intended in any way to be any part of that. For several years in the mid 1980s, I headed the engineering and design section of a small company making dot-matrix printers, using off-the-shelf print mechanisms. Shortly before I left, HP was trying to interest us in designing a printer around their new ink-jet print- heads. It hadn't happened before I left, but it might have thereafter.... I can imagine buying print mechanisms, hooking them up to bulk ink supplies, coupling them to paper-handling mechanisms, designing and building some fairly simple electronics to handle driving the motors and printheads, and driving everything from a PC or two. If Wayne has a background as a copy-machine tech, and a reasonable ablility to learn electronics and programming from readily available sources, I can imagine that he has a room full of stuff that doesn't look very pretty, needs some skilled tlc to run, and produces printed output very cheaply. Working as a one-man operation with a production facility that looks more like a bunch of experimental prototypes (which is my best guess at what Waye is doing) is a very different thing from developing and testing a saleable product (which is what Memjet and others are doing). I can imagine setting up something similar here, except I want to be able to visit customers and prospects, take vacations, and pay others to do most of the production work, and that's hard to do with pre- production equipment. I might spend a little time this weekend, though, poking around on line to see who sells what kind of printheads..... Then again, maybe I'll just do my IT work, spend some time with my family, and plan next week's sales calls.... Steve > > Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling us YOU'VE > created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the guys pumping > MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring to market? That > is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per sheet and runs at > 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive about any real > details regarding what you have... > > I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right now.....you know > what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... > > Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? > > Chris Barton > > > > > Digital Color Graphics, Inc. > 3209 W. Warner Avenue > Santa Ana, CA 92704 > > (714) 241-8443 > > www.digitalcolorgraphics.com > > > > > > > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, > > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are > > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to > > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other > > posts to find out more. > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 > ****************************************** > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From digitalgraphics at sbcglobal.net Fri Feb 1 16:40:05 2008 From: digitalgraphics at sbcglobal.net (Chris Barton) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:40:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <20080201211107.C3DC2DC6961@rb.enter.net> References: <20080201211107.C3DC2DC6961@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <001601c8651b$03085820$6401a8c0@Chris> My apologies.......I was reading into it that it was printing from a single source....it's been explained to me and I can see how it would work. And YES....I think you should market this to other printers..... Thanks Chris Barton Digital Color Graphics, Inc. 3209 W. Warner Avenue Santa Ana, CA 92704 (714) 241-8443 www.digitalcolorgraphics.com Message: 7 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2008 16:12:29 -0500 From: "xeroid" Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Message-ID: <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="windows-1250"; reply-type=original > Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? That has certainly crossed my mind. Think what you may .... but I am certainly telling you the truth. If your asking me to simply disclose all the details of what I have .... it isn't going to happen for obvious reasons. But with a little research, and determination, you may be able to figure out what I have years ago. This isn't the first time I have brought this to the attention of the list. Several years ago I hinted on this very same topic, but sceptics like yourself just laughed it off. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > Chris Barton > > > > > Digital Color Graphics, Inc. > 3209 W. Warner Avenue > Santa Ana, CA 92704 > > (714) 241-8443 > > www.digitalcolorgraphics.com No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 9:59 AM From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 16:46:46 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:45:04 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: <943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> > Thought so... > > My big question is how do you handle printing on gloss/enamel papers with > aqueous based inks? I don't for the most part, but these types of orders are not common place for me. Special coated Gloss stocks made for these types of inks are available from China 80lb, 5 cents. I use this for when I have requests for the glossy shinny look like Real Estate agents business cards. > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > Kelly Crom > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > > We've Moved!!! > 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 > Plymouth, MN 55441 > New Phone: (763)231-6970 > kellycrom@gmail.com > www.applied-graphics.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of xeroid >> Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 3:33 PM >> To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >> Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Kelly, you are close ... >> >> The site www.continuousink.com you point out is using mass >> produced products >> from china and they simply are not good enough. Almost >> everything you will >> find on the net is just not reliable enough. I have been >> fine tuning my >> project over the past few years and am fortunate to have had >> the Engineering >> Department at a local University study and improve upon areas >> of my system I >> felt needed it. >> >> You are right, same print engines, same ink, produces >> consistant results >> across the entire set up. Picking out a PMS colour is a >> matter of simply >> selecting it. >> >> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >> xeroid@kos.net >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics" >> To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" >> >> Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:09 PM >> Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >> >> >> > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> > >> > For one who has 3 different desktop inkjet printers that I >> print certain >> > projects on a regular basis, I can see how it is feasible. >> > Let me make some assumptions/observations from what Wayne >> has already >> > posted. >> > 1. He is using off-the-shelf desktop color inkjet >> printers(ie canon, >> > epson, >> > but probably not HP because of their horrendous paper path) >> > 2. He is using a bulk/continuous ink supply system(see here >> for example >> > www.continuousink.com - it's a UK site but you'll get the >> idea) to save on >> > the outrageous cost of those tiny ink cartridges. >> > And >> > 3. He has purchased or programmed a software package that >> allows all of >> > the >> > printers to be seen as one device(or that is why he was >> checking into TR >> > System cluster printing a while back). Although, all you >> would really have >> > to do is send the file individually to each printer. >> > >> > It is a plausible system, and the quality and speed of >> inexpensive desktop >> > inkjets has gotten dramatically better over the last few >> years. As long as >> > you are using the same printers, inks, and drivers for each of the >> > multiple >> > printers/engines, color consistency should not be a problem. >> > >> > Maybe I'll clear out a room and set up my own(someday). >> > >> > >> > >> > Kelly Crom >> > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. >> > >> > We've Moved!!! >> > 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 >> > Plymouth, MN 55441 >> > New Phone: (763)231-6970 >> > kellycrom@gmail.com >> > www.applied-graphics.com >> > >> > >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Chris Barton >> >> Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 2:47 PM >> >> To: printowners@printweb.org >> >> Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >> >> >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> >> >> Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling >> >> us YOU'VE >> >> created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the >> >> guys pumping >> >> MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring >> >> to market? That >> >> is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per >> >> sheet and runs at >> >> 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive >> >> about any real >> >> details regarding what you have... >> >> >> >> I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right >> >> now.....you know >> >> what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... >> >> >> >> Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? >> >> >> >> Chris Barton >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Digital Color Graphics, Inc. >> >> 3209 W. Warner Avenue >> >> Santa Ana, CA 92704 >> >> >> >> (714) 241-8443 >> >> >> >> www.digitalcolorgraphics.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put >> >> together, >> >> > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per >> minute and are >> >> > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to >> >> > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other >> >> > posts to find out more. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 >> >> ****************************************** >> >> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release >> >> Date: 2/1/2008 >> >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> >> >> >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release >> >> Date: 2/1/2008 >> >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > PrintOwners Discussion List >> > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From borzou at falconprintandcopy.com Fri Feb 1 16:48:49 2008 From: borzou at falconprintandcopy.com (Borzou Azabdaftari) Date: Fri Feb 1 16:49:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing source in India In-Reply-To: <00b801c8650a$c8ed6aa0$1f00a8c0@promerivale1> References: <00b801c8650a$c8ed6aa0$1f00a8c0@promerivale1> Message-ID: These people target print to export here, but they may be able to help you: Eva Lewis Executive-Exports Manipal Press Limited Udayavani Building 5th floor Manipal-576104, Karnataka India Call me on: +91 93425 11253 Landline: +91 820 2571151-55 (ext 140) Fax: +91 820 2570831 Visit us on: www.manipalpress.com Borzou Azabdaftari Falcon Print and Copy 1921 Gallows Road Suite 150 Vienna, VA 22182 t.703.442.0124 f.703.442.0134 borzou@falconprintandcopy.com On Feb 1, 2008, at 2:43 PM, Kevin at PRO Printers wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I have a regular client in need of some relatively simple black and > white output in India. (Typically we do less than twenty copies of > three or four pdf documents consisting of anywhere from a dozen > pages or up to over 600 pages, so less than 10,000 copies total) I > spent several minutes on Google to no avail. I would like to > recommend him to one of the print franchises that may have branches > there but come up empty. Can anyone help? > > Kevin Kerr > Imprimeurs PRO Printers Inc. > 1900 Merivale Rd. > Ottawa, ON K2G 4N4 > Tel 613-727-9444 > Fax 613-727-1945 > kevin@proprinters.ca > www.proprinters.ca > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From smc at sorrentomesa.com Fri Feb 1 16:59:51 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Fri Feb 1 17:04:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: <943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we currently produce. I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of what I've found here: http://www.discmakers.com I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now we're going to internalize the production. I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on experience regarding this. Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're very happy with the current appearance. Thoughts? TIA S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From kellycrom at gmail.com Fri Feb 1 17:15:27 2008 From: kellycrom at gmail.com (Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics) Date: Fri Feb 1 17:15:40 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY><008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY><943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <009201c8651f$f37287a0$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Scott, You might want to contact Bob Molacek on the list. I know he does this and I believe he said he has a Microboards duplicator. Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:00 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants > us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and > Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we > currently produce. > > I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of > what I've found here: > > http://www.discmakers.com > > I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through > next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. > > These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there > will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we > produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now > we're going to internalize the production. > > I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 > > or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 > > I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on > experience regarding this. > > Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. > > I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're > currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're > very happy with the current appearance. > > Thoughts? > > TIA > > S. > > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From bob at rjmprinting.com Fri Feb 1 17:20:10 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Fri Feb 1 17:21:00 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: Scott, We have been printing and burning discs on these devices for approximately 4 years. We have had three systems. The 1st one had a robotic arm like the one from disc makers. It work okay but ultimately we wore it out. The second system had a carousel system and it didn't work well at all. The system we have know has a stand alone printer(HP). It holds around 50 discs and does a very nice job on the printing. The burning is done on a tower 5 discs at a time. This system is a little more manual but any one can do it. We have it in the graphics area and they just pull the discs off when they walk by and load new discs to be burned. Call Kevin at Techware (952) 944-0083 he is extremely knowledgeable in these systems and sells both types, so he can walk you through the pros and cons of each type. We did $45,000 in burning discs last year not including graphics and disc mailers we print for customers. Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:00 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we currently produce. I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of what I've found here: http://www.discmakers.com I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now we're going to internalize the production. I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on experience regarding this. Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're very happy with the current appearance. Thoughts? TIA S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From bob at rjmprinting.com Fri Feb 1 17:21:27 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Fri Feb 1 17:21:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: <009201c8651f$f37287a0$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: Kelly, You're a correct we do have a Microboards system. Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:15 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Scott, You might want to contact Bob Molacek on the list. I know he does this and I believe he said he has a Microboards duplicator. Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:00 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants > us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and > Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we > currently produce. > > I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of > what I've found here: > > http://www.discmakers.com > > I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through > next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. > > These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there > will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we > produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now > we're going to internalize the production. > > I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 > > or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 > > I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on > experience regarding this. > > Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. > > I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're > currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're > very happy with the current appearance. > > Thoughts? > > TIA > > S. > > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From info at desktopsxm.com Fri Feb 1 17:32:52 2008 From: info at desktopsxm.com (Joel Brint) Date: Fri Feb 1 17:31:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing source in India In-Reply-To: <00b801c8650a$c8ed6aa0$1f00a8c0@promerivale1> References: <00b801c8650a$c8ed6aa0$1f00a8c0@promerivale1> Message-ID: <1FD9EE88-3271-4EAB-838C-1FCBC775A99F@desktopsxm.com> go to affinityexpress.com Joel Brint Desktop Imaging St. Maarten Tel 542-4044 fax 543-1100 "The Printshop with a Difference" On Feb 1, 2008, at 3:43 PM, Kevin at PRO Printers wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I have a regular client in need of some relatively simple black and > white output in India. (Typically we do less than twenty copies of > three or four pdf documents consisting of anywhere from a dozen > pages or up to over 600 pages, so less than 10,000 copies total) I > spent several minutes on Google to no avail. I would like to > recommend him to one of the print franchises that may have branches > there but come up empty. Can anyone help? > > Kevin Kerr > Imprimeurs PRO Printers Inc. > 1900 Merivale Rd. > Ottawa, ON K2G 4N4 > Tel 613-727-9444 > Fax 613-727-1945 > kevin@proprinters.ca > www.proprinters.ca > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From priorityprinting at comcast.net Fri Feb 1 18:22:49 2008 From: priorityprinting at comcast.net (priorityprinting@comcast.net) Date: Fri Feb 1 18:23:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Adhesive for Mounting Posters to Gatorboard Message-ID: <020120082322.13168.47A3A9C90007DABA0000337022007621940902079B02079D9F979B079D01079D9F@comcast.net> As a newbie to wide format printing we have been mounting posters on foam board with an adhesive backing. However, we are finding the material difficult to trim. We would like to try a denser material like gatorboard. Our problem is finding an adhesive to use. We do not have a laminator so any adhesive material which needs to be heat activated is not an option. We have been laminating using the big squeegee which works quite well. Does anyone know of an adhesive we could try? Jeff Farber Priority Printing & Graphics, Inc. 1323 E. Main Street Flushing, MI 48433 810 487-1700 From ahavens at sbcglobal.net Fri Feb 1 18:25:40 2008 From: ahavens at sbcglobal.net (Havens Printing and Copy Shop) Date: Fri Feb 1 18:25:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Laser printer dimensional accuracy? References: <47A327C5.15447.107769CA@slb.inkspot.net> <47A345E8.13093.10ED2240@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <015601c86529$c2d850c0$0301a8c0@Leah> If you are running 11x17 long grain, there will be some shrinkage on the 11" dimension because of heat/drying of paper fibers. In the old days on single color, large offset presses, we had to contend with stretch or shrink across the grain in multiple color work. That is why we ran the paper landscape and long grain. On a 23x35" sheet short grain, the paper would change on the 35" way and with long grain it changed on the 23" way. I'm thinking you are having the same thing with high heat, only it shrinks instead of stretching. If you can get some 17x11 (short grain) and try the same 10x16" test run, you might find the 16" side shrinking. Austin Havens, Owner Havens Printing & Copy Shop 200 N Main McPherson, KS 67460 620-241-5400 ahavens@sbcglobal.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Blatman" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 3:16 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Laser printer dimensional accuracy? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Randy, > > Thanks. I hadn't thought of that. I expected the dimension to be off > along the length of the copy, because of imprecision in roller > traction, or whatever. I couldn't think of what would cause what I'm > actually getting, which is inaccuracy across the width of the print. > The resolution enhancement might be the culprit. > > Steve > >> >> Steve, >> >> We have the HP LaserJet 8100 and it is extremely accurate for a laser >> printer. This printer is nearly nine years old and has about 500,000 >> copies on it. I just drew a 10"x16" box on a 11x17 document page in >> Indesign and printed it on 20# commodity copy paper. The printed box >> measures 9 31/32" x 16". >> >> Try turning off any resolution enhancement or level of grays enhancement >> in the print dialog box and see it your accuracy improves. >> >> Randy Hurley >> Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc. >> 17 South Third Street >> P.O. Box 23 >> Clearfield, PA 16830 >> 814-765-4731 >> Fax: 814-765-1380 >> cpc@clearnet.net >> >> Steve Blatman wrote: >> >> >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> > >> >We've noticed that our HP5100 laser printer is less dimensionally >> >accurate than I'd thought. What seems counterintuitive, though, is >> >that the dimensions seem accurate along the length of the print, but >> >run a bit long across the width. Since the drum doesn't change length >> >as it rotates, I'd expect the opposite. >> > >> >Any thoughts on what's reasonable to expect for dimensional accuracy? >> > >> >Any pointers to a work-around or software solution, if this is normal >> >behavior for laser printers? >> > >> >TIA, >> >Steve >> > >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> __________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________ >> >> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >> http://www.eset.com >> >> > > Steve Blatman > Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. > 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA > Tel: 610-647-0776 > Fax: 610-647-4560 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > From ahavens at sbcglobal.net Fri Feb 1 18:34:39 2008 From: ahavens at sbcglobal.net (Havens Printing and Copy Shop) Date: Fri Feb 1 18:34:34 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: <017101c8652b$03cced60$0301a8c0@Leah> About a week before Wayne hit the air and got everybody excited, I was studying RISO. They have a stationary print head that allows paper to travel under it and prints CMYK at a rather high speed. I have no idea of quality, but was not surprised and was intrigued with Wayne's idea and the other whose site and name I can't recall. I'm sure going to keep watching, listening and wishing Wayne and any other bright/industrious people the best in their endeavors with this technology. Austin Havens, Owner Havens Printing & Copy Shop 200 N Main McPherson, KS 67460 620-241-5400 ahavens@sbcglobal.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 3:09 PM Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > For one who has 3 different desktop inkjet printers that I print certain > projects on a regular basis, I can see how it is feasible. > Let me make some assumptions/observations from what Wayne has already > posted. > 1. He is using off-the-shelf desktop color inkjet printers(ie canon, > epson, > but probably not HP because of their horrendous paper path) > 2. He is using a bulk/continuous ink supply system(see here for example > www.continuousink.com - it's a UK site but you'll get the idea) to save on > the outrageous cost of those tiny ink cartridges. > And > 3. He has purchased or programmed a software package that allows all of > the > printers to be seen as one device(or that is why he was checking into TR > System cluster printing a while back). Although, all you would really have > to do is send the file individually to each printer. > > It is a plausible system, and the quality and speed of inexpensive desktop > inkjets has gotten dramatically better over the last few years. As long as > you are using the same printers, inks, and drivers for each of the > multiple > printers/engines, color consistency should not be a problem. > > Maybe I'll clear out a room and set up my own(someday). > > > > Kelly Crom > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > > We've Moved!!! > 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 > Plymouth, MN 55441 > New Phone: (763)231-6970 > kellycrom@gmail.com > www.applied-graphics.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Chris Barton >> Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 2:47 PM >> To: printowners@printweb.org >> Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling >> us YOU'VE >> created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the >> guys pumping >> MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring >> to market? That >> is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per >> sheet and runs at >> 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive >> about any real >> details regarding what you have... >> >> I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right >> now.....you know >> what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... >> >> Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? >> >> Chris Barton >> >> >> >> >> Digital Color Graphics, Inc. >> 3209 W. Warner Avenue >> Santa Ana, CA 92704 >> >> (714) 241-8443 >> >> www.digitalcolorgraphics.com >> >> >> >> > >> > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put >> together, >> > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are >> > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to >> > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other >> > posts to find out more. >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 >> ****************************************** >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release >> Date: 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release >> Date: 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: 2/1/2008 > 9:59 AM > > From xeroid at kos.net Fri Feb 1 18:39:46 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Fri Feb 1 18:38:18 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <47A34B27.6183.1101A0BD@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <471BE35113B142C7B511F19328FF31C3@BEDROOM> It's not at all as you imagine. It is no different than running several small digital colour laser printers. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > I know there have been issues in the past between Wayne and others on > the list. This is not intended in any way to be any part of that. > > For several years in the mid 1980s, I headed the engineering and > design section of a small company making dot-matrix printers, using > off-the-shelf print mechanisms. Shortly before I left, HP was trying > to interest us in designing a printer around their new ink-jet print- > heads. It hadn't happened before I left, but it might have > thereafter.... > > I can imagine buying print mechanisms, hooking them up to bulk ink > supplies, coupling them to paper-handling mechanisms, designing and > building some fairly simple electronics to handle driving the motors > and printheads, and driving everything from a PC or two. > > If Wayne has a background as a copy-machine tech, and a reasonable > ablility to learn electronics and programming from readily available > sources, I can imagine that he has a room full of stuff that doesn't > look very pretty, needs some skilled tlc to run, and produces printed > output very cheaply. Working as a one-man operation with a production > facility that looks more like a bunch of experimental prototypes > (which is my best guess at what Waye is doing) is a very different > thing from developing and testing a saleable product (which is what > Memjet and others are doing). > > I can imagine setting up something similar here, except I want to be > able to visit customers and prospects, take vacations, and pay others > to do most of the production work, and that's hard to do with pre- > production equipment. I might spend a little time this weekend, > though, poking around on line to see who sells what kind of > printheads..... > > Then again, maybe I'll just do my IT work, spend some time with my > family, and plan next week's sales calls.... > > Steve > > > > > >> >> Please excuse me if I come off harshly.....but you're telling us YOU'VE >> created a printer that you've been using for YEARS that the guys pumping >> MILLIONS of dollars in R&D have still not been able to bring to market? >> That >> is simple and wonderful and cost's less than a penny per sheet and runs >> at >> 120 per minute? And in all these posts you seem to be evasive about any >> real >> details regarding what you have... >> >> I don't know..... My bullshit meter is pegging out right now.....you know >> what they say....if it sounds too good to be true....... >> >> Why not just produce these for other print shops and get RICH? >> >> Chris Barton >> >> >> >> >> Digital Color Graphics, Inc. >> 3209 W. Warner Avenue >> Santa Ana, CA 92704 >> >> (714) 241-8443 >> >> www.digitalcolorgraphics.com >> >> >> >> > >> > It is a combination of technologies and software I have put together, >> > starting with $49 print engines that do 18 prints per minute and are >> > linked together to achieve any speed you require. My cost to >> > produce a colour page is less than .001 of a cent. Read my other >> > posts to find out more. >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 5 >> ****************************************** >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: >> 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> No virus found in this outgoing message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.18/1255 - Release Date: >> 2/1/2008 >> 9:59 AM >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> __________ NOD32 2844 (20080201) Information __________ >> >> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >> http://www.eset.com >> >> > > Steve Blatman > Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. > 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA > Tel: 610-647-0776 > Fax: 610-647-4560 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From zapit at zapcolor.com Fri Feb 1 19:37:43 2008 From: zapit at zapcolor.com (Eugene Montanez) Date: Fri Feb 1 19:38:04 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] The Power of PrintOwners In-Reply-To: <20080201232602.467C9DC7584@rb.enter.net> References: <20080201232602.467C9DC7584@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: The other day a printer asked me about a dealer in our area and if I would go inspect a piece of equipment. Given that others have done the same for me, I owe it to another printer to return the favor, I think most of us would do the same. Not a ton of money, but cash is cash. I talked to the dealer and the machine was not in the warehouse close to me, so I said I could go next week. Well today I called another dealer friend who advised me(us) the first dealer was in fact a crook. This has saved a ton of time for both of us, and anyone else who might ask. Please remember to ask any of us on the list for a quick question, it could save you thousands of dollars! Have a great weekend, was sunny California, now cloudy, but NO SNOW and the temp is above freezing. Eugene Montanez ZAP Printing & Graphics 127 Radio Rd Corona, CA 92879 951-734-8181 Zapit@zapcolor.com From jgross at techiowa.com Fri Feb 1 20:40:36 2008 From: jgross at techiowa.com (John Gross) Date: Fri Feb 1 20:40:49 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Adhesive for Mounting Posters to Gatorboard References: <020120082322.13168.47A3A9C90007DABA0000337022007621940902079B02079D9F979B079D01079D9F@comcast.net> Message-ID: <000a01c8653c$9c421a00$0201a8c0@JGrossLaptop> Jeff, there are sources for fome or gator with a cold laminate already applied. If you have trouble cutting fomeboard, gator will be impossible. A straight edge and a sharp utility knife does the job. John Gross Technigraphics ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 5:22 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] Adhesive for Mounting Posters to Gatorboard > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > As a newbie to wide format printing we have been mounting posters on foam > board with an adhesive backing. However, we are finding the material > difficult to trim. We would like to try a denser material like > gatorboard. Our problem is finding an adhesive to use. We do not have a > laminator so any adhesive material which needs to be heat activated is not > an option. We have been laminating using the big squeegee which works > quite well. Does anyone know of an adhesive we could try? > > Jeff Farber > Priority Printing & Graphics, Inc. > 1323 E. Main Street > Flushing, MI 48433 > 810 487-1700 > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From swiftyprinting at mac.com Fri Feb 1 15:05:19 2008 From: swiftyprinting at mac.com (Chuck) Date: Sat Feb 2 00:39:38 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <094C7369-1C0A-4C52-8EA4-2C8B795AC26A@mac.com> On Feb 1, 2008, at 2:54 PM, mail@myprinter.biz wrote: > Based on what I've read so far, Wayne's printer is so fast that all > you'd > see is a blur. If you read between the lines, what I see is a bunch of conventional Inkjet printers, running in tandem using bulk ink supplies. Whatever works for you. Chuck Pappas Arlington Swifty Printing 1386 Massachusetts Avenue Arlington, MA 02476 781-646-8700 www.arlingtonswifty.com Member: National Association of Quick Printers Print Industry of New England GATF Adobe Service Network Quark Alliance Microsoft Publisher Provider From swiftyprinting at mac.com Fri Feb 1 17:28:53 2008 From: swiftyprinting at mac.com (Chuck) Date: Sat Feb 2 01:03:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: <009201c8651f$f37287a0$6d01a8c0@KELLY> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> <009201c8651f$f37287a0$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: <6078A15F-E51A-4A25-BB7D-9EAFBC71A445@mac.com> On Feb 1, 2008, at 5:15 PM, Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics wrote: >> We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants >> us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and >> Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we >> currently produce. We do this for a medical testing company. It is a great new line of work to get in to. What I found is printing on the cd is a better way to go. The client prefered it over a label on the cd. It takes time to burn, ... more than the rated speed listed on these devices. I have found that a perfect machine is one which can hold the full amount of my average job. So if my average jobs are 100, I want a machine which can input and output 100. The reason is I need to run the machine when there are no operators around. Running it overnite is a great way to make up time. Also, the medical companies I use it for also need dvds, therefore a burner capable of cd/dvd is important. I found no advantage over a standalone only because there is always a spare or old pc I can dedicate to a device. If you do go with a printer, the cost of the ink is expensive per print. One with 4 carts versus the back and 1 color can save a lot of money. Chuck Pappas Arlington Swifty Printing 1386 Massachusetts Avenue Arlington, MA 02476 781-646-8700 www.arlingtonswifty.com Member: National Association of Quick Printers Print Industry of New England GATF Adobe Service Network Quark Alliance Microsoft Publisher Provider From kevin at abfprints.com Sat Feb 2 01:54:03 2008 From: kevin at abfprints.com (Kevin Danko) Date: Sat Feb 2 01:54:22 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Large Format Job In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00b401c86568$662e1780$0300a8c0@Danko> Be happy to Jace, how many do you need a quote on? Kevin Danko Advantage Business Forms 102 N. Riverside Ave. Rialto, CA 92376 (909) 875-7163 Fax: (909) 875-7971 E-mail: kevin@abfprints.com www.abfprints.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Jace Prejean Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 11:53 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] Large Format Job ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Would anyone be interested in giving me a price to print and fold a brochure? Trim size is 11" x 24.5" tri-folded to 8.5" x 11". It's 4/4 on 80# Enamel Gloss Cover. I will provide digital file. I used to print these in-house but sold my 4-up press last year. BTW, it's one of a series so color match and consistency are important. TIA --- Jace Prejean Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc 922 Sunset Ave Houma, LA 70360 Phone 985-868-8273 www.BayouPrinting.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com Sat Feb 2 10:27:14 2008 From: gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com (Gordon Watt) Date: Sat Feb 2 10:25:28 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] The Power of PrintOwners In-Reply-To: References: <20080201232602.467C9DC7584@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <001301c865b0$165cf760$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> I happen to be the guy Eugene rescued. Eugene is a real stand-up guy in my opinion and I owe him. I hope this message goes through. Thanks a bunch Eugene. Gordon Watt Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Eugene Montanez Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 7:38 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] The Power of PrintOwners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** The other day a printer asked me about a dealer in our area and if I would go inspect a piece of equipment. Given that others have done the same for me, I owe it to another printer to return the favor, I think most of us would do the same. Not a ton of money, but cash is cash. I talked to the dealer and the machine was not in the warehouse close to me, so I said I could go next week. Well today I called another dealer friend who advised me(us) the first dealer was in fact a crook. This has saved a ton of time for both of us, and anyone else who might ask. Please remember to ask any of us on the list for a quick question, it could save you thousands of dollars! Have a great weekend, was sunny California, now cloudy, but NO SNOW and the temp is above freezing. Eugene Montanez ZAP Printing & Graphics 127 Radio Rd Corona, CA 92879 951-734-8181 Zapit@zapcolor.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From kellycrom at gmail.com Sat Feb 2 11:54:41 2008 From: kellycrom at gmail.com (Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics) Date: Sat Feb 2 11:54:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY><008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY><943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <00e801c865bc$4eaf7dc0$6d01a8c0@KELLY> If you decide you want to try printing on the cd/dvd's, and don't want to start with the full expense of an automated printer, you might consider trying one of the desktop inkjets that has cd printing capabilities. I have an Epson R260 that does an excellent job(quality and pretty good speed, even though you have to load them one at a time). I did a job of 100 cd's about a week ago. It took me a few hours to print the cd's, but that was with walking away for other tasks from time to time. I also found a template that I could use so I could make pdfs of the image I wanted and then am able to print directly from Acrobat, rather than the Print CD program that comes with the printer(which only allows the import of tiff/jpeg images). The nice thing about using a printer such as this is you have the separate ink cartridges and don't have to pay the higher prices for the all-in-one color carts. I know printers such as the Primera line of cd printers use somewhat proprietary ink cartridges that could be a nuisance to have to replace often if you had a job that used a lot of only a single color. Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:00 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants > us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and > Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we > currently produce. > > I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of > what I've found here: > > http://www.discmakers.com > > I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through > next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. > > These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there > will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we > produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now > we're going to internalize the production. > > I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 > > or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 > > I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on > experience regarding this. > > Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. > > I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're > currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're > very happy with the current appearance. > > Thoughts? > > TIA > > S. > > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From bob at rjmprinting.com Sat Feb 2 12:03:32 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Sat Feb 2 12:03:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: <00e801c865bc$4eaf7dc0$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: Our system runs cartridges that cost $73 (all four colors) and we get between 190 and 450 CD's per cartridge depending on coverage. The Microboards printer is made by HP and color consistency is very good. Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2008 10:55 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** If you decide you want to try printing on the cd/dvd's, and don't want to start with the full expense of an automated printer, you might consider trying one of the desktop inkjets that has cd printing capabilities. I have an Epson R260 that does an excellent job(quality and pretty good speed, even though you have to load them one at a time). I did a job of 100 cd's about a week ago. It took me a few hours to print the cd's, but that was with walking away for other tasks from time to time. I also found a template that I could use so I could make pdfs of the image I wanted and then am able to print directly from Acrobat, rather than the Print CD program that comes with the printer(which only allows the import of tiff/jpeg images). The nice thing about using a printer such as this is you have the separate ink cartridges and don't have to pay the higher prices for the all-in-one color carts. I know printers such as the Primera line of cd printers use somewhat proprietary ink cartridges that could be a nuisance to have to replace often if you had a job that used a lot of only a single color. Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:00 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants > us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and > Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we > currently produce. > > I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of > what I've found here: > > http://www.discmakers.com > > I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through > next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. > > These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there > will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we > produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now > we're going to internalize the production. > > I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 > > or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 > > I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on > experience regarding this. > > Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. > > I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're > currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're > very happy with the current appearance. > > Thoughts? > > TIA > > S. > > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From DanF at MMSNY.com Sat Feb 2 13:07:46 2008 From: DanF at MMSNY.com (Dan Flatt) Date: Sat Feb 2 13:01:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners Message-ID: Scott, I really appreciate all of the insight that you provide to this group and I often don't feel like I could add much but I can offer some insight on CD/DVD duplication equipment. Currently we use a Rimage Disclab DLN5200 http://www.rimage.com/products_detail_objectname_pr_DL5200.html It is awesome! It is easy to manage and we find ourselves printing many serialized discs (each being different) and this system works as well for this as printing orders of 500. It uses the Everest printer which is a unique dye-sub / thermal transfer printer that prints CD faces of equal quality to screen printers. The disk plus print costs around $.80 each which is higher than a plan old CR-R but the disks are top quality and the print is unrivaled. We often print runs of 250 @ $5 each and our one off pricing is $12.50 each. We consume around 2,000 CD/DVD per month. We have had this unit for over 2 years and not one lick of trouble. Watch out for some of the units out there as the issues are in the robotics and inkjet quality and durability. My staff that run this also run the copiers. Dan Flatt Multi Media Services Corning, NY 14830 www.mmsny.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org on behalf of Scott Cappel Sent: Fri 2/1/2008 4:59 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Cc: Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we currently produce. I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of what I've found here: http://www.discmakers.com I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now we're going to internalize the production. I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on experience regarding this. Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're very happy with the current appearance. Thoughts? TIA S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From k_graham at hotmail.com Sat Feb 2 13:17:03 2008 From: k_graham at hotmail.com (k_graham@hotmail.com) Date: Sat Feb 2 13:17:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY><008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY><943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM><200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> <00e801c865bc$4eaf7dc0$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: > carts. I know printers such as the Primera line of cd printers use > somewhat > proprietary ink cartridges that could be a nuisance to have to replace > often > if you had a job that used a lot of only a single color. > > Kelly Crom > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > Kelly is right, ours is the Primera Bravo with a 3 color and separate black cartridge. 4 separate cartridges would be preferred, there is an alternative to the proprietary cartridge. Ken Graham CommunityPrinters.com Dawson Creek BC 250-782-7108 From k_graham at hotmail.com Sat Feb 2 13:55:31 2008 From: k_graham at hotmail.com (k_graham@hotmail.com) Date: Sat Feb 2 13:55:51 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY><008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> Message-ID: >>> Kelly, you are close ... >>> >>> The site www.continuousink.com you point out is using mass >>> produced products >>> from china and they simply are not good enough. Almost >>> everything you will I've not liked inkjet as we had poor experience with a large format HP3000 ink heads quitting before getting through the bulk ink supplied by HP. I've heard ink suppliers may make the ink acidic so one has to buy new print heads. I am not sure if this is the reason or if it was our delays between uses. We tried limiting to the more permanent ink so as to only have 1 set of cartridges in use. I hate to think of 6, 8, 12 printheads going bad. I would like to re-enter the 36" large format market, possibly using the Ripit RIP if it could do double duty as a proofer, if I new the printheads were durable and therefore economical. I guess ideally also if bulk ink was available. Years ago I did an experiment where I placed a Canon inkjet copy in our South Window 1/2 covered, in a week the fading was quite noticeable. Where as color copy from a laser goes about 3 years in south facing window before the yellow starts to go. Add a UV blocking laminate that cuts fading to 1/5 and you have a pretty durable print. I will give inkjet credit for creating much more vivid overhead transparencies than laser which due to the opaque long lasting toners doesn't display nearly as nice. For short run color envelopes I could live with inkjet So what would the group consider durable or cheap replacement print heads? Also what printer would be a good feeder of envelopes - or modifiable to accept hookup to Suspension Feeder :) Or would a better bet be a cheap Canon 3200 laser, which I've heard you say feeds envelopes fine. Our Doc 240 is wonderful but envelopes tend to wrinkle though we have used it with some peal and seal envelopes using a separate fuser that already has some damage. (30 second interchangeable fusers). Ken Graham CommunityPrinters.com Dawson Creek BC Canada 250-782-7108 From k_graham at hotmail.com Sat Feb 2 14:15:34 2008 From: k_graham at hotmail.com (k_graham@hotmail.com) Date: Sat Feb 2 14:15:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners References: Message-ID: Has anyone had success using their unit as a backup to DVDRW disks? I've been wanting to build a macro to copy backups from a work station to the Bravo and thus get double usage out of the unit. Included software is designed for 1 to many copies and not for a different file to each disk. The first part of our backup procedure is to use Winrar from Rarlabs.exe to create multiple zipped (rar) files to a work station. However we have been manually putting a series of these to DVDRW. Ken Graham From slb at inkspot.net Sat Feb 2 14:38:52 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Sat Feb 2 14:39:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Trucost program In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <47A4807C.14065.3572F10@slb.inkspot.net> A number of years ago, a participant on this list had a side business involving a program called Trucost, which was a very nice tool for figuring your operational costs to make sure your BHRs covered everything. At one time, he offered a special deal to anyone on the list who wanted to purchase it. I'm in the process of wiping and reinstalling one of our PCs, and can't find the install files. I tried sending an email to the last address I had for him, and it bounced. Does anyone have either good contact info for him, or, dare I ask, a good copy of the install file? TIA, Stevev Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From bernies at printnetusa.com Sat Feb 2 17:17:16 2008 From: bernies at printnetusa.com (BernieS) Date: Sat Feb 2 17:15:26 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners In-Reply-To: References: <200802012204.m11M4HVf042519@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <0b0601c865e9$5f100590$dd8df745@DG2CHT61> What do you charge for: 1. C.D. duplication? 2. Printing in Black on C.D.? 3. Printing in Color on C.D.? 4. C.D. Sleeve? 5. C.D. Adhesive Sleeve? 6. C.D. Jewel Case? 7. Inserting C.D. in 4, 5 & 6 above 8. Do you charge a setup fee for either duplication or graphics/typesetting? Thanks Bernie Schreiber PrintNet USA, Inc. 615.385.9100 bernies@printnetusa.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Bob Molacek Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:20 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Scott, We have been printing and burning discs on these devices for approximately 4 years. We have had three systems. The 1st one had a robotic arm like the one from disc makers. It work okay but ultimately we wore it out. The second system had a carousel system and it didn't work well at all. The system we have know has a stand alone printer(HP). It holds around 50 discs and does a very nice job on the printing. The burning is done on a tower 5 discs at a time. This system is a little more manual but any one can do it. We have it in the graphics area and they just pull the discs off when they walk by and load new discs to be burned. Call Kevin at Techware (952) 944-0083 he is extremely knowledgeable in these systems and sells both types, so he can walk you through the pros and cons of each type. We did $45,000 in burning discs last year not including graphics and disc mailers we print for customers. Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 4:00 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we currently produce. I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of what I've found here: http://www.discmakers.com I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now we're going to internalize the production. I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on experience regarding this. Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're very happy with the current appearance. Thoughts? TIA S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From DanF at MMSNY.com Sat Feb 2 17:24:18 2008 From: DanF at MMSNY.com (Dan Flatt) Date: Sat Feb 2 17:18:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: CD/DVD commercial burners Message-ID: Scott, I really appreciate all of the insight that you provide to this group and I often don't feel like I could add much but I can offer some insight on CD/DVD duplication equipment. Currently we use a Rimage Disclab DLN5200 http://www.rimage.com/products_detail_objectname_pr_DL5200.html It is awesome! It is easy to manage and we find ourselves printing many serialized discs (each being different) and this system works as well for this as printing orders of 500. It uses the Everest printer which is a unique dye-sub / thermal transfer printer that prints CD faces of equal quality to screen printers. The disk plus print costs around $.80 each which is higher than a plan old CR-R but the disks are top quality and the print is unrivaled. We often print runs of 250 @ $5 each and our one off pricing is $12.50 each. We consume around 2,000 CD/DVD per month. We have had this unit for over 2 years and not one lick of trouble. Watch out for some of the units out there as the issues are in the robotics and inkjet quality and durability. My staff that run this also run the copiers. Dan Flatt Multi Media Services Corning, NY 14830 www.mmsny.com From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Sat Feb 2 18:20:20 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Sat Feb 2 18:20:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <008601c86516$ce55e240$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <008701c8651a$b2ecd640$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <943C08435EA247BBB3004D7E031131F1@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802021520s578492f6q8b0a1e4969b18da2@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 2, 2008 1:55 PM, wrote: > > I've not liked inkjet as we had poor experience with a large format HP3000 > ink heads quitting before getting through the bulk ink supplied by HP. > > I've heard ink suppliers may make the ink acidic so one has to buy new print > heads. I am not sure if this is the reason or if it was our delays between > uses. We tried limiting to the more permanent ink so as to only have 1 set > of cartridges in use. I hate to think of 6, 8, 12 printheads going bad. > > I would like to re-enter the 36" large format market, possibly using the > Ripit RIP if it could do double duty as a proofer, if I new the printheads > were durable and therefore economical. I guess ideally also if bulk ink was > available. Ken, you talk as if large-format inkjet printing were a new and unproven technology, when, in fact, the apparent cynicism resulting from your one bad inkjet experience (which you suggest might even have been partially the fault of your delays between use) may have cost you (months of? years of?) unearned profits. Many of us have been enjoying good margins and profits in large-format inkjet printing with all its realities (i.e. even without the bulk ink of which Wayne speaks, and with the realities if having 6, 8, and 12 printheads). All of these technologies are a moving target, but however improved they may become, there is (and has been) plenty of money to be made along the way if you have, or can develop, the appropriate market. Ability to sell the output (i.e. increasing utilization) is the key, not the cost of the consumables. And remember that as time and technology bring down costs, it also increases competition by lowering barriers to entry; the resulting supply brings down prices and margins along with them. And before you know it, you've waited too long. Then you can hope for another wave to come along so you can jump on it earlier. Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From borzou at falconprintandcopy.com Sun Feb 3 10:25:01 2008 From: borzou at falconprintandcopy.com (Borzou Azabdaftari) Date: Sun Feb 3 10:25:21 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Adhesive for Mounting Posters to Gatorboard In-Reply-To: <000a01c8653c$9c421a00$0201a8c0@JGrossLaptop> References: <020120082322.13168.47A3A9C90007DABA0000337022007621940902079B02079D9F979B079D01079D9F@comcast.net> <000a01c8653c$9c421a00$0201a8c0@JGrossLaptop> Message-ID: <78ACF4A9-A2DC-4157-9C0C-B613F1F892E8@falconprintandcopy.com> I largely agree with John here, its highly unlike they the foam is the problem. I'm new to large format as well, and we encountered some issues at first as well. Is your problem getting a smooth edge on cuts? If so, your table probably isn't flat. You need a completely flat, straight, table. We also use a javelin to cut, its made by foster, and its phenomal. Straight, accurate cuts, every time. Go to charrette.com and search for part no: 60182, but there's no information on charrette's site about it, so you may have to do some additional research. It comes from 40" - 120" Borzou Azabdaftari Falcon Print and Copy 1921 Gallows Road Suite 150 Vienna, VA 22182 t.703.442.0124 f.703.442.0134 borzou@falconprintandcopy.com On Feb 1, 2008, at 8:40 PM, John Gross wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Jeff, there are sources for fome or gator with a cold laminate > already applied. If you have trouble cutting fomeboard, gator will > be impossible. A straight edge and a sharp utility knife does the job. > > John Gross > Technigraphics > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 5:22 PM > Subject: [PrintOwners] Adhesive for Mounting Posters to Gatorboard > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> As a newbie to wide format printing we have been mounting posters >> on foam board with an adhesive backing. However, we are finding >> the material difficult to trim. We would like to try a denser >> material like gatorboard. Our problem is finding an adhesive to >> use. We do not have a laminator so any adhesive material which >> needs to be heat activated is not an option. We have been >> laminating using the big squeegee which works quite well. Does >> anyone know of an adhesive we could try? >> >> Jeff Farber >> Priority Printing & Graphics, Inc. >> 1323 E. Main Street >> Flushing, MI 48433 >> 810 487-1700 >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From dennisdater at sbcglobal.net Sun Feb 3 11:38:42 2008 From: dennisdater at sbcglobal.net (Dennis Dater) Date: Sun Feb 3 11:40:11 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Selling My Company In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080203164008.69255DCD9C2@rb.enter.net> My apologies to all for cross posting - it will be the first and last time. I wanted to thank everyone on both lists for all of the help and advise you have offered over the years. I will miss you all. My wife and I are in the process of selling our company to Michael and Diana Coso, a brother and sister. I hope they will join the groups and share your wisdom. We are now in escrow and the business should change hands in the next week. I will be sticking around for training and consulting for the rest of the month and a little beyond. After that I will be working on another business I have started which will be selling exotic (Ferrari and Lamborghini) auto parts on the internet. This time around I wanted a business where I could set my own hours, with no employees, and my only contact with customers would be via email. I of course don't know yet how it will turn out, but I'm optimistic it will generate some extra cash to supplement my wife's and my retirement. My wife will return to her first love, of writing mystery novels. I can always be contacted at: HYPERLINK "mailto:dennisdater@sbcglobal.net"dennisdater@sbcglobal.net We wish everyone a long and prosperous future. Take care, Dennis Dater Allegra Print & Imaging 8037 Vickers Street San Diego, CA 92111 858-576-0100 or 619-696-6290 www.allegrasandiego.com dennisdater@sbcglobal.net No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.19/1256 - Release Date: 2/2/2008 1:50 PM From ttspeer at grics.net Sun Feb 3 14:10:30 2008 From: ttspeer at grics.net (Tim & Tammie Speer) Date: Sun Feb 3 14:10:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Visiting other shops In-Reply-To: <98f5b19a0802021520s578492f6q8b0a1e4969b18da2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: We just got back from Paula Smith's shop in Baltimore. She wanted to get into the vinyl signs business and we were training her employees. I just wanted to remark on how well she runs her shop and how much everyone seems to enjoy their job. Her employees were very receptive and excited about learning something new. I've talked to one owner from this list that was considering adding the vinyl sign business to her shop, but her employees pretty much informed her that she couldn't do it, because they wouldn't have time. I've visited many other print shops, mostly owners from this list, and I can say that Paula's shop seemed to have things running very smoothly, even though it is quite a maze of rooms, and you almost need a map to find your way through it. Also, Paula was very hospitable, picked us up at the airport, and even got us an upgrade for our hotel room to a suite because the hotel is a client of hers. Tammie Tammie Speer, owner **************** Tammie@MacombPrinter.com ______________________________ QUICK PRINT & SIGNS 1120 East Jackson Street ? Macomb, IL 61455 ? 309.833.5250--fax 833.3123 http://www.macombprinter.com/ A Vinyl Sign Business will fit well in your print shop! Want to know how to add a new Profit Center? http://www.SignShopinaPrintShop.com/ Or call for a FREE CD full of information. ______________________________ From wayne at printingonline.com Sun Feb 3 15:23:16 2008 From: wayne at printingonline.com (Wayne Yada) Date: Sun Feb 3 15:23:40 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Selling My Company In-Reply-To: <20080203164008.69255DCD9C2@rb.enter.net> References: <20080203164008.69255DCD9C2@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <000001c866a2$9d553000$d7ff9000$@com> Congratulations & Best Wishes, Dennis! When I grow up, I want to be just like you! Wayne Yada wayne@printingonline.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dennis Dater Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2008 8:39 AM To: PrintOwnersNG@googlegroups.com Cc: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] Selling My Company ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** My apologies to all for cross posting - it will be the first and last time. I wanted to thank everyone on both lists for all of the help and advise you have offered over the years. I will miss you all. My wife and I are in the process of selling our company to Michael and Diana Coso, a brother and sister. I hope they will join the groups and share your wisdom. We are now in escrow and the business should change hands in the next week. I will be sticking around for training and consulting for the rest of the month and a little beyond. After that I will be working on another business I have started which will be selling exotic (Ferrari and Lamborghini) auto parts on the internet. This time around I wanted a business where I could set my own hours, with no employees, and my only contact with customers would be via email. I of course don't know yet how it will turn out, but I'm optimistic it will generate some extra cash to supplement my wife's and my retirement. My wife will return to her first love, of writing mystery novels. I can always be contacted at: HYPERLINK "mailto:dennisdater@sbcglobal.net"dennisdater@sbcglobal.net We wish everyone a long and prosperous future. Take care, Dennis Dater Allegra Print & Imaging 8037 Vickers Street San Diego, CA 92111 858-576-0100 or 619-696-6290 www.allegrasandiego.com dennisdater@sbcglobal.net No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.19/1256 - Release Date: 2/2/2008 1:50 PM _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From cpurvine1 at cox.net Sun Feb 3 16:21:46 2008 From: cpurvine1 at cox.net (Cora Purvine) Date: Sun Feb 3 16:22:00 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Selling My Company In-Reply-To: <000001c866a2$9d553000$d7ff9000$@com> References: <20080203164008.69255DCD9C2@rb.enter.net> <000001c866a2$9d553000$d7ff9000$@com> Message-ID: <001501c866aa$c80da4f0$6501a8c0@corapurvine> Congratulations Dennis. Wish I could do that, but I'm not old enough yet (68). I will probably die right here in front of this computer Good luck and keep in touch!!!! Class Act Printing and Foil Cora & Bernie Purvine, Owners 5801 W. Juno Ave. Wichita, KS 67215-1742 Ph/Fax: 316-522-0733 cpurvine1@cox.net www.ClassActPrinting.biz From david at commercialpressink.com Mon Feb 4 10:01:27 2008 From: david at commercialpressink.com (David Charleson) Date: Mon Feb 4 09:56:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants Message-ID: <4442D68E-1246-4196-8438-85312A347A52@commercialpressink.com> Sorry about the off subject post. Just have to boast about the Giants. What a great game! just goes to show that you never give up, same in the printing field, keep doing what works and it will pay off in the end! Thanks for the space! A very happy Giants fan David Charleson President Commercial Press Inc. 216 Cowan Rd Canton NY 13617 315-386-3431 www.commercialpressink.com david@commercialpressink.com From borzou at falconprintandcopy.com Mon Feb 4 10:04:10 2008 From: borzou at falconprintandcopy.com (Borzou Azabdaftari) Date: Mon Feb 4 10:04:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants In-Reply-To: <4442D68E-1246-4196-8438-85312A347A52@commercialpressink.com> References: <4442D68E-1246-4196-8438-85312A347A52@commercialpressink.com> Message-ID: As I diehard Redskins fan, I kind of hate the Giants. Not in a personal way, but in the way an division rival should. But I gotta tell you, I was rooting for those football giants. I have never been so happy to see any non-Redskins team win anything. I just couldn't stand the Pats anymore. I don't want anyone to be THAT happy. Borzou Azabdaftari Falcon Print and Copy 1921 Gallows Road Suite 150 Vienna, VA 22182 t.703.442.0124 f.703.442.0134 borzou@falconprintandcopy.com On Feb 4, 2008, at 10:01 AM, David Charleson wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Sorry about the off subject post. > Just have to boast about the Giants. What a great game! just goes to > show that you never give up, same in the printing field, keep doing > what works and it will pay off in the end! > > Thanks for the space! > A very happy Giants fan > > David Charleson > President > Commercial Press Inc. > 216 Cowan Rd > Canton NY 13617 > 315-386-3431 > www.commercialpressink.com > david@commercialpressink.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From DanF at MMSNY.com Mon Feb 4 10:20:44 2008 From: DanF at MMSNY.com (Dan Flatt) Date: Mon Feb 4 10:14:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners Message-ID: Scott, I really appreciate all of the insight that you provide to this group and I often don't feel like I could add much but I can offer some insight on CD/DVD duplication equipment. Currently we use a Rimage Disclab DLN5200 http://www.rimage.com/products_detail_objectname_pr_DL5200.html It is awesome! It is easy to manage and we find ourselves printing many serialized discs (each being different) and this system works as well for this as printing orders of 500. It uses the Everest printer which is a unique dye-sub / thermal transfer printer that prints CD faces of equal quality to screen printers. The disk plus print costs around $.80 each which is higher than a plan old CR-R but the disks are top quality and the print is unrivaled. We often print runs of 250 @ $5 each and our one off pricing is $12.50 each. We consume around 2,000 CD/DVD per month. We have had this unit for over 2 years and not one lick of trouble. Watch out for some of the units out there as the issues are in the robotics and inkjet quality and durability. My staff that run this also run the copiers. Feel free to call me if you have any questions. Dan Flatt Multi Media Services Corning, NY 14830 www.mmsny.com Dan Flatt owner Multi Media Services 11136-40 River Road Corning, NY 14830 main 607-936-3186 CELL 607-331-7217 PLEASE CALL MY CELL FIRST! Fax 877-684-3043 www.mmsny.com Isn't it time that you had a business printer printing for your business? Other contacts: Rick Bartholomew Sr. VP -Manufacturing 607-769-8111 Belinda Wilcox vp-Finance & CSR's 607-936-3186 Rose Flatt VP - Creative 607-331-1555 Dick Shelford Sunset Operations 607-331-5775 Patty Carlson Strategic accounts 607-331-5314 Jenna Nailer IR operations liaison 607-331-5314 Dave Satterly IR operations 570-882-0485 Ralph Begeal CSR 607-331-5572 Steve Mullen CSR / paper 607-936-3186 Margaret Puffer Major accounts / mailing 607-936-318 Emily Colletta creative 607-331-7068 Judy Pruyne creative 607-331-5963 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 5:00 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] CD/DVD commercial burners ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We have a very large account that we print and fulfill for that wants us to start burning their proprietary content (Documentation and Software) onto CD/DVD for packing with their product that we currently produce. I've been researching this for awhile and have focused primarily of what I've found here: http://www.discmakers.com I've been give a heads up today that a large PO is coming through next week, so I have to make a decision and execute. These projects are not large (75-125 disks per project) but there will be many of them becasue they have a lot of part numbers we produce currently . These runs are too small to send out so for now we're going to internalize the production. I'm thinking of something like this: http://tinyurl.com/25l6x9 or this: http://tinyurl.com/2eqtt7 I'd like to hear from anyone with personal, direct, hands on experience regarding this. Units you like or don't like. What to watch out for. I'm leaning against units with inkjet capabilities because we're currently producing the CD/DVD labels (digital color) and they're very happy with the current appearance. Thoughts? TIA S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From jacemeister at gmail.com Mon Feb 4 12:05:37 2008 From: jacemeister at gmail.com (Jace Prejean) Date: Mon Feb 4 12:05:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Large Format Job In-Reply-To: <00b401c86568$662e1780$0300a8c0@Danko> References: <00b401c86568$662e1780$0300a8c0@Danko> Message-ID: Sorry about that - 2,000. Jace On Feb 2, 2008 12:54 AM, Kevin Danko wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Be happy to Jace, how many do you need a quote on? > > Kevin Danko > Advantage Business Forms > 102 N. Riverside Ave. > Rialto, CA 92376 > (909) 875-7163 > Fax: (909) 875-7971 > E-mail: kevin@abfprints.com > www.abfprints.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Jace Prejean > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 11:53 AM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: [PrintOwners] Large Format Job > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Would anyone be interested in giving me a price to print and fold a > brochure? Trim size is 11" x 24.5" tri-folded to 8.5" x 11". It's 4/4 on > 80# > Enamel Gloss Cover. I will provide digital file. I used to print these > in-house but sold my 4-up press last year. > > BTW, it's one of a series so color match and consistency are important. > > TIA > > --- > Jace Prejean > Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc > 922 Sunset Ave > Houma, LA 70360 > Phone 985-868-8273 > > www.BayouPrinting.com > _______________________________________________ > From slb at inkspot.net Mon Feb 4 12:05:05 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Mon Feb 4 12:06:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants In-Reply-To: References: <4442D68E-1246-4196-8438-85312A347A52@commercialpressink.com> Message-ID: <47A6FF71.19789.3DA2F0@slb.inkspot.net> Reminds me a bit of the sign on my older son's high school physics teacher's wall: "My two favorite football teams are Penn State, and whoever is playing Pitt." Steve > > As I diehard Redskins fan, I kind of hate the Giants. Not in a > personal way, but in the way an division rival should. But I gotta > tell you, I was rooting for those football giants. I have never been > so happy to see any non-Redskins team win anything. I just couldn't > stand the Pats anymore. I don't want anyone to be THAT happy. > > Borzou Azabdaftari > Falcon Print and Copy > 1921 Gallows Road > Suite 150 > Vienna, VA 22182 > t.703.442.0124 > f.703.442.0134 > borzou@falconprintandcopy.com > > > > On Feb 4, 2008, at 10:01 AM, David Charleson wrote: > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > Sorry about the off subject post. > > Just have to boast about the Giants. What a great game! just goes to > > show that you never give up, same in the printing field, keep doing > > what works and it will pay off in the end! > > > > Thanks for the space! > > A very happy Giants fan > > > > David Charleson > > President > > Commercial Press Inc. > > 216 Cowan Rd > > Canton NY 13617 > > 315-386-3431 > > www.commercialpressink.com > > david@commercialpressink.com > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > __________ NOD32 2847 (20080204) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Mon Feb 4 12:41:44 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Mon Feb 4 12:42:04 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> Hi Wayne I don't blame you for not wanting to disclose all the details. I have a simple question for you, how many impressions does your company handle in one average month? xeroid wrote: > That has certainly crossed my mind. > > Think what you may .... but I am certainly telling you the truth. If > your > asking me to simply disclose all the details of what I have .... it isn't > going to happen for obvious reasons. But with a little research, and > determination, you may be able to figure out what I have years ago. > > This isn't the first time I have brought this to the attention of the > list. > Several years ago I hinted on this very same topic, but sceptics like > yourself just laughed it off. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From xeroid at kos.net Mon Feb 4 13:03:41 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Mon Feb 4 13:04:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Today I've done 2000 8.5 X 11 full colour, 2000 8.5 X 14 full colour, and a box of full colour business cards. I'm a small shop. Approximately $1600 worth of products so far today. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Sardo" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 12:41 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Hi Wayne > > I don't blame you for not wanting to disclose all the details. > > I have a simple question for you, how many impressions does your company > handle in one average month? > > xeroid wrote: >> That has certainly crossed my mind. >> >> Think what you may .... but I am certainly telling you the truth. If >> your >> asking me to simply disclose all the details of what I have .... it isn't >> going to happen for obvious reasons. But with a little research, and >> determination, you may be able to figure out what I have years ago. >> >> This isn't the first time I have brought this to the attention of the >> list. >> Several years ago I hinted on this very same topic, but sceptics like >> yourself just laughed it off. >> >> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >> xeroid@kos.net >> > > > -- > Ron Sardo > Sugarloaf Print Shop > mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > www.sugarloafprint.com > 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From bob at rjmprinting.com Mon Feb 4 14:25:43 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Mon Feb 4 14:43:19 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants In-Reply-To: <47A6FF71.19789.3DA2F0@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: The only problem with the Giants winning is that we have to listen to Mercury Morris tell us how great the 72 Dolphins were.... It was the 1st time in years I watched the entire game. I too am happy the Giants won. No ring for Randy! Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Steve Blatman Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 11:05 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Reminds me a bit of the sign on my older son's high school physics teacher's wall: "My two favorite football teams are Penn State, and whoever is playing Pitt." Steve > > As I diehard Redskins fan, I kind of hate the Giants. Not in a > personal way, but in the way an division rival should. But I gotta > tell you, I was rooting for those football giants. I have never been > so happy to see any non-Redskins team win anything. I just couldn't > stand the Pats anymore. I don't want anyone to be THAT happy. > > Borzou Azabdaftari > Falcon Print and Copy > 1921 Gallows Road > Suite 150 > Vienna, VA 22182 > t.703.442.0124 > f.703.442.0134 > borzou@falconprintandcopy.com > > > > On Feb 4, 2008, at 10:01 AM, David Charleson wrote: > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > Sorry about the off subject post. > > Just have to boast about the Giants. What a great game! just goes to > > show that you never give up, same in the printing field, keep doing > > what works and it will pay off in the end! > > > > Thanks for the space! > > A very happy Giants fan > > > > David Charleson > > President > > Commercial Press Inc. > > 216 Cowan Rd > > Canton NY 13617 > > 315-386-3431 > > www.commercialpressink.com > > david@commercialpressink.com > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > __________ NOD32 2847 (20080204) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Mon Feb 4 14:49:21 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Mon Feb 4 14:49:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> Yes, but what is your average monthly output? If you don't want to answer that question, how much output can your system handle in a month? Wayne wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Today I've done 2000 8.5 X 11 full colour, 2000 8.5 X 14 full colour, > and a box of full colour business cards. I'm a small shop. > Approximately $1600 worth of products so far today. > > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Hi Wayne >> >> I have a simple question for you, how many impressions does your >> company handle in one average month? >> > -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From tufelkinder at gmail.com Mon Feb 4 15:04:37 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Mon Feb 4 15:04:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> 2008/2/4 Ron Sardo : > > If you don't want to answer that question, how much output can your > system handle in a month? Ron, I think I can (predict the) answer this one: Unlimited! Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net tufelkinder@gmail.com 800-955-3902 -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From xeroid at kos.net Mon Feb 4 16:42:15 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Mon Feb 4 16:40:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! To answer Ron's question: Each print engine lasts about 100,000 prints, and is replaced by a new one at a cost of $49. The print engines I use include the print head and feeder. That's a cost of .00049 per print ... one half of 1/1000 of a penny. The ink delivery system lasts about 4 years. There are no other machine costs and the ink as you will see from another one of my posts is under 1/1000 of a penny. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net >> If you don't want to answer that question, how much output can your >> system handle in a month? > > Ron, > > I think I can (predict the) answer this one: > > Unlimited! > > > Walt > > > Mercersburg Printing > Mercersburg, PA > http://mercersburg.net > tufelkinder@gmail.com > 800-955-3902 > > -~ > > Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. > -- Bertrand Russell > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From dvmonto at optonline.net Mon Feb 4 16:48:44 2008 From: dvmonto at optonline.net (David Monto) Date: Mon Feb 4 16:49:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] KM C6500 2 clicks for 11 x 17 In-Reply-To: <47A6FF71.19789.3DA2F0@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: Just a word of caution: I have had my C6500 for 2 months now and I have checked it periodically to make sure it is doing one click for 11 x 17. What I did not check was the black & white clicks. Seems it is doing 2 clicks for 11 x 17 B & W. I placed a call today and they will be in tomorrow to fix their error. It might not add up to a real lot in the short run but in the long run it might. So check your machine for B & W AND COLOR for one click for 11 x 17. -- David V. Monto Sir Speedy Printing 1837 South Road Wappingers Falls, NY 12590 Phone:845-298-8898 Fax: 845-298-8537 email: dvmonto@optonline.net www.sirspeedy.com/wappingersfalls ?Government?s view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it.? If it keeps moving, regulate it.? And if it stops moving, subsidize it.? Ronald Reagan From keli at parchmentpress.net Mon Feb 4 16:51:19 2008 From: keli at parchmentpress.net (Keli of Coxsackie) Date: Mon Feb 4 16:51:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47A788D7.1050405@parchmentpress.net> How much for a system like this? I want one! wow When will one be available to us? Michael Markuson (aka Keli) Parchment Press 52 S River St Coxsackie, NY 12051 xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! > > To answer Ron's question: > > Each print engine lasts about 100,000 prints, and is replaced by a new > one > at a cost of $49. The print engines I use include the print head and > feeder. > That's a cost of .00049 per print ... one half of 1/1000 of a penny. > The ink delivery system lasts about 4 years. There are no other machine > costs and the ink as you will see from another one of my posts is under > 1/1000 of a penny. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > >>> If you don't want to answer that question, how much output can your >>> system handle in a month? >> >> Ron, >> >> I think I can (predict the) answer this one: >> >> Unlimited! >> >> >> Walt >> >> >> Mercersburg Printing >> Mercersburg, PA >> http://mercersburg.net >> tufelkinder@gmail.com >> 800-955-3902 >> >> -~ >> >> Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. >> -- Bertrand Russell >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > From keli at parchmentpress.net Mon Feb 4 17:01:54 2008 From: keli at parchmentpress.net (Keli of Coxsackie) Date: Mon Feb 4 17:02:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: References: <20080201151700.C8935DC4E44@rb.enter.net><003901c864f7$77bd6620$67383260$@com><007c01c864ff$b2010af0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><84f70d5e0802011030v1d44ef23ua5f8941a253af059@mail.gmail.com><008901c86502$3f7ebe70$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <84f70d5e0802011105p3a71083u7d734ff90daf8c1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47A78B52.5090407@parchmentpress.net> Is there a way you can make systems for us to use? I am sure we all want to Beta the printers.... Michael Markuson (aka Keli) Parchment Press 52 S River St Coxsackie, NY 12051 xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >> I've been reading your other posts, but unfortunately, aside >> from a link to the memjet video (which you said you aren't >> using, and certainly costs well over $49) and a request in >> July for information about cluster-printing software, I'm unable >> to find any mention of specific manufacturer or equipment >> model. Apologies if I'm just not reading closely enough... >> >> What's the quality/consistency across 12 printers? What >> do you utilize to manage color and maintain accuracy? > > Memjet based products should hit the market in the $300 per engine > range for speeds of 60 per minute for a machine > that will do 8.5 X 14. What I have today is something I built myself, > so you will not find these anywhere else. > The quality and consistency is excellent. It's all in the ink you > run through the engines. > > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Mon Feb 4 17:48:29 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Mon Feb 4 17:48:41 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 4, 2008 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: > > Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! Wayne, this list is, and always has been, for the sharing of information. It's pretty safe to say for many of us, that the system you've cobbled together sounds pretty fascinating. As for the skepticism that may have reared its head in several posts, part of the cause goes to perceptions painted by your previous history on this list, which may have caused your credibility to suffer. But that was then. The other cause for skepticism is that you have presented this information in a way that has not been felt as a sharing of information, but more along the lines of "I know something that you guys don't." If the message is being received and perceived incorrectly, I'd say it was the messenger who is at fault. Obviously you have commendably put together something of considerable value. And I, for one, appreciate that you have come to PO to make us aware of this very interesting development. At the same time, nobody can fault you for wanting to maintain your competitive advantage, especially if there is no other way for you to capitalize on your system (as in selling or licensing it). But forgive us if we ask questions to fill the holes in the information you've teasingly dangled in front of us. Perhaps, in the spirit of the list, you might give us a summary of the progression of your system and its parameters, and consider supplying some sourcing information if that would not compromise your position. (And btw, I didn't take Walt's "unlimited" response as the negative comment you apparently perceived it to be; I would have guessed the same based on your description and the apparent scalability of your cluster scheme). -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From printer at ptialaska.net Mon Feb 4 17:56:22 2008 From: printer at ptialaska.net (Charles A. Lincoln) Date: Mon Feb 4 17:56:39 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Fiery vs. Creo In-Reply-To: <4799D1AC.19972.3C1E7E6D@slb.inkspot.net> References: <4799D1AC.19972.3C1E7E6D@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: What is the creo rip model that goes with the C500? We have been trying to upgrade our internal fiery but our rep has not gotten us any info. Thanks, _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Charles Lincoln ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY 612 30th Avenue Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 (907) 451-1111 fax (907) 451-4511 _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ From gamble at choiceonemail.com Mon Feb 4 18:04:25 2008 From: gamble at choiceonemail.com (Rick Bird) Date: Mon Feb 4 18:04:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants In-Reply-To: References: <47A6FF71.19789.3DA2F0@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <00f901c86782$49c70bd0$0301a8c0@RICK> Not to rub salt in a wound but as a Bill's Fan I could not be happier that the Giants beat the Patriots. 2 reasons - 1 enough of the faces of the Patriots 2 it would show that you can cheat and still win the prize. ( I have tried very hard to walk the line and play by the rules) Win or lose at least I can look my clients in the eye an shake his hand. JMTC Rick Bird Gamble Printing & Mailing Inc. 3649 California Road Orchard Park, NY 14127 (716) 662-1515 (716) 662-5917 - Fax gamble@choiceonemail.com - email -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Bob Molacek Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 2:26 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** The only problem with the Giants winning is that we have to listen to Mercury Morris tell us how great the 72 Dolphins were.... It was the 1st time in years I watched the entire game. I too am happy the Giants won. No ring for Randy! Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Steve Blatman Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 11:05 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Off: NY Giants ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Reminds me a bit of the sign on my older son's high school physics teacher's wall: "My two favorite football teams are Penn State, and whoever is playing Pitt." Steve > > As I diehard Redskins fan, I kind of hate the Giants. Not in a > personal way, but in the way an division rival should. But I gotta > tell you, I was rooting for those football giants. I have never been > so happy to see any non-Redskins team win anything. I just couldn't > stand the Pats anymore. I don't want anyone to be THAT happy. > > Borzou Azabdaftari > Falcon Print and Copy > 1921 Gallows Road > Suite 150 > Vienna, VA 22182 > t.703.442.0124 > f.703.442.0134 > borzou@falconprintandcopy.com > > > > On Feb 4, 2008, at 10:01 AM, David Charleson wrote: > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > Sorry about the off subject post. > > Just have to boast about the Giants. What a great game! just goes to > > show that you never give up, same in the printing field, keep doing > > what works and it will pay off in the end! > > > > Thanks for the space! > > A very happy Giants fan > > > > David Charleson > > President > > Commercial Press Inc. > > 216 Cowan Rd > > Canton NY 13617 > > 315-386-3431 > > www.commercialpressink.com > > david@commercialpressink.com > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > __________ NOD32 2847 (20080204) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From xeroid at kos.net Mon Feb 4 18:57:23 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Mon Feb 4 18:55:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com><84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> My point in sharing and/or hinting around what I have created with inkjet technology some years ago and have been using successfully ever since was to convince print shop owners that inkjet is a growing concern today, and will be a reality in our businesses tomorrow. If you haven't recently picked up a small personal inkjet machine at your local big box store, I suggest you do so. The quality of prints today is top notch and the speeds keep increasing. The problem is the ink cartridge costs which you have to work around. When Memjet technology announced last year their invention will result in machines costing $300 that would print at speeds of 60 a minute and have the lowest ink costs we have ever seen, it didn't surprise me as I have been able to achieve this on my own. Sure I use multiple 18 ppm engines to bring up the speed to where I need it to be, but with the cost of $49 per engine, it didn't seem to be a barrier. "Feeding" these engines a continues supply of bulk ink brought my ink costs down to 1/1000 of a penny per copy. No more plates, no more colour separations, no more labour, no more click charges, positive customer feedback and wicked profit margins etc convinced me to dispose of both my laser and offset press immediately. And I did. Sure, I have a solid technical background, and there was some adjusting and tweaking at the beginning, but I have been using this technology exclusively for the past few years, every day for all my full colour offerings. It's not Rocket Science, it's just thinking a little out side the box. So back to my point, I'm convinced that with the new memjet technology you will find machines hitting the market this year if not next that will drive the price of colour to the 5 cent range. Memjet plans to expand this technology with increasing speeds that have the potential to replace web presses. What I have been doing for the past few years was great, but like all of you, I have the reality of decreasing profit margins on colour and it will continue to decrease dramatically while at the same time remove all barriers for anyone from a secretary in a office, to a computer literate teenager to compete against us. This is why I have begun a new study of digital multimedia signage as a new profit center for my business. Basically, a computer hooked to a large monitor placed in your customers store front window or inside that plays and promotes your customers products. I am at the stage of designing custom software for this project. I figure I can launch this at a $299 installation fee and ongoing rental of $49 per month. There is little competition and the cost to enter for the average business is much higher than what I have planned. It's a booming industry right now, suits the type of business we are in, and is profitable. More on this later! Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net From: "Michael Vogel" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 5:48 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > On Feb 4, 2008 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: >> >> Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! > > Wayne, this list is, and always has been, for the sharing of information. > > It's pretty safe to say for many of us, that the system you've cobbled > together sounds pretty fascinating. > > As for the skepticism that may have reared its head in several posts, > part of the cause goes to perceptions painted by your previous history > on this list, which may have caused your credibility to suffer. But > that was then. > > The other cause for skepticism is that you have presented this > information in a way that has not been felt as a sharing of > information, but more along the lines of "I know something that you > guys don't." If the message is being received and perceived > incorrectly, I'd say it was the messenger who is at fault. > > Obviously you have commendably put together something of considerable > value. And I, for one, appreciate that you have come to PO to make us > aware of this very interesting development. At the same time, nobody > can fault you for wanting to maintain your competitive advantage, > especially if there is no other way for you to capitalize on your > system (as in selling or licensing it). But forgive us if we ask > questions to fill the holes in the information you've teasingly > dangled in front of us. Perhaps, in the spirit of the list, you might > give us a summary of the progression of your system and its > parameters, and consider supplying some sourcing information if that > would not compromise your position. > > (And btw, I didn't take Walt's "unlimited" response as the negative > comment you apparently perceived it to be; I would have guessed the > same based on your description and the apparent scalability of your > cluster scheme). > > -- > Michael Vogel > Sir Speedy Printing > 9 Research Drive > Milford, CT 06460 > tel 203-877-1231 > fax 203-878-2679 > mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com > www.eSirSpeedy.com > ==================================== > Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to > criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. > ~Lord Bacon > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From sgfinke at fuse.net Mon Feb 4 18:57:49 2008 From: sgfinke at fuse.net (Scott and Gail Finke) Date: Mon Feb 4 18:58:13 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8590311D-5556-4E87-84AF-646DB6C1FA55@fuse.net> Wow. I can see that a system like this would not be of any interest to an inkjet company. They make all their money on ink. Gail Finke - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road Cincinnati, OH 45231 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - (513) 522-2679 Fax 522-2692 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - info@brentwood-printing.com www.brentwood-printing.com On Feb 4, 2008, at 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! > > To answer Ron's question: > > Each print engine lasts about 100,000 prints, and is replaced by a > new one > at a cost of $49. The print engines I use include the print head > and feeder. > That's a cost of .00049 per print ... one half of 1/1000 of a penny. > The ink delivery system lasts about 4 years. There are no other > machine > costs and the ink as you will see from another one of my posts is > under > 1/1000 of a penny. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > >>> If you don't want to answer that question, how much output can your >>> system handle in a month? >> >> Ron, >> >> I think I can (predict the) answer this one: >> >> Unlimited! >> >> >> Walt >> >> >> Mercersburg Printing >> Mercersburg, PA >> http://mercersburg.net >> tufelkinder@gmail.com >> 800-955-3902 >> >> -~ >> >> Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. >> -- Bertrand Russell >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From xeroid at kos.net Mon Feb 4 19:28:23 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Mon Feb 4 19:26:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com><84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <8590311D-5556-4E87-84AF-646DB6C1FA55@fuse.net> Message-ID: I couldn't have said it better :-) Straight from your website www.brentwood-printing.com Equipment We utilize the most current technology in our industry. Our state-of-the-art equipment allows us to provide our clients with high-quality products faster and less-expensively than our competition. We realize that most people could care less about what models of equipment we use, so long as they receive what they ordered. Still, we can't help being proud of our toys. Once you see how great they make you look, we hope you'll be proud of them, too. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott and Gail Finke" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 6:57 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Wow. > > I can see that a system like this would not be of any interest to an > inkjet company. They make all their money on ink. > > > Gail Finke > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road > Cincinnati, OH 45231 > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > (513) 522-2679 > Fax 522-2692 > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > info@brentwood-printing.com > www.brentwood-printing.com > > > > > On Feb 4, 2008, at 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! >> >> To answer Ron's question: >> >> Each print engine lasts about 100,000 prints, and is replaced by a new >> one >> at a cost of $49. The print engines I use include the print head and >> feeder. >> That's a cost of .00049 per print ... one half of 1/1000 of a penny. >> The ink delivery system lasts about 4 years. There are no other machine >> costs and the ink as you will see from another one of my posts is under >> 1/1000 of a penny. >> >> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >> xeroid@kos.net >> >> >>>> If you don't want to answer that question, how much output can your >>>> system handle in a month? >>> >>> Ron, >>> >>> I think I can (predict the) answer this one: >>> >>> Unlimited! >>> >>> >>> Walt >>> >>> >>> Mercersburg Printing >>> Mercersburg, PA >>> http://mercersburg.net >>> tufelkinder@gmail.com >>> 800-955-3902 >>> >>> -~ >>> >>> Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. >>> -- Bertrand Russell >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From smc at sorrentomesa.com Mon Feb 4 19:35:54 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Mon Feb 4 19:40:41 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Fiery vs. Creo In-Reply-To: References: <4799D1AC.19972.3C1E7E6D@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <200802050040.m150eLR2009274@i2bnetworks.com> Its all on their website Charles.... http://tinyurl.com/yuqx4e rep, schmep...who's got the time S. At 02:56 PM 2/4/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >What is the creo rip model that goes with the C500? We have been >trying to upgrade our internal fiery but our rep has not gotten us any >info. > >Thanks, > >_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > >Charles Lincoln >ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY >612 30th Avenue >Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 >(907) 451-1111 >fax (907) 451-4511 > >_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2848 (20080204) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From smc at sorrentomesa.com Mon Feb 4 19:40:14 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Mon Feb 4 19:44:54 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> So Wayne, um how do you handle coated stock. My client wants 500 of 4 (2000 total), 4/4 data sheets on 100# gloss book for a trade show. can do? no smearing? S. At 03:57 PM 2/4/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >My point in sharing and/or hinting around what I have created with >inkjet technology some years ago and have been using successfully >ever since was to convince print shop owners that inkjet is a >growing concern today, and will be a reality in our businesses >tomorrow. If you haven't recently picked up a small personal inkjet >machine at your local big box store, I suggest you do so. The >quality of prints today is top notch and the speeds keep >increasing. The problem is the ink cartridge costs which you have >to work around. When Memjet technology announced last year their >invention will result in machines costing $300 that would print at >speeds of 60 a minute and have the lowest ink costs we have ever >seen, it didn't surprise me as I have been able to achieve this on >my own. Sure I use multiple 18 ppm engines to bring up the speed to >where I need it to be, but with the cost of $49 per engine, it >didn't seem to be a barrier. "Feeding" these engines a continues >supply of bulk ink brought my ink costs down to 1/1000 of a penny per copy. > >No more plates, no more colour separations, no more labour, no more >click charges, positive customer feedback and wicked profit margins >etc convinced me to dispose of both my laser and offset press >immediately. And I did. > >Sure, I have a solid technical background, and there was some >adjusting and tweaking at the beginning, but I have been using this >technology exclusively for the past few years, every day for all my >full colour offerings. It's not Rocket Science, it's just thinking >a little out side the box. > >So back to my point, I'm convinced that with the new memjet >technology you will find machines hitting the market this year if >not next that will drive the price of colour to the 5 cent >range. Memjet plans to expand this technology with increasing >speeds that have the potential to replace web presses. What I have >been doing for the past few years was great, but like all of you, I >have the reality of decreasing profit margins on colour and it will >continue to decrease dramatically while at the same time remove all >barriers for anyone from a secretary in a office, to a computer >literate teenager to compete against us. > >This is why I have begun a new study of digital multimedia signage >as a new profit center for my business. Basically, a computer >hooked to a large monitor placed in your customers store front >window or inside that plays and promotes your customers products. I >am at the stage of designing custom software for this project. I >figure I can launch this at a $299 installation fee and ongoing >rental of $49 per month. There is little competition and the cost >to enter for the average business is much higher than what I have >planned. It's a booming industry right now, suits the type of >business we are in, and is profitable. More on this later! > >Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >Kingston, Ontario, Canada >xeroid@kos.net > > > > > >From: "Michael Vogel" >To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > >Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 5:48 PM >Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > > >>***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >>On Feb 4, 2008 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: >>> >>>Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! >> >>Wayne, this list is, and always has been, for the sharing of information. >> >>It's pretty safe to say for many of us, that the system you've cobbled >>together sounds pretty fascinating. >> >>As for the skepticism that may have reared its head in several posts, >>part of the cause goes to perceptions painted by your previous history >>on this list, which may have caused your credibility to suffer. But >>that was then. >> >>The other cause for skepticism is that you have presented this >>information in a way that has not been felt as a sharing of >>information, but more along the lines of "I know something that you >>guys don't." If the message is being received and perceived >>incorrectly, I'd say it was the messenger who is at fault. >> >>Obviously you have commendably put together something of considerable >>value. And I, for one, appreciate that you have come to PO to make us >>aware of this very interesting development. At the same time, nobody >>can fault you for wanting to maintain your competitive advantage, >>especially if there is no other way for you to capitalize on your >>system (as in selling or licensing it). But forgive us if we ask >>questions to fill the holes in the information you've teasingly >>dangled in front of us. Perhaps, in the spirit of the list, you might >>give us a summary of the progression of your system and its >>parameters, and consider supplying some sourcing information if that >>would not compromise your position. >> >>(And btw, I didn't take Walt's "unlimited" response as the negative >>comment you apparently perceived it to be; I would have guessed the >>same based on your description and the apparent scalability of your >>cluster scheme). >> >>-- >>Michael Vogel >>Sir Speedy Printing >>9 Research Drive >>Milford, CT 06460 >>tel 203-877-1231 >>fax 203-878-2679 >>mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com >>www.eSirSpeedy.com >>==================================== >>Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to >>criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. >> ~Lord Bacon >>_______________________________________________ >>PrintOwners Discussion List >>Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2848 (20080204) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Mon Feb 4 19:53:30 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Mon Feb 4 19:53:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802041653t7766899dgea0b26300acc6f22@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 4, 2008 7:40 PM, Scott Cappel wrote: > > So Wayne, um how do you handle coated stock. > > My client wants 500 of 4 (2000 total), 4/4 data sheets on 100# gloss > book for a trade show. > can do? > no smearing? Issues to be addressed, for sure. But that doesn't take away from the potential paradigm shift of which Wayne is warning us. At this point, it isn't about what Wayne's system *can't* do, but what it *can* do. It sounds to me like the glass is at least half full. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From xeroid at kos.net Mon Feb 4 20:02:08 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Mon Feb 4 20:00:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com><84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com><98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com><25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: By coated you mean glossy coated stock I assume. Can do .... but requires a specially coated stock just for inkjets that costs 5-10 cents a sheet. Wayne Stevenhaagen Kingston, Ontario, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Cappel" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 7:40 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > So Wayne, um how do you handle coated stock. > > My client wants 500 of 4 (2000 total), 4/4 data sheets on 100# gloss book > for a trade show. > > can do? > > no smearing? > > S. > > > > > > At 03:57 PM 2/4/2008, you wrote: >>***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >>My point in sharing and/or hinting around what I have created with inkjet >>technology some years ago and have been using successfully ever since was >>to convince print shop owners that inkjet is a growing concern today, and >>will be a reality in our businesses tomorrow. If you haven't recently >>picked up a small personal inkjet machine at your local big box store, I >>suggest you do so. The quality of prints today is top notch and the >>speeds keep increasing. The problem is the ink cartridge costs which you >>have to work around. When Memjet technology announced last year their >>invention will result in machines costing $300 that would print at speeds >>of 60 a minute and have the lowest ink costs we have ever seen, it didn't >>surprise me as I have been able to achieve this on my own. Sure I use >>multiple 18 ppm engines to bring up the speed to where I need it to be, >>but with the cost of $49 per engine, it didn't seem to be a barrier. >>"Feeding" these engines a continues supply of bulk ink brought my ink >>costs down to 1/1000 of a penny per copy. >> >>No more plates, no more colour separations, no more labour, no more click >>charges, positive customer feedback and wicked profit margins etc >>convinced me to dispose of both my laser and offset press immediately. >>And I did. >> >>Sure, I have a solid technical background, and there was some adjusting >>and tweaking at the beginning, but I have been using this technology >>exclusively for the past few years, every day for all my full colour >>offerings. It's not Rocket Science, it's just thinking a little out side >>the box. >> >>So back to my point, I'm convinced that with the new memjet technology you >>will find machines hitting the market this year if not next that will >>drive the price of colour to the 5 cent range. Memjet plans to expand >>this technology with increasing speeds that have the potential to replace >>web presses. What I have been doing for the past few years was great, but >>like all of you, I have the reality of decreasing profit margins on colour >>and it will continue to decrease dramatically while at the same time >>remove all barriers for anyone from a secretary in a office, to a computer >>literate teenager to compete against us. >> >>This is why I have begun a new study of digital multimedia signage as a >>new profit center for my business. Basically, a computer hooked to a >>large monitor placed in your customers store front window or inside that >>plays and promotes your customers products. I am at the stage of >>designing custom software for this project. I figure I can launch this at >>a $299 installation fee and ongoing rental of $49 per month. There is >>little competition and the cost to enter for the average business is much >>higher than what I have planned. It's a booming industry right now, suits >>the type of business we are in, and is profitable. More on this later! >> >>Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >>Kingston, Ontario, Canada >>xeroid@kos.net >> >> >> >> >> >>From: "Michael Vogel" >>To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" >> >>Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 5:48 PM >>Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >> >> >>>***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >>> >>>On Feb 4, 2008 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: >>>> >>>>Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay silent! >>> >>>Wayne, this list is, and always has been, for the sharing of information. >>> >>>It's pretty safe to say for many of us, that the system you've cobbled >>>together sounds pretty fascinating. >>> >>>As for the skepticism that may have reared its head in several posts, >>>part of the cause goes to perceptions painted by your previous history >>>on this list, which may have caused your credibility to suffer. But >>>that was then. >>> >>>The other cause for skepticism is that you have presented this >>>information in a way that has not been felt as a sharing of >>>information, but more along the lines of "I know something that you >>>guys don't." If the message is being received and perceived >>>incorrectly, I'd say it was the messenger who is at fault. >>> >>>Obviously you have commendably put together something of considerable >>>value. And I, for one, appreciate that you have come to PO to make us >>>aware of this very interesting development. At the same time, nobody >>>can fault you for wanting to maintain your competitive advantage, >>>especially if there is no other way for you to capitalize on your >>>system (as in selling or licensing it). But forgive us if we ask >>>questions to fill the holes in the information you've teasingly >>>dangled in front of us. Perhaps, in the spirit of the list, you might >>>give us a summary of the progression of your system and its >>>parameters, and consider supplying some sourcing information if that >>>would not compromise your position. >>> >>>(And btw, I didn't take Walt's "unlimited" response as the negative >>>comment you apparently perceived it to be; I would have guessed the >>>same based on your description and the apparent scalability of your >>>cluster scheme). >>> >>>-- >>>Michael Vogel >>>Sir Speedy Printing >>>9 Research Drive >>>Milford, CT 06460 >>>tel 203-877-1231 >>>fax 203-878-2679 >>>mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com >>>www.eSirSpeedy.com >>>==================================== >>>Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to >>>criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. >>> ~Lord Bacon >>>_______________________________________________ >>>PrintOwners Discussion List >>>Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>>Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >>_______________________________________________ >>PrintOwners Discussion List >>Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >>__________ NOD32 2848 (20080204) Information __________ >> >>This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >>http://www.eset.com >> > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From tufelkinder at gmail.com Mon Feb 4 20:28:49 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Mon Feb 4 20:29:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802041728s53e34c72mdfee6b9ec40a7cca@mail.gmail.com> Wayne, What's the maximum printable size of your current setup? You mentioned earlier 8.5x14. Is that correct? Thanks, Walt -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From xeroid at kos.net Tue Feb 5 00:50:57 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Tue Feb 5 00:48:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com><84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com><98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com><25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM><200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> <84f70d5e0802041728s53e34c72mdfee6b9ec40a7cca@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: My current setup uses the smaller engines. So I do full colour envelopes up to 9 X 12 and common sheet sizes of 8.5 X 11 or 14. I run 100 lb Cover stock for business cards without a hitch. I also do a lot of panels 8.5 X 17 and assemble 3 together to make Restaurant Menus 25.5 X 17 or Posters of 17 by any length. For some reason I don't have a big call for 11X17 or to run two up to reduce click charges, however it would be the exact same setup to assemble an engine that is 18, 24 or any width I felt I needed. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > Wayne, > > What's the maximum printable size of your current setup? > You mentioned earlier 8.5x14. Is that correct? > > Thanks, > Walt > > -~ > > Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. > -- Bertrand Russell > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From k_graham at hotmail.com Tue Feb 5 01:41:39 2008 From: k_graham at hotmail.com (k_graham@hotmail.com) Date: Tue Feb 5 01:41:58 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com><84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com><98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com><25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM><200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: I thought the multiple printer software might be a problem but it seems there are some choices http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=610328. Useable with inkjet or laser as long as units are the same printer stream. Good to hear you are getting 100,000 copies toa printer. Can I assume that includes the print head or is it a warranty thing, send the printer back if the printhead goes before a year is up? Ken Graham CommunityPrinterscom Dawson Creek BC From xeroid at kos.net Tue Feb 5 08:06:38 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Tue Feb 5 08:04:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com><84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com><98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com><25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM><200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: Knowing that I will burn out a printer in the 100,000 range, I buy the extended warranty from the big box store ( my competitor ) for $10 and it guarantees a replacement for a NEW printer after the one year Manufacturer Warranty has expired. I've walked into the store with 4 or more printers at a time and have had them all replaced at no charge. I've done this several times now without a problem. I also buy the extended warranty again! The print heads have been very reliable and usually last the life of the machine, ( probably because I use them constantly ) when it doesn't, the manufacturer sends me a new head overnight under the first year warranty or I simply replace the entire machine in the second. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 1:41 AM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I thought the multiple printer software might be a problem but it seems > there are some choices > http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=610328. > > Useable with inkjet or laser as long as units are the same printer stream. > > Good to hear you are getting 100,000 copies toa printer. Can I assume that > includes the print head or is it a warranty thing, send the printer back > if the printhead goes before a year is up? > > Ken Graham > CommunityPrinterscom > Dawson Creek BC > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From John at mpcny.com Tue Feb 5 08:15:59 2008 From: John at mpcny.com (John Henry) Date: Tue Feb 5 08:16:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Limits New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <20080205004459.D4934DD24EC@rb.enter.net> References: <20080205004459.D4934DD24EC@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <01da01c867f9$40563bd0$c102b370$@com> Many things to over come. Just some thoughts on limits to the Wayne's system. Paper- not many types are inkjet compatible. Yes, you can print on them but you limit the quality. If you buy special paper your cost per sheet rockets. Hp new printer lays down its own coating to help with this. Paper feeding. You can only load small amounts in each unit. 2 sided printing is not automatic and not in register. Finishing you're very limited in when and how you varnish, fold, score and complete the order. Very manual operation, just to keep the whole thing running with paper in and out. Durability, what happens when you drop it in the mail or put a poster up outside? The inks used that are cheap are all water base, guess what happens when a drop of moisture hits it? Then think about what your post does to it? I am sure all this will be worked out in the next 5 years and will see this a unit in most print shops. I would look in the $10,000 + range. You have to remember the rip controller; feeder and booklet maker you will want will cost money. This will make the $300 print engine cost in that range. John M. Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company 125-129 East First Street Oswego, New York 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 Fax www.mpcny.com John@mpcny.com No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/1259 - Release Date: 2/4/2008 8:42 PM From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Tue Feb 5 08:57:10 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Tue Feb 5 08:57:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net><000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris><51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM><47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com><005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96><47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47A86B36.4000406@sugarloafprint.com> xeroid wrote: > > To answer Ron's question: > > Each print engine lasts about 100,000 prints, and is replaced by a new > one > at a cost of $49. The print engines I use include the print head and > feeder. > That's a cost of .00049 per print ... one half of 1/1000 of a penny. > The ink delivery system lasts about 4 years. There are no other machine > costs and the ink as you will see from another one of my posts is under > 1/1000 of a penny. > >>> If you don't want to answer that question, how much output can your >>> system handle in a month? >> But you still didn't answer my question. -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From borzou at falconprintandcopy.com Tue Feb 5 08:54:20 2008 From: borzou at falconprintandcopy.com (Borzou Azabdaftari) Date: Tue Feb 5 08:58:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: Scott, if you really want to sub this out, I'll do it for $400 on my 6060, and you'll get press quality. But I don't believe you really want to sub that out. Can we all stop with the questions about this. I've only been reading one out of ten, but its still really annoying. Xeroid isn't going slip and reveal some secret for anyone to make this in their basement, and frankly I'm still on the "if it sounds to good to be true" team. I'm not saying that I don't believe him (though I'm also not saying that I do), but it sounds like it takes a pretty significant amount of technical knowledge to do what he's done, and I think its highly unlike most of us would pull it off. If you insist on continuing to roast him about it please do it off list. I can't be the only one getting tired of this. Borzou Azabdaftari Falcon Print and Copy 1921 Gallows Road Suite 150 Vienna, VA 22182 t.703.442.0124 f.703.442.0134 borzou@falconprintandcopy.com On Feb 4, 2008, at 7:40 PM, Scott Cappel wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > So Wayne, um how do you handle coated stock. > > My client wants 500 of 4 (2000 total), 4/4 data sheets on 100# > gloss book for a trade show. > > can do? > > no smearing? > > S. > > > > > > At 03:57 PM 2/4/2008, you wrote: >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> My point in sharing and/or hinting around what I have created with >> inkjet technology some years ago and have been using successfully >> ever since was to convince print shop owners that inkjet is a >> growing concern today, and will be a reality in our businesses >> tomorrow. If you haven't recently picked up a small personal >> inkjet machine at your local big box store, I suggest you do so. >> The quality of prints today is top notch and the speeds keep >> increasing. The problem is the ink cartridge costs which you have >> to work around. When Memjet technology announced last year their >> invention will result in machines costing $300 that would print at >> speeds of 60 a minute and have the lowest ink costs we have ever >> seen, it didn't surprise me as I have been able to achieve this on >> my own. Sure I use multiple 18 ppm engines to bring up the speed >> to where I need it to be, but with the cost of $49 per engine, it >> didn't seem to be a barrier. "Feeding" these engines a continues >> supply of bulk ink brought my ink costs down to 1/1000 of a penny >> per copy. >> >> No more plates, no more colour separations, no more labour, no more >> click charges, positive customer feedback and wicked profit margins >> etc convinced me to dispose of both my laser and offset press >> immediately. And I did. >> >> Sure, I have a solid technical background, and there was some >> adjusting and tweaking at the beginning, but I have been using this >> technology exclusively for the past few years, every day for all my >> full colour offerings. It's not Rocket Science, it's just thinking >> a little out side the box. >> >> So back to my point, I'm convinced that with the new memjet >> technology you will find machines hitting the market this year if >> not next that will drive the price of colour to the 5 cent range. >> Memjet plans to expand this technology with increasing speeds that >> have the potential to replace web presses. What I have been doing >> for the past few years was great, but like all of you, I have the >> reality of decreasing profit margins on colour and it will continue >> to decrease dramatically while at the same time remove all barriers >> for anyone from a secretary in a office, to a computer literate >> teenager to compete against us. >> >> This is why I have begun a new study of digital multimedia signage >> as a new profit center for my business. Basically, a computer >> hooked to a large monitor placed in your customers store front >> window or inside that plays and promotes your customers products. >> I am at the stage of designing custom software for this project. I >> figure I can launch this at a $299 installation fee and ongoing >> rental of $49 per month. There is little competition and the cost >> to enter for the average business is much higher than what I have >> planned. It's a booming industry right now, suits the type of >> business we are in, and is profitable. More on this later! >> >> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >> xeroid@kos.net >> >> >> >> >> >> From: "Michael Vogel" >> To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > >> Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 5:48 PM >> Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >> >> >>> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >>> >>> On Feb 4, 2008 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: >>>> >>>> Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay >>>> silent! >>> >>> Wayne, this list is, and always has been, for the sharing of >>> information. >>> >>> It's pretty safe to say for many of us, that the system you've >>> cobbled >>> together sounds pretty fascinating. >>> >>> As for the skepticism that may have reared its head in several >>> posts, >>> part of the cause goes to perceptions painted by your previous >>> history >>> on this list, which may have caused your credibility to suffer. But >>> that was then. >>> >>> The other cause for skepticism is that you have presented this >>> information in a way that has not been felt as a sharing of >>> information, but more along the lines of "I know something that you >>> guys don't." If the message is being received and perceived >>> incorrectly, I'd say it was the messenger who is at fault. >>> >>> Obviously you have commendably put together something of >>> considerable >>> value. And I, for one, appreciate that you have come to PO to make >>> us >>> aware of this very interesting development. At the same time, nobody >>> can fault you for wanting to maintain your competitive advantage, >>> especially if there is no other way for you to capitalize on your >>> system (as in selling or licensing it). But forgive us if we ask >>> questions to fill the holes in the information you've teasingly >>> dangled in front of us. Perhaps, in the spirit of the list, you >>> might >>> give us a summary of the progression of your system and its >>> parameters, and consider supplying some sourcing information if that >>> would not compromise your position. >>> >>> (And btw, I didn't take Walt's "unlimited" response as the negative >>> comment you apparently perceived it to be; I would have guessed the >>> same based on your description and the apparent scalability of your >>> cluster scheme). >>> >>> -- >>> Michael Vogel >>> Sir Speedy Printing >>> 9 Research Drive >>> Milford, CT 06460 >>> tel 203-877-1231 >>> fax 203-878-2679 >>> mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com >>> www.eSirSpeedy.com >>> ==================================== >>> Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to >>> criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. >>> ~Lord Bacon >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> __________ NOD32 2848 (20080204) Information __________ >> >> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >> http://www.eset.com >> > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From QKCONSULT at aol.com Tue Feb 5 09:00:24 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:01:02 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? Message-ID: Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy quick and small commercial printers? Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily basis. Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From jeff at hprinting.biz Tue Feb 5 09:03:47 2008 From: jeff at hprinting.biz (Jeff Haines) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:03:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Glue Dots? Message-ID: <20080205140347.1499.1999@hm-pop1.solinus.com> I know in the past there was some discussion on glue dots. I can't seem to find the email anymore. I'm looking for information on a source others on the list used and liked to get them. Also any tricks we should be aware of for applying them. Thanks, Jeff Haines Printing Co. 10575 W. Main Rd. North East, PA 16428 (814) 725-1955 ? Fax (814) 725-2244 email: jeff@hprinting.biz ? www.hprinting.biz From kk1127 at mindspring.com Tue Feb 5 09:11:03 2008 From: kk1127 at mindspring.com (John Hughes) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:11:13 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Glue Dots? References: <20080205140347.1499.1999@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <01c201c86800$f1bd8fc0$0b01a8c0@NOTEBOOK> www.uline.com John Hughes Kwik Kopy Printing kk1127@mindspring.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Haines" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 9:03 AM Subject: [PrintOwners] Glue Dots? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I know in the past there was some discussion on glue dots. I can't seem to find the email anymore. I'm looking for information on a source others on the list used and liked to get them. Also any tricks we should be aware of for applying them. Thanks, Jeff Haines Printing Co. 10575 W. Main Rd. North East, PA 16428 (814) 725-1955 . Fax (814) 725-2244 email: jeff@hprinting.biz . www.hprinting.biz _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From tufelkinder at gmail.com Tue Feb 5 09:11:53 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:12:11 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Glue Dots? In-Reply-To: <20080205140347.1499.1999@hm-pop1.solinus.com> References: <20080205140347.1499.1999@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802050611xfba6bf9he363d48edf1880b1@mail.gmail.com> Hi Jeff, Quick archive search turned up this info... http://www.uline.com http://tinyurl.com/mlm3v Graphic Arts Equipment Company 65 E. Palatine Rd. Suite 203 Prospect Heights, IL 60070 http://www.gluedots.com Ellsworth Adhesives 800-888-0698 Made in New Berlin, WI I believe we get ours from uline. Thanks, Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net tufelkinder@gmail.com 800-955-3902 -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From smc at sorrentomesa.com Tue Feb 5 09:14:00 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:18:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200802051418.m15EISja022566@i2bnetworks.com> Kinkos and Staples - 1-2 Vistaprint, Mimeo, PrintingForLess - 0 -1 It all depends on who you are selling to and who is your target market. Corporate accounts or end users who buy their printing with their own money. The former aren't that interested, the latter will shop till they drop. S. At 06:00 AM 2/5/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and >other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, >VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious >competition to savvy >quick and small commercial printers? > >Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question >might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points >meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat >whatsoever, to 9-10 >points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on >almost a daily >basis. > >Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at >_browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. > > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. >(http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 >48) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2849 (20080205) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From jeff at hprinting.biz Tue Feb 5 09:19:16 2008 From: jeff at hprinting.biz (Jeff Haines) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:19:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Glue Dots? In-Reply-To: <01c201c86800$f1bd8fc0$0b01a8c0@NOTEBOOK> References: <20080205140347.1499.1999@hm-pop1.solinus.com> <01c201c86800$f1bd8fc0$0b01a8c0@NOTEBOOK> Message-ID: <20080205141914.4603.26897@hm-pop1.solinus.com> At 09:11 AM 2/5/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >www.uline.com > >John Hughes >Kwik Kopy Printing >kk1127@mindspring.com Thanks. I couldn't remember where I saw them. I now remember seeing them in the Uline catalog. Jeff Haines Printing Co. 10575 W. Main Rd. North East, PA 16428 (814) 725-1955 ? Fax (814) 725-2244 email: jeff@hprinting.biz ? www.hprinting.biz From ron at printingconcepts.com Tue Feb 5 09:28:08 2008 From: ron at printingconcepts.com (Ron Taggart) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:21:16 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Digital Envelope Addressing/Printing Message-ID: We are interested in setting up something to take care of our short run envelope addressing/and or printing. We want to keep these short runs off our Buskro Inkjet line. I have located an envelope feeder designed for laser printers, but I haven't decided on a laser printer (or should it be an ink jet of the type that Wayne is talking about?). Part of my criteria is that the device must exit the envelopes to the side so we can put a little conveyor to catch them. I don't want to have to have someone standing there catching every ten envelopes that come out. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Recipients of this E-mail should note that the quotations that appear below should not be construed as a personal message, nor are they in any manner a statement regarding the recipient's character, and are meant for the general edification of this writer's friends and correspondents. If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you. --Don Marquis People ask for criticism, but they only want praise. -- W. Somerset Maugham The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others. --Bertrand Russell Ron Taggart, President PRINTING CONCEPTS, INC. 4246 Hudson Drive Stow, Ohio 44224 330-572-8200 fax. 330-572-8201 www.printingconcepts.com ron@printingconcepts.com From bob at rjmprinting.com Tue Feb 5 09:27:44 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:27:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: All of them are about a 1. Some of our customers mention them but generally if the customer wants service they come to us. Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:00 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy quick and small commercial printers? Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily basis. Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp0030000 00025 48) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From bherion at bucksdigital.com Tue Feb 5 09:31:09 2008 From: bherion at bucksdigital.com (Bob Herion) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:31:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <20080205141212.6D22BDD4451@rb.enter.net> References: <20080205141212.6D22BDD4451@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20080205092150.031e8a78@bucksdigital.com> At 09:12 AM 2/5/2008, you wrote: >Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and >other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, >VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious >competition to savvy >quick and small commercial printers? I don't really think you need to clarify with the adjective "savvy". These companies are competition to each other. The Kinko's and Staples type stores are more interested in getting you into the store for other purchases. They pay low wages (equals inexperienced employees) and quite often are under a mandate of NO overtime. They turn away work that doesn't fit the model. The on-line are doing very well attracting the "I don't have a budget for that" crowd. So, both types of businesses are actually helping us. The big stores disappoint customers and all of mine have tried them at one time or another and the on-line have reduced our amount of high maintenance, low profit customers. Are they serious competition? Heck no! They are my partners! Bob Herion - Ask me about variable data printing on our iGen3's Bucks Digital Printing v.215.579.4200 f.215-579-9510 90 Walker Lane Newtown, PA 18940 www.bucksdigital.com From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Tue Feb 5 09:31:49 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:32:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Limits New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <01da01c867f9$40563bd0$c102b370$@com> References: <20080205004459.D4934DD24EC@rb.enter.net> <01da01c867f9$40563bd0$c102b370$@com> Message-ID: <47A87355.9000309@sugarloafprint.com> John Henry wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > Many things to over come. Just some thoughts on limits to the Wayne's > system. > > Paper- not many types are inkjet compatible. Yes, you can print on them but > you limit the quality. If you buy special paper your cost per sheet rockets. > Hp new printer lays down its own coating to help with this. > > Paper feeding. You can only load small amounts in each unit. > > 2 sided printing is not automatic and not in register. > > Finishing you're very limited in when and how you varnish, fold, score and > complete the order. > > Very manual operation, just to keep the whole thing running with paper in > and out. > > Durability, what happens when you drop it in the mail or put a poster up > outside? The inks used that are cheap are all water base, guess what happens > when a drop of moisture hits it? Then think about what your post does to it? > > I am sure all this will be worked out in the next 5 years and will see this > a unit in most print shops. I would look in the $10,000 + range. You have to > remember the rip controller; feeder and booklet maker you will want will > cost money. This will make the $300 print engine cost in that range. > > I agree, his type of operation will only work in a small setting. I don't think he can push out 80M per month, every month, with out hiring a gaggle of helpers. -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From xeroid at kos.net Tue Feb 5 09:33:33 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:34:26 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] [PrintOwners] Limits New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080205004459.D4934DD24EC@rb.enter.net> <01da01c867f9$40563bd0$c102b370$@com> Message-ID: <000c01c86804$16af1530$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> John, I'm not sure where you get your information from? It seems to come from the early days of inkjet technology. I always run ordinary papers, NCR carbonless, normal envelopes, 100lb plain card stocks etc without a problem and the prints are often better than offset according to customer feedback and I have to agree. The only time I must go to specially coated stock is when a customer requests glossy which will then increase the per impression price by 5-10 cents. Paper loading is limited to about 100 sheets per machine on the engines I use. This has never been an issue when using multiple engines. There are 2 sided automatic engines. Finishing is not a problem. The minuscule 1or 2 picoliter droplets of ink that is placed and absorbed into the paper fibres is less than any other ink system I know of and I have never had problems with any finishing operation. I can run a finished print under a tap of water and get NO run of the ink. I do not use the manufacturers ink. You really need to experiement on your own I think, before jumping to unfounded conclusions. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > Many things to over come. Just some thoughts on limits to the Wayne's > system. > > Paper- not many types are inkjet compatible. Yes, you can print on them > but > you limit the quality. If you buy special paper your cost per sheet > rockets. > Hp new printer lays down its own coating to help with this. > > Paper feeding. You can only load small amounts in each unit. > > 2 sided printing is not automatic and not in register. > > Finishing you're very limited in when and how you varnish, fold, score and > complete the order. > > Very manual operation, just to keep the whole thing running with paper in > and out. > > Durability, what happens when you drop it in the mail or put a poster up > outside? The inks used that are cheap are all water base, guess what > happens > when a drop of moisture hits it? Then think about what your post does to > it? > > I am sure all this will be worked out in the next 5 years and will see > this > a unit in most print shops. I would look in the $10,000 + range. You have > to > remember the rip controller; feeder and booklet maker you will want will > cost money. This will make the $300 print engine cost in that range. > > John M. Henry > Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company > 125-129 East First Street > Oswego, New York 13126 > (315) 343-3531 > (315) 343-3577 Fax > www.mpcny.com > John@mpcny.com > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/1259 - Release Date: 2/4/2008 > 8:42 PM > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From eric at digi-print.com Tue Feb 5 09:46:56 2008 From: eric at digi-print.com (Eric Weber) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:47:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Glue Dots? In-Reply-To: <20080205140347.1499.1999@hm-pop1.solinus.com> References: <20080205140347.1499.1999@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: At 9:03 AM -0500 2/5/08, Jeff Haines wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I know in the past there was some discussion on glue dots. I can't >seem to find the email anymore. I'm looking for information on a >source others on the list used and liked to get them. Also any >tricks we should be aware of for applying them. > >Thanks, > > Jeff > >Haines Printing Co. We use the high-tack, low-profile glue dots from Uline. We attach plastic cards to 60# offset and mail. There is no super-efficient method. Actually it's pretty slow, pretty manual. We charge 16 cents labor to apply each card. -- *********************************************************************** Eric Weber Sales / General Manager / Vice President PrintDigital Inc. 4688 Darrow Rd., Stow, OH 44224 330-686-5945 Fax 330-686-5329 www.digi-print.com eric@digi-print.com ***CONFIDENTIALITY NOTE: This e-mail and any attachments are confidential and may be protected by legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of this e-mail or any attachment is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us immediately by returning it to the sender and delete this copy from your system. Thank you for your co-operation. *********************************************************************** From xeroid at kos.net Tue Feb 5 09:48:27 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:48:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Limits New High Speed Ink Jet References: <20080205004459.D4934DD24EC@rb.enter.net><01da01c867f9$40563bd0$c102b370$@com> <47A87355.9000309@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <002101c86806$2b752890$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> 4,000 per day or 80,000 per month is nothing and is well suited for this inkjet setup. If your looking for an inkjet that is rated at 60 million impressions per month it is available right NOW ! Look at http://americanprinter.com/inkjet-wide-format/oce-jetstream-inkjet-presses-0122/ Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net > I agree, his type of operation will only work in a small setting. > I don't think he can push out 80M per month, every month, with out hiring > a gaggle of helpers. > > -- > Ron Sardo > Sugarloaf Print Shop > mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > www.sugarloafprint.com > 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From smc at sorrentomesa.com Tue Feb 5 09:45:40 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:50:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <000a01c86513$8daa6e80$6401a8c0@Chris> <51A25A7A3E1344DB8E2F1EDDB83FCB83@BEDROOM> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <200802051450.m15Eo8Hc028249@i2bnetworks.com> Sorry Borzou I should have myself more clear. We these print these kinds of things on a regular basis either on commercial press or on Bizhubs..both in the house. This was a hypothetical question for Wayne which he clearly indicated could be a limit on his production systems. We (like many others) print all kinds of coated sheet (gloss or matte) on varying stock weights for different clients (80# book to 130# cover) and it does seem that the coated sheets are going to be a limitation on this technology in the short run, in the long run like every technology, technical obstacles eventually are overcome. My client mix is on the other side of the spectrum from Wayne's, and I can see that his technology would not hold up in our environment. Mostly (at this point in time) I see this will work if you can run around in the back room feeding machines and patching sheets together, our efficiencies here would not allow anyone that kind of time. We need equipment that is more productive and reliable and can be operated by a trained employees rather than by technical wizards. I would venture the same is true for your business. That being said, Memjet technology is the future that will take its place along side Xerography and Offset Litho, and Letterpress to give us a mosaic of production methods. One other note Borzou, you are a relative newbie to this list. If it seems that others are grilling Wayne, you haven't been around these parts long enough to know why. I'm sorry you seem to be annoyed by others who question his methods, but frankly speaking, after his previous behavior on this list (before you were around) he does suffer from a credibility issue. When someone dangles a golden ring or a secret method and then plays coy, I think that is a red flag event and should generate a healthy level of scepticism. Success in this business comes from hard work and smart decisions, there is no free lunch, there is no golden ring. S. At 05:54 AM 2/5/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Scott, if you really want to sub this out, I'll do it for $400 on my >6060, and you'll get press quality. > >But I don't believe you really want to sub that out. Can we all stop >with the questions about this. I've only been reading one out of ten, >but its still really annoying. Xeroid isn't going slip and reveal >some secret for anyone to make this in their basement, and frankly I'm >still on the "if it sounds to good to be true" team. I'm not saying >that I don't believe him (though I'm also not saying that I do), but >it sounds like it takes a pretty significant amount of technical >knowledge to do what he's done, and I think its highly unlike most of >us would pull it off. If you insist on continuing to roast him about >it please do it off list. I can't be the only one getting tired of >this. > >Borzou Azabdaftari >Falcon Print and Copy >1921 Gallows Road >Suite 150 >Vienna, VA 22182 >t.703.442.0124 >f.703.442.0134 >borzou@falconprintandcopy.com > > > >On Feb 4, 2008, at 7:40 PM, Scott Cappel wrote: > >>***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> >>So Wayne, um how do you handle coated stock. >> >>My client wants 500 of 4 (2000 total), 4/4 data sheets on 100# >>gloss book for a trade show. >> >>can do? >> >>no smearing? >> >>S. >> >> >> >> >> >>At 03:57 PM 2/4/2008, you wrote: >>>***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >>> >>>My point in sharing and/or hinting around what I have created with >>>inkjet technology some years ago and have been using successfully >>>ever since was to convince print shop owners that inkjet is a >>>growing concern today, and will be a reality in our businesses >>>tomorrow. If you haven't recently picked up a small personal >>>inkjet machine at your local big box store, I suggest you do so. >>>The quality of prints today is top notch and the speeds keep >>>increasing. The problem is the ink cartridge costs which you have >>>to work around. When Memjet technology announced last year their >>>invention will result in machines costing $300 that would print at >>>speeds of 60 a minute and have the lowest ink costs we have ever >>>seen, it didn't surprise me as I have been able to achieve this on >>>my own. Sure I use multiple 18 ppm engines to bring up the speed >>>to where I need it to be, but with the cost of $49 per engine, it >>>didn't seem to be a barrier. "Feeding" these engines a continues >>>supply of bulk ink brought my ink costs down to 1/1000 of a penny >>>per copy. >>> >>>No more plates, no more colour separations, no more labour, no more >>>click charges, positive customer feedback and wicked profit margins >>>etc convinced me to dispose of both my laser and offset press >>>immediately. And I did. >>> >>>Sure, I have a solid technical background, and there was some >>>adjusting and tweaking at the beginning, but I have been using this >>>technology exclusively for the past few years, every day for all my >>>full colour offerings. It's not Rocket Science, it's just thinking >>>a little out side the box. >>> >>>So back to my point, I'm convinced that with the new memjet >>>technology you will find machines hitting the market this year if >>>not next that will drive the price of colour to the 5 cent range. >>>Memjet plans to expand this technology with increasing speeds that >>>have the potential to replace web presses. What I have been doing >>>for the past few years was great, but like all of you, I have the >>>reality of decreasing profit margins on colour and it will continue >>>to decrease dramatically while at the same time remove all barriers >>>for anyone from a secretary in a office, to a computer literate >>>teenager to compete against us. >>> >>>This is why I have begun a new study of digital multimedia signage >>>as a new profit center for my business. Basically, a computer >>>hooked to a large monitor placed in your customers store front >>>window or inside that plays and promotes your customers products. >>>I am at the stage of designing custom software for this project. I >>>figure I can launch this at a $299 installation fee and ongoing >>>rental of $49 per month. There is little competition and the cost >>>to enter for the average business is much higher than what I have >>>planned. It's a booming industry right now, suits the type of >>>business we are in, and is profitable. More on this later! >>> >>>Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >>>Kingston, Ontario, Canada >>>xeroid@kos.net >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>From: "Michael Vogel" >>>To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" >>> >>>Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 5:48 PM >>>Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet >>> >>> >>>>***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >>>> >>>>On Feb 4, 2008 4:42 PM, xeroid wrote: >>>>> >>>>>Comments like the one below make people like myself often stay >>>>>silent! >>>> >>>>Wayne, this list is, and always has been, for the sharing of >>>>information. >>>> >>>>It's pretty safe to say for many of us, that the system you've >>>>cobbled >>>>together sounds pretty fascinating. >>>> >>>>As for the skepticism that may have reared its head in several >>>>posts, >>>>part of the cause goes to perceptions painted by your previous >>>>history >>>>on this list, which may have caused your credibility to suffer. But >>>>that was then. >>>> >>>>The other cause for skepticism is that you have presented this >>>>information in a way that has not been felt as a sharing of >>>>information, but more along the lines of "I know something that you >>>>guys don't." If the message is being received and perceived >>>>incorrectly, I'd say it was the messenger who is at fault. >>>> >>>>Obviously you have commendably put together something of >>>>considerable >>>>value. And I, for one, appreciate that you have come to PO to make >>>>us >>>>aware of this very interesting development. At the same time, nobody >>>>can fault you for wanting to maintain your competitive advantage, >>>>especially if there is no other way for you to capitalize on your >>>>system (as in selling or licensing it). But forgive us if we ask >>>>questions to fill the holes in the information you've teasingly >>>>dangled in front of us. Perhaps, in the spirit of the list, you >>>>might >>>>give us a summary of the progression of your system and its >>>>parameters, and consider supplying some sourcing information if that >>>>would not compromise your position. >>>> >>>>(And btw, I didn't take Walt's "unlimited" response as the negative >>>>comment you apparently perceived it to be; I would have guessed the >>>>same based on your description and the apparent scalability of your >>>>cluster scheme). >>>> >>>>-- >>>>Michael Vogel >>>>Sir Speedy Printing >>>>9 Research Drive >>>>Milford, CT 06460 >>>>tel 203-877-1231 >>>>fax 203-878-2679 >>>>mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com >>>>www.eSirSpeedy.com >>>>==================================== >>>>Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to >>>>criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. >>>> ~Lord Bacon >>>>_______________________________________________ >>>>PrintOwners Discussion List >>>>Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>>>Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>PrintOwners Discussion List >>>Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>>Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >>> >>>__________ NOD32 2848 (20080204) Information __________ >>> >>>This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >>>http://www.eset.com >> >>_____________________________________________ >> >>Scott Cappel >> >>Sorrento Mesa Printing >>7398 Trade Street >>San Diego, CA 92121-2422 >>858-527-0800 >>858-527-1740 FAX >>http://www.sorrentomesa.com >> >>LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa >> >>Direct Links for Learning: >>http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html >>http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html >>http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html >> >>Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider >>Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider >>Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level >>Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider >> >>Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego >> >>_______________________________________________ >>PrintOwners Discussion List >>Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2849 (20080205) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From rstor at copycats.com Tue Feb 5 09:51:00 2008 From: rstor at copycats.com (Robert Stor) Date: Tue Feb 5 09:52:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47A877D4.8060606@copycats.com> John, To the degree that they run print volume that would go to another printer, they are all competition. Kinkos - 6 They are perceived by prospects as the place to get things done at the last minute, and often I sell against this perception. Staples - 2 Incompetent, but they may be moving up with their new initiative of print/copy standalone centers Mimeo 5 - I have not run up against prospects that use them, but they are in a lucrative market - multi-page digital work that I would like to have. Vista 1 - have not come up against them, I don't have a good feel for their niche. Regards, Bob Stor Copycats New York, NY 212-557-2111 x20 www.copycats.com QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and > other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, > VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy > quick and small commercial printers? > > Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question > might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points > meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 > points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily > basis. > > Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at > _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. > > > John Stewart > Q. P. Consulting, Inc. > Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > > 2110 S. Dairy Road > West Melbourne, FL 32904 > 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 > Cell: 321-794-6259 > _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) > "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > > **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. > (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 > 48) > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > From robin at protypeonline.com Tue Feb 5 10:14:02 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Tue Feb 5 10:14:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Glue Dots? Message-ID: <3E95BDF3-B8D4-4258-A3F4-C423761A7CA9@protypeonline.com> the manual hand applicator -- looks like a tape gun, makes application process quicker and easier. We bought the gun and the dots several years ago at Graph Expo....but not in the shop and I can't remember dealer name. Google glue dots? Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From tufelkinder at gmail.com Tue Feb 5 10:24:02 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Tue Feb 5 10:24:20 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Limits New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <47A87355.9000309@sugarloafprint.com> References: <20080205004459.D4934DD24EC@rb.enter.net> <01da01c867f9$40563bd0$c102b370$@com> <47A87355.9000309@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802050724j58576a94q7196d036e5b4d834@mail.gmail.com> 2008/2/5 Ron Sardo : > > I agree, his type of operation will only work in a small setting. > I don't think he can push out 80M per month, every month, with out > hiring a gaggle of helpers. Not to mention the inability to run 8.5x11 saddle-stitched booklets or gloss paper in any serious quantity and remain competitive on price. I don't know why this bugs me; guess I just get sick of hearing over-hyped "buzz" about vaporware products and am extra-suspicious of little leprechauns promising me the pot of gold at the end of the pretty rainbow that is the "next big thing." Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net tufelkinder@gmail.com 800-955-3902 -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From david.doost at gmail.com Tue Feb 5 10:27:40 2008 From: david.doost at gmail.com (David Doost) Date: Tue Feb 5 10:28:00 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47a88067.4201360a.1210.00c4@mx.google.com> VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. = 1-2 We are not after the same clients. Staples, Office Max... = 1-2 I'd like to give them a higher score just because they have attracted much of the nickel & dime business that used to drive us nuts. Kinko's - 5 I give them a 5 because we do a fair amount of manuals and I have to give their marketing department credit for hammering into the heads of clients that they are the #1 choice for this and other type of long run copy work. They have done a good job of establishing top of mind awareness for this despite all their other shortcomings. And God bless them they often refer work to us they can't handle so I feel it's the least I could do for them in return! David Doost Printing Impression Kennesaw, GA 30144 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 9:00 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy quick and small commercial printers? Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily basis. Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp0030000 00025 48) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From bob at rjmprinting.com Tue Feb 5 10:34:21 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Tue Feb 5 10:34:36 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] DVD/CD Printing Supply Contacts Message-ID: I have been asked for more information by several people. Below is a list of contacts that we use. I highly recommend each of them. For supplies: David Latiolais National Account Manager Data Memory Marketing, Inc. 950 Taylor Station Road Suite O Gahanna, Ohio 43230 Phone: 800-457-7484 Fax: 614-863-0622 david@data-memory.com Bob - we do not buy the cheapest CD's. We buy a good quality for a decent price. (This comment is from my wife, Sandy). For equipment, supplies and back-up printing and burning: Kevin is one of the most helpful guys you will find, he stands behind his products. Full Name: Kevin Gabrik Last Name: Gabrik First Name: Kevin Company: Techware Business: (952) 944-0083 E-mail: kevin@techwaredist.com E-mail Display As: Kevin Gabrik (kevin@techwaredist.com) For high volume CD's/DVD's and Packaging(this company has changed names so this may not be correct): Full Name: Tracy ReiderBower Last Name: ReiderBower First Name: Tracy Company: Digital Excellence E-mail: tracyr@digx.com E-mail Display As: Tracy ReiderBower (tracyr@digx.com) Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com From sgfinke at fuse.net Tue Feb 5 10:39:45 2008 From: sgfinke at fuse.net (Scott and Gail Finke) Date: Tue Feb 5 10:40:16 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: mimeo.com (was: Are these companies really your competitors?) In-Reply-To: <47A877D4.8060606@copycats.com> References: <47A877D4.8060606@copycats.com> Message-ID: We could all do that or something like it -- or most of us, anyway, who have a good internet site. The big thing is the computer interface, which I must say they have done very nicely. Check out the demo on the site, it looks so easy to use I want to use it myself. Making it easy for the customer to do business with you is the key. At first I wondered why the big corporations mentioned would use this place, but that's the answer -- they upload their documents, say what they want, and then have them delivered anywhere. The problem is dealing with the files. We all know that they don't go through so smoothly. We got one the other day from a client that, if printed, would have been three feet tall. I'm not sure how she managed that one... Hey, doesn't Chuck Pappas do this? Gail Finke - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road Cincinnati, OH 45231 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - (513) 522-2679 Fax 522-2692 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - info@brentwood-printing.com www.brentwood-printing.com On Feb 5, 2008, at 9:51 AM, Robert Stor wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > John, > > To the degree that they run print volume that would go to another > printer, they are all competition. > > Kinkos - 6 They are perceived by prospects as the place to get > things done at the last minute, and often I sell against this > perception. > Staples - 2 Incompetent, but they may be moving up with their new > initiative of print/copy standalone centers > Mimeo 5 - I have not run up against prospects that use them, but > they are in a lucrative market - multi-page digital work that I > would like to have. > Vista 1 - have not come up against them, I don't have a good feel > for their niche. > > Regards, > Bob Stor > Copycats > New York, NY > 212-557-2111 x20 > www.copycats.com > > QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: >> From dennisewing at satx.rr.com Tue Feb 5 10:45:16 2008 From: dennisewing at satx.rr.com (Dennis Ewing) Date: Tue Feb 5 10:43:36 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <47a88067.4201360a.1210.00c4@mx.google.com> References: <47a88067.4201360a.1210.00c4@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <47A8848C.9090807@satx.rr.com> I have lost a few to online printers. My biggest problem competitor is due to NAFTA. Being 3 hours from the border there are brokers soliciting work here and taking it over the border to print. I lost a top 5 customer to one last year and it hurt! Officemax and OfficeDepot seem to get a few of the bottom feeders, but the good customers once they try them or Kinko come back. I picked up a client once simply because he needed a report bound fast. The Kinkiod behind the counter refused to turn it in less than 24 hours despite the fact all they were doing was standing around talking. (his perception) I worry more about the economy and printing budgets being cut than I do the big boxes or online printers. Dennis W. Ewing Sr Ewing and Sons Printing 12000 Crownpoint, #130 San Antonio, TX 78233 dennisewing@satx.rr.com ewingandsons@satx.rr.com 210/650-5311 210/650-9916 Fax > > Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and > other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, > VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to > savvy > quick and small commercial printers? > > Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question > > might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points > meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to > 9-10 > points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a > daily > basis. > > Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private > at > _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. > > > John Stewart > Q. P. Consulting, Inc. > Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > > 2110 S. Dairy Road > West Melbourne, FL 32904 > 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 > Cell: 321-794-6259 > _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) > "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > From char at themasterspress.com Tue Feb 5 10:42:37 2008 From: char at themasterspress.com (Charlene Sims) Date: Tue Feb 5 10:44:03 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003b01c8680d$e32d27b0$0b01a8c0@CharXP> I guess I feel a little different than some here. I feel these companies are a threat. I feel like Kinko's is the biggest because they have the money to do the advertising. And I think advertising must work for them. It is not unusual even to have one of my friends who has their own company say "oh I just got that job done at Kinko's because I didn't want to bother you". This might be a $1000 job. I think the name Kinko's used to be more for the consumer but they are now going after larger corporate companies. I have a company next door to me for 15 years. They will not use me because they feel like Kinko's can do their work any time nite or day. When I ask how many times they use them after 5:00 and the answer is none. But they know they are there. Our prices are lower, our service is better, but they do a lot of copies of big manuals and feel more secure being able to go to Kinko's. So my opinion would be they are a 6-7 The rest would be 2-3 Charlene Sims The Master's Press, Inc 14550 Midway Road Dallas, Tx 75244 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 char@themasterspress.com www.themasterspress.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:00 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy quick and small commercial printers? Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily basis. Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp0030000 00025 48) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Tue Feb 5 11:19:39 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Tue Feb 5 11:19:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Limits New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <002101c86806$2b752890$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> References: <20080205004459.D4934DD24EC@rb.enter.net><01da01c867f9$40563bd0$c102b370$@com> <47A87355.9000309@sugarloafprint.com> <002101c86806$2b752890$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: <47A88C9B.4090304@sugarloafprint.com> How many hours a week is your company open? Wayne wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > 4,000 per day or 80,000 per month is nothing and is well suited for > this inkjet setup. > > If your looking for an inkjet that is rated at 60 million impressions > per month it is available right NOW ! > Look at > http://americanprinter.com/inkjet-wide-format/oce-jetstream-inkjet-presses-0122/ > > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > >> I agree, his type of operation will only work in a small setting. >> I don't think he can push out 80M per month, every month, with out >> hiring a gaggle of helpers. >> >> -- >> Ron Sardo >> Sugarloaf Print Shop >> mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com >> www.sugarloafprint.com >> 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From QKCONSULT at aol.com Tue Feb 5 11:54:05 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Tue Feb 5 11:54:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released Message-ID: The 2008-09 4C Practices & Pricing Study is now available for purchase from NAQP. You can go to _www.NAQP.com_ (http://www.NAQP.com) to place your order. NAQP/NAPL member price is $155; non-member price is $225. Those firms who participated in the original survey should expect to receive their copies via 1st Class mail this week. Approximately 315 companies participated and the margin of error was one of the best ever achieved. Despite some questions that required extensive detail on pricing of color copies and 4C process, the number of survey forms completed in their entirety was extremely high. This was especially true in the pricing matrices for color copying. The new study contains 32 different color copying pricing matrices - (16) for 8.5 x 11 color copies and (16) for 11 x 17 color copies. The matrices are further broken down by average and median pricing, as well as pricing provided by "profit leaders." Further breakouts analyze pricing differences, if any, broken down by various copier speeds, including pricing for copiers of 25 cpm and lower, 26-59 cpm and 60 cpm and higher. Other highlights or findings included in the study: Average Gross Sales of participants: $1,368,514 Average Sales Per Employee: $123,245 Average Profit Leader SPE: $140,018 34% of respondents reported annual sales between $500-999,999 18% of respondents reported annual sales between $1-1.5 Million 17% of respondents reported annual sales between $1.5 - 2.9 Million This study should prove to be a valuable resource for those companies who are either currently offering digital color copying and/or 4C offset printing, or who are thinking of expanding in these areas. Given the fact that both averages and medians are provided, readers should be able to quickly determine real-world pricing practices for a large variety of jobs in this industry. Also included are color copier ratings based upon both the copier & the service provided for these copiers. The study is packed with useful information pertaining to average and "profit leader" productivity including breakouts for DTP employees and press operators. Hourly press rates, wash-up charges and ratings of various presses used by survey participants will also be found in this newly released study. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From copythatnyc at aol.com Tue Feb 5 12:09:46 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (copythatnyc@aol.com) Date: Tue Feb 5 12:10:22 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CA36310AD04ED7-CA0-27CF@webmail-de07.sysops.aol.com> Rate it at 7-8 Tommy Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: QKCONSULT@aol.com To: printowners@printweb.org Sent: Tue, 5 Feb 2008 9:00 am Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy quick and small commercial printers? Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily basis. Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From mark at newprinting.com Tue Feb 5 12:40:15 2008 From: mark at newprinting.com (Mark Weinfurter) Date: Tue Feb 5 12:41:02 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <20080201172555.8B6EEDC5811@rb.enter.net> References: <20080201172555.8B6EEDC5811@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <3ff9521a7065ebaa416126ba9acc44ce@newprinting.com> If the Memjet does what it Wayne says they're going to do, I'd be very - very surprised that they or anyone would charge so little for their ink or ink jet cartridges - just to sell a $300 printer. In the corporate world, which they are definitely in, the person who would propose such a strategy would be laughed out of their job or the industry. Corporations are run by very smart business people. They're main responsibility is to make money. And the ink jet cartridges are cash cows. I could see a company charging half or maybe even 1/3, but ...why? Let's see how it proposing this strategy would go in a meeting: Hi Boss. I have this very high speed ink jet printer - the fastest and best quality ever. My strategy is to sell the main consumable for 99% less than the competition. We're going to sell our consumables for 1/1000th of a cent per copy. What idiots our competitors for charging so much. Man we're going to make a killing selling our printers for $300 each. Why would they leave so much profit on the table. The others have made hundreds of millions by virtually giving the printers away at cost or free just to get buyers for their ink. I'd be surprised if any ink jet manufacturer - including Memjet - would leave so much cash on the table - in the form of high priced ink or ink jet cartridges just to make $300 ink jet printers. Thanks, Mark Weinfurter N. E. W. Printing 1718 E. Wisconsin Ave. Appleton, WI 54911 1-888-563-0400 Fax 920-735-9945 www.newprinting.com mark@newprinting.com 'A very cool web site...www.newprinting.com' From ssheers at sheergraphics.com Tue Feb 5 12:40:07 2008 From: ssheers at sheergraphics.com (Simon Sheers) Date: Tue Feb 5 12:41:34 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released In-Reply-To: <20080205170003.AF699DD52A1@rb.enter.net> References: <20080205170003.AF699DD52A1@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <2fa9f5186b5473b7eb9879785760bdfd@sheergraphics.com> > The 2008-09 4C Practices & Pricing Study is now available...... That's great John, and thanks so much for your very valuable work. > Approximately 315 companies participated and the margin of error was > one of the best ever achieved. John, please explain how the margin of error is calculated. In a different question of survey accuracy, if survey participants closely align their prices with previous survey results, then how close is the survey to reflecting prices charged across the country by non-participants? There are more than 315 printing companies in the USA. Please reply to Simon Sheers at: Sheer Graphics Inc. 47 Chestnut Avenue, Westmont, IL 60559-1127 Tel: (630) 654-4422 Printing the message . . . and a whole lot more From brian at designotype.com Tue Feb 5 13:47:59 2008 From: brian at designotype.com (Brian Helminen) Date: Tue Feb 5 12:47:18 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? References: Message-ID: <004601c86827$a0fdcce0$0300a8c0@Brian> I don't think any of our top 10 customers use any of the internet based printers right now, but just knowing that they are there, ready and waiting to take some of our business is a little troubling. On the other end of our customer list (the small customer that makes up 20% of our business) I know that some of them are using internet ordering. Just yesterday, I quoted a sell sheet for a potential new customer and he told me he can order it online for about 1/2 or my price I would rate them just short of mid range of the threat scale, perhaps a 4 with that number increasing over the next few years. The only big box franchise we have in our area is Office Max and I know that some of our potential copy work and some printed stationery goes there, so I rate them at a 6. Our area is small, so we need to go after a variety of work and it's hard to specialize like you can in a large metropolitan area. Brian Helminen ----- Original Message ----- > VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy > quick and small commercial printers? > > Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the > question > might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points > meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to > 9-10 > points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a > daily > basis. From ssheers at sheergraphics.com Tue Feb 5 12:50:17 2008 From: ssheers at sheergraphics.com (Simon Sheers) Date: Tue Feb 5 12:51:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <20080205144734.74E5DDD47F2@rb.enter.net> References: <20080205144734.74E5DDD47F2@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: Kinkos = 2 Staples, Office Max, Office Depot = 1 Vistaprint =0 Mimeo = 0 Printing for Less = 0 Kinkos has presence and advertising. The others are just 'there'. Most of our customers are corporations who want professionalism, the few SOHO or amateur groups appreciate our skills, knowledge and service. (Besides, we'll happily meet the higher Kinko's prices!) Please reply to Simon Sheers at: Sheer Graphics Inc. 47 Chestnut Avenue, Westmont, IL 60559-1127 Tel: (630) 654-4422 Printing the message . . . and a whole lot more From smc at sorrentomesa.com Tue Feb 5 12:51:27 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Tue Feb 5 12:56:09 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <3ff9521a7065ebaa416126ba9acc44ce@newprinting.com> References: <20080201172555.8B6EEDC5811@rb.enter.net> <3ff9521a7065ebaa416126ba9acc44ce@newprinting.com> Message-ID: <200802051755.m15HttGY067925@i2bnetworks.com> A lot of time and R/D and research went into the Memjet technology. When it does come to market, I doubt the printers will be $300 maybe 10 or 100 times that. maybe 1000.... S. At 09:40 AM 2/5/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >If the Memjet does what it Wayne says they're going to do, I'd be >very - very surprised that they or anyone would charge so little for >their ink or ink jet cartridges - just to sell a $300 printer. In >the corporate world, which they are definitely in, the person who >would propose such a strategy would be laughed out of their job or >the industry. Corporations are run by very smart business >people. They're main responsibility is to make money. And the ink >jet cartridges are cash cows. I could see a company charging half >or maybe even 1/3, but ...why? > >Let's see how it proposing this strategy would go in a meeting: Hi >Boss. I have this very high speed ink jet printer - the fastest and >best quality ever. My strategy is to sell the main consumable for >99% less than the competition. We're going to sell our consumables >for 1/1000th of a cent per copy. What idiots our competitors for >charging so much. Man we're going to make a killing selling our >printers for $300 each. > >Why would they leave so much profit on the table. The others have >made hundreds of millions by virtually giving the printers away at >cost or free just to get buyers for their ink. > >I'd be surprised if any ink jet manufacturer - including Memjet - >would leave so much cash on the table - in the form of high priced >ink or ink jet cartridges just to make $300 ink jet printers. > >Thanks, > >Mark Weinfurter >N. E. W. Printing >1718 E. Wisconsin Ave. >Appleton, WI 54911 >1-888-563-0400 >Fax 920-735-9945 >www.newprinting.com >mark@newprinting.com >'A very cool web site...www.newprinting.com' > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2850 (20080205) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Tue Feb 5 13:53:56 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Tue Feb 5 13:54:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802051053q4077257drfd8a8fc295b1c7b4@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 5, 2008 8:54 AM, Borzou Azabdaftari wrote: > > Can we all stop > with the questions about this. I've only been reading one out of ten, > but its still really annoying. It is not a membership requirement, Borzou, that you read every post. Skip them if the tenor of the thread annoys you, as we all do with things that are not of interest. As I alluded to in an earlier post, and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that earned him a credibility handicap. But that doesn't disqualify him from having the possibility of ever having something pertinent to contribute. From all the questions and answers, we have learned a lot about his system and can deduce that it's not ready for prime time. But we've also been exposed to an up-and-coming technology that could be the "next wave" and my (our?) antennae have been alerted to watch for future developments. As unlikely as it seems that the big players would spend their R&D resources to develop low-cost equipment that uses low-cost consumables that will destroy their market for color, this bottom up trend *is* quite likely to erode more and more of our market, pushing us further and further up the ladder of profitable offerings and new revenue streams. All such conversations have merit. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From QKCONSULT at aol.com Tue Feb 5 13:53:21 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Tue Feb 5 13:54:32 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released Message-ID: In a message dated 2/5/2008 12:43:30 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, ssheers@sheergraphics.com writes: In a different question of survey accuracy, if survey participants closely align their prices with previous survey results, then how close is the survey to reflecting prices charged across the country by non-participants? There are more than 315 printing companies in the USA. Actually, the pricing matrices, the format used and the breakdown, have never before been attempted or published so there is no basis for comparison. The design of these pricing matrices (# of originals vs. quantity of each) while very detailed, will most likely serve more as a general guideline as to upper and lower limits for specific combinations involving anywhere from 1,000 copies to 25,000 or more. As to accuracy and margin of error, it doesn't take anywhere near 600, 1,000 or even 50% of the existing industry to arrive at very low margins of error. The margin of error for the overall study is 3.5%.... thus, at price point (say 1,000 copies of 10 different originals, 60#, 1-side) for a specific quantity the prices might range from $0.329 down to $0.300 per copy. The latter range depends upon whether you are looking at average, median, profit leader pricing. Margin of error calculations rely on calculating the standard deviation for a specific sample size and if the vast majority of answers fall into a narrow band or curve, it is pretty easy to extrapolate, especially if the test is repeated two or three different times with similarly small samples, that even if you were able to sample the entire universe of potential participants that final average might vary by no more or less than 1-2%! With a 3.5% margin of error, that means that we can state with a 95% degree of certainty that if we had actually surveyed the entire industry the actual range in prices might have varied from $.034 down to $0.289 for that specific orig. vs. quantity scenario! These matrices do nothing more than to provide a "good" or "gut feel" as to the types of real world pricing you might find out there in the market place for specific types of jobs. The prices noted certainly don't suggest these are the prices you should be charging, but rather what is being charged according to our participants. You can charge significantly higher than the prices noted and still get many of the jobs you quote. You can also charge well below the prices noted and still make a very good profit, assuming other variables such as monthly volume and meter clicks are properly accounted for. Is there a difference in pricing practices or tendencies between those who participate in surveys and those that don't? Certainly not that we've established. The only difference is some folks participate and others do not, but those that do are incredibly reflective of the industry at large in terms of annual sales, range of profitability and productivity ratios. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From jeff at hprinting.biz Tue Feb 5 14:12:35 2008 From: jeff at hprinting.biz (Jeff Haines) Date: Tue Feb 5 14:12:43 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4Over Message-ID: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> I see they now go after designers which I do not count as the trade. Beware as anyone can claim to be a designer and set up an account. This includes your customers as well as mine that started using them just recently. Jeff Haines Printing Co. 10575 W. Main Rd. North East, PA 16428 (814) 725-1955 ? Fax (814) 725-2244 email: jeff@hprinting.biz ? www.hprinting.biz From hal at pickimp.com Tue Feb 5 14:51:32 2008 From: hal at pickimp.com (Hal Wendt) Date: Tue Feb 5 14:48:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4Over References: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> Anyone can claim to be a printer or broker as well. And do. Hal From rstor at copycats.com Tue Feb 5 14:55:45 2008 From: rstor at copycats.com (Robert Stor) Date: Tue Feb 5 14:57:19 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> References: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is legal? Thanks, Bob Stor Copycats New York, NY 212-557-2111 x20 www.copycats.com From sos at olympus.net Tue Feb 5 15:00:54 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:01:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? References: <20080205144734.74E5DDD47F2@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <07c801c86831$d0e08380$6900a8c0@DANIEL> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From dave at landmarkimpressions.com Tue Feb 5 15:01:44 2008 From: dave at landmarkimpressions.com (Dave) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:01:20 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] roll lamination film supplier In-Reply-To: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: We have been having quality issues lately with our roll lamination film. Usually with lighter weights, we've experienced wrinkles, thin spots, etc. Does anyone have suppliers with good quality film? Thanks in advance. David Renna Landmark Impressions 35 Industrial Parkway Woburn, MA 01801 781-569-0297 www.landmarkimpressions.com From prtquick at eos.net Tue Feb 5 15:04:57 2008 From: prtquick at eos.net (Scott Finke) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:03:34 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> References: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> Message-ID: <511E1EF7-F4ED-4B7C-AA71-12BD1005900C@eos.net> Contact the Treasury. There are official guidelines for what you can & can't do. I know you have to change the scale. We did this years ago at a magazine I worked at, and we just asked the Gov'ment. Thanks! Scott Finke - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Visit our new location! Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road Cincinnati, Ohio 45231 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Phone: (513) 522.2679 Fax (513) 522.2692 Email: info@brentwood-printing.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - www.Brentwood-Printing.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Send us your file at: http://www.brentwood-printing.com/servicecenter/send_file.html - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Quick. Quality. Printing On Feb 5, 2008, at 2:55 PM, Robert Stor wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing > campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is > legal? > > Thanks, > Bob Stor > Copycats > New York, NY > 212-557-2111 x20 > www.copycats.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From sgfinke at fuse.net Tue Feb 5 15:04:10 2008 From: sgfinke at fuse.net (Scott and Gail Finke) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:04:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology In-Reply-To: <3ff9521a7065ebaa416126ba9acc44ce@newprinting.com> References: <20080201172555.8B6EEDC5811@rb.enter.net> <3ff9521a7065ebaa416126ba9acc44ce@newprinting.com> Message-ID: <6641994A-DD62-471E-8C03-2B2E2A5CFEAC@fuse.net> > On Feb 5, 2008, at 12:40 PM, Mark Weinfurter wrote: >> >> Let's see how it proposing this strategy would go in a meeting: >> Hi Boss. I have this very high speed ink jet printer - the >> fastest and best quality ever. My strategy is to sell the main >> consumable for 99% less than the competition. We're going to sell >> our consumables for 1/1000th of a cent per copy. What idiots our >> competitors for charging so much. Man we're going to make a >> killing selling our printers for $300 each. >> >> Why would they leave so much profit on the table. The others have >> made hundreds of millions by virtually giving the printers away at >> cost or free just to get buyers for their ink. >> >> I'd be surprised if any ink jet manufacturer - including Memjet - >> would leave so much cash on the table - in the form of high priced >> ink or ink jet cartridges just to make $300 ink jet printers. >> They don't have to sell them for that... they just have to find a price point that would make them money and take away our business. But I'm not sure that that would happen. For instance, I am a scrapbooker. Epson makes a 12 x 12-in photo inkjet printer that costs nearly $600 and uses 8 ink cartridges at $15 each. The info spec pages don't even give an estimated cost per page. Way too expensive for me, but lots of people who do this hobby spend tons of money on stickers, ribbons, and a bunch of other frou frou, not to mention the photos. I imagine that some come out about even by eliminating all those costs, and they can print the pages out any time. I doubt it's a big money maker for Epson, but it's a big enough market for them to make the stuff and buy advertising in every scrapbook magazine (there are at least six). The question is, is this kind of thing putting the photo labs and scrapbook stores out of business? It doesn't seem to, even though 4 x 6 photo printers are available everywhere for about $100. It seems that MORE people want to print their own photos, have them printed at labs, send them to special online photo spots (like VistaPrint is for us), put them on online "albums," buy the scrapbooking stuff, buy the magazines, buy the books, buy the photo software... Someday it will no longer be as popular a hobby, and then we'll see what equipment and companies stay in business. But in the meantime there seems to be an expanding market, despite these new products that would seem to be a danger to other parts of the industry. Gail Finke - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road Cincinnati, OH 45231 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - (513) 522-2679 Fax 522-2692 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - info@brentwood-printing.com www.brentwood-printing.com > From slb at inkspot.net Tue Feb 5 15:08:03 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:08:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> References: <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: <47A87BD3.9873.60B7E97@slb.inkspot.net> For the final word, call the U.S. Secret Service. The last time I did that, the rules for facsimiles of U.S. currency or stamps were: 1. it must be 75% size or smaller, or 150% size or larger 2. it must be in black ink on white paper 3. you must destroy all computer files, negatives, plates, etc., upon completing the project. (I used black on off-white, but green ink is definitely a no-no. We printed $1,000,000 bills with the company president's picture on them, for a sales convention. I remember feeling really odd about putting a $20 bill on a scanner and pushing the button, but, according to the Secret Service, it was completely legal...) At the time, I asked why, given those rules, I saw so many advertising pieces that used green ink. I was told that they don't consider it a high priority for enforcement, so it tends to build in a given market until they get a complaint, and then they go talk to all of the violators they can find. YMMV, Steve > > > We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing > campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is legal? > > Thanks, > Bob Stor > Copycats > New York, NY > 212-557-2111 x20 > www.copycats.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2850 (20080205) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From info at desktopsxm.com Tue Feb 5 15:10:14 2008 From: info at desktopsxm.com (Joel Brint) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:10:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> References: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> Message-ID: <0F90452E-7850-44C6-88AB-404BB03459A7@desktopsxm.com> I think it has to be 120% or 80% size of the original size. I stand to be corrected at that. Joel Brint Desktop Imaging St. Maarten Tel 542-4044 fax 543-1100 "The Printshop with a Difference" On Feb 5, 2008, at 3:55 PM, Robert Stor wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing > campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is > legal? > > Thanks, > Bob Stor > Copycats > New York, NY > 212-557-2111 x20 > www.copycats.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From info at aeroprinting.com Tue Feb 5 15:10:14 2008 From: info at aeroprinting.com (Carl Core) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:10:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] roll lamination film supplier References: Message-ID: <038b01c86833$20b73ec0$6501a8c0@aero> David: Check out AccuLamination, 1215 E. Lincoln, Royal Oak MI 48067 Ph. 248-582-8011 Carl Core, Jr. Aero Printing, Inc. 710 Elida Ave Delphos, OH 45833 Ph. 419-695-2931 Fax 419-695-9930 info@aeroprinting.com www.aeroprinting.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] roll lamination film supplier > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > We have been having quality issues lately with our roll lamination film. > Usually with lighter weights, we've experienced wrinkles, thin spots, > etc. > Does anyone have suppliers with good quality film? > Thanks in advance. > > David Renna > Landmark Impressions > 35 Industrial Parkway > Woburn, MA 01801 > 781-569-0297 > www.landmarkimpressions.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From ahavens at sbcglobal.net Tue Feb 5 15:11:55 2008 From: ahavens at sbcglobal.net (Havens Printing and Copy Shop) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:12:07 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology References: <20080201172555.8B6EEDC5811@rb.enter.net> <3ff9521a7065ebaa416126ba9acc44ce@newprinting.com> Message-ID: <003801c86833$5b437ef0$0301a8c0@Leah> I went to the Memjet site. As near as I can understand, the basic machine is not very expensive. Memjet, however, wants to partner with the Canons, HPs, etc and license them to put the engine in their boxes, add booklet makers, glass scanning, automatic document feeders, ad lib infinium, and retail it to you and me. It appears the technology is indeed there, it just needs to be packaged and marketed. Some brave soul will have to grab it by the horns and be the first to go with it. After that, competition should set the final price. Just a week before the Memjet thing hit the PO email system, I had downloaded material from RISO. Their have a HC Series of printers that use CMYK Oil-based pigment ink. They print from a stationary printing head that is as wide as the paper path. The paper is printed as it passes under the head. I know nothing about the quality, etc. of the system. I only point out that the Memjet type of technology is in existence and maybe we better keep an eye on its development. Remember, the Letterpress people jeered the Offset people, the Offset people didn't take too kindly to the Laser people and hopefully not too many of us Laser types get caught sitting around trying to dismiss the new kid on the block. Austin Havens, Owner Havens Printing & Copy Shop 200 N Main McPherson, KS 67460 620-241-5400 ahavens@sbcglobal.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Weinfurter" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 11:40 AM Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Technology > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > If the Memjet does what it Wayne says they're going to do, I'd be very - > very surprised that they or anyone would charge so little for their ink or > ink jet cartridges - just to sell a $300 printer. In the corporate world, > which they are definitely in, the person who would propose such a strategy > would be laughed out of their job or the industry. Corporations are run > by very smart business people. They're main responsibility is to make > money. And the ink jet cartridges are cash cows. I could see a company > charging half or maybe even 1/3, but ...why? > > Let's see how it proposing this strategy would go in a meeting: Hi Boss. > I have this very high speed ink jet printer - the fastest and best quality > ever. My strategy is to sell the main consumable for 99% less than the > competition. We're going to sell our consumables for 1/1000th of a cent > per copy. What idiots our competitors for charging so much. Man we're > going to make a killing selling our printers for $300 each. > > Why would they leave so much profit on the table. The others have made > hundreds of millions by virtually giving the printers away at cost or free > just to get buyers for their ink. > > I'd be surprised if any ink jet manufacturer - including Memjet - would > leave so much cash on the table - in the form of high priced ink or ink > jet cartridges just to make $300 ink jet printers. > > Thanks, > > Mark Weinfurter > N. E. W. Printing > 1718 E. Wisconsin Ave. > Appleton, WI 54911 > 1-888-563-0400 > Fax 920-735-9945 > www.newprinting.com > mark@newprinting.com > 'A very cool web site...www.newprinting.com' > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: > 269.19.20/1260 - Release Date: 2/5/2008 9:44 AM > > From davek at epgvl.com Tue Feb 5 15:01:29 2008 From: davek at epgvl.com (Dave Knapp) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:29:21 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> Message-ID: <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> http://www.secretservice.gov They know all about it. Please note new information: Dave Knapp Express Press 501B Richardson Street Simpsonville, SC 29681 864/757-9652 864/757-9654 Fax DaveK@epgvl.com www.epgvl.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Robert Stor Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 2:56 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is legal? Thanks, Bob Stor Copycats New York, NY 212-557-2111 x20 www.copycats.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From dominick at fmtc.com Tue Feb 5 15:34:18 2008 From: dominick at fmtc.com (Dominick's Printing) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:34:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Brighter Ink Message-ID: <47A8C84A.3080000@fmtc.com> Got a good customer that was sent a digital proof of his new designs. Approved colors etc. The digital had that "shine" to it like they all do. Wants to know why the finished one is not the same. Before I waste time inking up the press, will adding overprint varnish make the ink "shine" on the printed piece? Been so long, wanted to check. It is printed on Classic Linen Natural White 24#. Thanks Joe Dominick Dominick's Quality Printing 542 W. Idaho Avenue Ontario Oregon 97914 541.881.1121 Fax 541.881.1599 www.dominicksprinting.com dominick@fmtc.com Ontario's ONLY Authorized Adobe Service Provider Microsoft Publisher Files Welcome Here! From rstor at copycats.com Tue Feb 5 15:42:33 2008 From: rstor at copycats.com (Robert Stor) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:45:15 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> References: <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> Message-ID: <47A8CA39.3040000@copycats.com> Thanks all. The Secret Service was very helpful. This is the link: http://www.secretservice.gov/money_illustrations.shtml FYI, you can also print in B/W double-sided, the size restrictions apply as do the media destruction rules. Bob Stor Copycats New York, NY 212-557-2111 x20 www.copycats.com From villageprinting1 at aol.com Tue Feb 5 15:48:48 2008 From: villageprinting1 at aol.com (villageprinting1@aol.com) Date: Tue Feb 5 15:49:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> References: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> Message-ID: <8CA364FA41E8A83-E28-1313@FWM-M26.sysops.aol.com> There?must be?a minimum of 15% smaller or larger than the original. Tommy Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Robert Stor To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Tue, 5 Feb 2008 2:55 pm Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? ? We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is legal?? ? Thanks,? Bob Stor? Copycats? New York, NY? 212-557-2111 x20? www.copycats.com? _______________________________________________? PrintOwners Discussion List? Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org? Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners? ? ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From richard at sirspeedy-brickell.com Tue Feb 5 16:01:23 2008 From: richard at sirspeedy-brickell.com (Richard Moffat) Date: Tue Feb 5 16:01:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Brighter Ink In-Reply-To: <47A8C84A.3080000@fmtc.com> References: <47A8C84A.3080000@fmtc.com> Message-ID: Dominick, We use varnish all the time on uncoated papers, it will not add shine to the piece. We use varnish specially on solids so that it does not offset when cutting and in the case of business cards so that the back does not get dirty when people put the cards in their wallets. This will be a loss of time if you ink the press. Good luck. Richard Moffat Sir Speedy 244 S.W. 6th Street Miami, Florida 33130 (305) 285-1401 Tel (305) 285-1402 Fax richard@sirspeedy-brickell.com www.sirspeedy-brickell.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dominick's Printing Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:34 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] Brighter Ink ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Got a good customer that was sent a digital proof of his new designs. Approved colors etc. The digital had that "shine" to it like they all do. Wants to know why the finished one is not the same. Before I waste time inking up the press, will adding overprint varnish make the ink "shine" on the printed piece? Been so long, wanted to check. It is printed on Classic Linen Natural White 24#. Thanks Joe Dominick Dominick's Quality Printing 542 W. Idaho Avenue Ontario Oregon 97914 541.881.1121 Fax 541.881.1599 www.dominicksprinting.com dominick@fmtc.com Ontario's ONLY Authorized Adobe Service Provider Microsoft Publisher Files Welcome Here! _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From amanatranslation at yahoo.com Tue Feb 5 16:10:42 2008 From: amanatranslation at yahoo.com (nasr hussain) Date: Tue Feb 5 16:10:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Letterpress documentary In-Reply-To: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <384496.28664.qm@web31401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> A documentary about letterpresses http://youtube.com/watch?v=Iv69kB_e9KY Nasr Hussain Amana Graphics Hamtramck, MI ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ From printer at ptialaska.net Tue Feb 5 16:14:12 2008 From: printer at ptialaska.net (Charles A. Lincoln) Date: Tue Feb 5 16:14:25 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> References: <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> Message-ID: U.S. CurrencyThe Counterfeit Detection Act of 1992, Public Law 102-550, in Section 411 of Title 31 of the Code of Federal Regulations, permits color illustrations of U.S. currency provided: ? The illustration is of a size less than three-fourths or more than one and one-half, in linear dimension, of each part of the item illustrated ? The illustration is one-sided ? All negatives, plates, positives, digitized storage medium, graphic files, magnetic medium, optical storage devices, and any other thing used in the making of the illustration that contain an image of the illustration or any part thereof are destroyed and/or deleted or erased after their final use Other Obligations and Securities Photographic or other likenesses of other United States obligations and securities and foreign currencies are permissible for any non- fraudulent purpose, provided the items are reproduced in black and white and are less than three-quarters or greater than one-and-one- half times the size, in linear dimension, of any part of the original item being reproduced. Negatives and plates used in making the likenesses must be destroyed after their use for the purpose for which they were made. This policy permits the use of currency reproductions in commercial advertisements, provided they conform to the size and color restrictions. _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Charles Lincoln ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY 612 30th Avenue Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 (907) 451-1111 fax (907) 451-4511 _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ From scottv at regalpress.net Tue Feb 5 16:51:56 2008 From: scottv at regalpress.net (Scott Vicnaire) Date: Tue Feb 5 16:51:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Mitsubishi CP-50 Silvermaster platemaker Message-ID: <004801c86841$53fe5940$ab00a8c0@dimension4550> Hello, I have an old CP50 platemaker that I use a few times a year for certain jobs. It will run about 20-25 plates before the motor kicks out. If allowed to cool for an hour or so it will resume operation.My question is this. Does anyone have either an old machine they would part with, or know of a source to get another motor? TIA, Sincerely, Scott Vicnaire President Regal Printing & Graphics 140 South Main Street Brewer, ME 04412 207-989-4100 265 Water Street Ellsworth, ME 04605 207-667-5227 www.regalpress.net Member Ellsworth Area Chamber of Commerce Bucksport Area Chamber of Commerce From info at aeroprinting.com Tue Feb 5 16:51:44 2008 From: info at aeroprinting.com (Carl Core) Date: Tue Feb 5 16:51:58 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Brighter Ink References: <47A8C84A.3080000@fmtc.com> Message-ID: <03ba01c86841$4ca083d0$6501a8c0@aero> Good luck matching digital prints to offset. I've fought this for years. It's virtually impossible to lay down the color intensities of toner with standard air dry offset inks. The UV guys might not have these problems, but they ain't gonna run letterhead stock and envelopes either. (might be a good practical joke though, bring a pallet of #10's up to the Speedmaster- - pressroom would probably sound like a sailor's convention %&#**&%!!!! ) Back to your original varnish question, IF the job hairlined, and the art is not too complicated, (solid color, no gradients) it might be technically possible to get a little more shine on the ink, but it won't be that "laid down like asphalt" solid color look that the digital gives. It might please your client though. I've used van son's aquaflo varnish for this in the past. V2159. Get the press rollers clean enough to eat off of. Add an extra day for drying. Keep a log of what you did in case he reorders, etc. Hope this helps! David E Core Aero Printing, Inc. 710 Elida Ave Delphos, OH 45833 Ph. 419-695-2931 Fax 419-695-9930 info@aeroprinting.com www.aeroprinting.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dominick's Printing" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:34 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] Brighter Ink > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Got a good customer that was sent a digital proof of his new designs. > Approved colors etc. > > The digital had that "shine" to it like they all do. Wants to know why the > finished one is not the same. > > Before I waste time inking up the press, will adding overprint varnish > make the ink "shine" on the printed piece? Been so long, wanted to check. > > It is printed on Classic Linen Natural White 24#. > > Thanks > > Joe Dominick > > Dominick's Quality Printing > 542 W. Idaho Avenue > Ontario Oregon 97914 > 541.881.1121 > Fax 541.881.1599 > > www.dominicksprinting.com > dominick@fmtc.com > > Ontario's ONLY Authorized Adobe Service Provider > Microsoft Publisher Files Welcome Here! > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From brianoday at eprint.us Tue Feb 5 16:53:21 2008 From: brianoday at eprint.us (Brian O'Day) Date: Tue Feb 5 16:55:32 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> References: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> Message-ID: <00eb01c86841$8679c7b0$800101df@eprint.local> Years ago we had a customer talk us into printing the dollar bill black ink on green paper. We changed some wording changed the photo and printed it actual size. One week after we did the job a Secret Service agent in a trench coat showed up. He was VERY professional picked up the file, and all copies and gave me a stern warning and went to the customer picked up all of the printing we did for him. My suggestion would be to make sure you follow the rules carefully. The agents comment was that their job is to protect the US currency and they take that job very seriously. Brian O'Day ePrint 9970 SW Greenburg Rd Portland, Oregon brianoday@eprint.us 503-684-2679 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dave Knapp Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 12:01 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Printing money ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** http://www.secretservice.gov They know all about it. Please note new information: Dave Knapp Express Press 501B Richardson Street Simpsonville, SC 29681 864/757-9652 864/757-9654 Fax DaveK@epgvl.com www.epgvl.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Robert Stor Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 2:56 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is legal? Thanks, Bob Stor Copycats New York, NY 212-557-2111 x20 www.copycats.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From acepm2 at gmail.com Tue Feb 5 16:55:59 2008 From: acepm2 at gmail.com (Thom Gulyas) Date: Tue Feb 5 16:59:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4Over In-Reply-To: <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> References: <20080205191233.24706.28858@hm-pop1.solinus.com> <001101c86830$855c5980$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> Message-ID: .....zzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZING!!!! On Feb 5, 2008 2:51 PM, Hal Wendt wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Anyone can claim to be a printer or broker as well. > > And do. > > Hal -- Thom Gulyas ACE Printing & Mailing Berlin, Maryland 21811 www.acepm.com From bcreighton at danielsprinting.us Tue Feb 5 17:12:11 2008 From: bcreighton at danielsprinting.us (Bill Creighton) Date: Tue Feb 5 17:12:54 2008 Subject: SPAM-LOW: Re: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: References: <47A8BF41.1030303@copycats.com> <007901c86831$ea05e440$a5fea8c0@DAVE> <00eb01c86841$8679c7b0$800101df@eprint.local> Message-ID: <47A8DF3B.10206@danielsprinting.us> Greg: Why are your posts dated Jan 3st? Bill Greg Weinfurter wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I have a saying, "$20.00 will get you 20 years" > > Greg > > On Feb 5, 2008, at 3:53 PM, Brian O'Day wrote: > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Years ago we had a customer talk us into printing the dollar bill >> black ink >> on green paper. We changed some wording changed the photo and printed it >> actual size. One week after we did the job a Secret Service agent in a >> trench coat showed up. He was VERY professional picked up the file, >> and all >> copies and gave me a stern warning and went to the customer picked up >> all of >> the printing we did for him. My suggestion would be to make sure you >> follow >> the rules carefully. The agents comment was that their job is to >> protect the >> US currency and they take that job very seriously. >> >> Brian O'Day >> ePrint >> 9970 SW Greenburg Rd >> Portland, Oregon >> brianoday@eprint.us >> 503-684-2679 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dave Knapp >> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 12:01 PM >> To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' >> Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Printing money >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> http://www.secretservice.gov >> >> They know all about it. >> >> Please note new information: >> Dave Knapp >> Express Press >> 501B Richardson Street >> Simpsonville, SC 29681 >> 864/757-9652 >> 864/757-9654 Fax >> DaveK@epgvl.com >> www.epgvl.com >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Robert Stor >> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 2:56 PM >> To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >> Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> >> We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing >> campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is >> legal? >> >> Thanks, >> Bob Stor >> Copycats >> New York, NY >> 212-557-2111 x20 >> www.copycats.com >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Bill Creighton Daniels Printing 2141 Priest Bridge Drive #5 Crofton, MD 21114 301.261.3426 bcreighton@danielsprinting.us From jgross at techiowa.com Tue Feb 5 17:26:08 2008 From: jgross at techiowa.com (John Gross) Date: Tue Feb 5 17:26:30 2008 Subject: SPAM-LOW: Re: [PrintOwners] Printing money In-Reply-To: <47A8DF3B.10206@danielsprinting.us> Message-ID: <000f01c86846$1ec89380$6900000a@tech.local> Several years ago a drama student was making "stage" money on a self service copier. She had replaced the photo with Donald duck or something similar and copying at 100% on both sides. I scooped it all up, explained the rules and suggested that her instructor call me. I never heard back. Probably went to Kinkos up the street and finished the job. John A. Gross Technigraphics, Inc Iowa City, Iowa 52240 techiowa.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Bill Creighton Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 4:12 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: SPAM-LOW: Re: [PrintOwners] Printing money ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Greg: Why are your posts dated Jan 3st? Bill Greg Weinfurter wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I have a saying, "$20.00 will get you 20 years" > > Greg > > On Feb 5, 2008, at 3:53 PM, Brian O'Day wrote: > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Years ago we had a customer talk us into printing the dollar bill >> black ink >> on green paper. We changed some wording changed the photo and printed it >> actual size. One week after we did the job a Secret Service agent in a >> trench coat showed up. He was VERY professional picked up the file, >> and all >> copies and gave me a stern warning and went to the customer picked up >> all of >> the printing we did for him. My suggestion would be to make sure you >> follow >> the rules carefully. The agents comment was that their job is to >> protect the >> US currency and they take that job very seriously. >> >> Brian O'Day >> ePrint >> 9970 SW Greenburg Rd >> Portland, Oregon >> brianoday@eprint.us >> 503-684-2679 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dave Knapp >> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 12:01 PM >> To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' >> Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Printing money >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> http://www.secretservice.gov >> >> They know all about it. >> >> Please note new information: >> Dave Knapp >> Express Press >> 501B Richardson Street >> Simpsonville, SC 29681 >> 864/757-9652 >> 864/757-9654 Fax >> DaveK@epgvl.com >> www.epgvl.com >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Robert Stor >> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 2:56 PM >> To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >> Subject: [PrintOwners] Printing money >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> >> We just had a customer request to print "money" for a marketing >> campaign. Does anyone have (or can point to) guidelines of what is >> legal? >> >> Thanks, >> Bob Stor >> Copycats >> New York, NY >> 212-557-2111 x20 >> www.copycats.com >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Bill Creighton Daniels Printing 2141 Priest Bridge Drive #5 Crofton, MD 21114 301.261.3426 bcreighton@danielsprinting.us _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From printer at ptialaska.net Tue Feb 5 17:31:48 2008 From: printer at ptialaska.net (Charles A. Lincoln) Date: Tue Feb 5 17:32:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inkjet (new RISO) Message-ID: <5DC92026-2297-4EA0-88A9-96F785E58315@ptialaska.net> I demoed one of these units in Denver and while the speed was incredible, the quality was not that great. I think a person could tweak the file, slow down the machine and get acceptable quality. These units are inkjet and the tanks are huge. _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Charles Lincoln ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY 612 30th Avenue Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 (907) 451-1111 fax (907) 451-4511 _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ From ahavens at sbcglobal.net Tue Feb 5 18:31:22 2008 From: ahavens at sbcglobal.net (Havens Printing and Copy Shop) Date: Tue Feb 5 18:31:19 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inkjet (new RISO) References: <5DC92026-2297-4EA0-88A9-96F785E58315@ptialaska.net> Message-ID: <00da01c8684f$384b1950$0301a8c0@Leah> When you remember that the RISO started from the mimeograph family, this new machine is a welcome surprise. With a little time and some more ingenuity we may see a very competitive machine, quality wise. I'll be watching. Austin Havens, Owner Havens Printing & Copy Shop 200 N Main McPherson, KS 67460 620-241-5400 ahavens@sbcglobal.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles A. Lincoln" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 4:31 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] Inkjet (new RISO) > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I demoed one of these units in Denver and while the speed was incredible, > the quality was not that great. I think a person could tweak the file, > slow down the machine and get acceptable quality. These units are inkjet > and the tanks are huge. > > _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > > Charles Lincoln > ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY > 612 30th Avenue > Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 > (907) 451-1111 > fax (907) 451-4511 > > _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: > 269.19.20/1260 - Release Date: 2/5/2008 9:44 AM > > From sos at olympus.net Tue Feb 5 20:29:02 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Tue Feb 5 20:29:21 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Horse? References: <5DC92026-2297-4EA0-88A9-96F785E58315@ptialaska.net> Message-ID: <095601c8685f$a7b57cd0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> We just had a horse in the shop. Pretty small one, ok it was a pony, but still anyone else out there ever had a horse in their shop. A lady was making copies or something, and her daughter got to talking about her pony, and wanted to show us, so she went out to their van, not a horse trailer or anything, just a van, and got it out and lead it in. We've had birds flying around the shop, lots of dogs. We've had deer in the parking lot, and a sea otter that was a regular visitor for a while. We've had a lady swim up and stand at the counter in her scuba gear, dripping on the carpet, to order some rack cards for her guest house. We had a guy sail in once on a sail board with wheels. We had a customer drive up in an electric car and pull out a cord and plug in to recharge while she made some copies. We've had houses in the parking lot three times now. A moving company brings them in by barge, unloads them at high tide into our parking lot where they sit until 3:00 am or so when they take them to their new location. These are regular houses, 3 bedroom two bath,1200 to 1500 square foot houses. I can't help but think this is just kind of a unique community to try and do business in. Not to mention that far far far and away my biggest customer is an old retired guy named Ralph. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com Tue Feb 5 20:54:55 2008 From: mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com (Mitch Evans) Date: Tue Feb 5 20:54:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <07c801c86831$d0e08380$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From dvmonto at optonline.net Tue Feb 5 23:09:21 2008 From: dvmonto at optonline.net (David Monto) Date: Tue Feb 5 23:09:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 2/5/08 9:00 AM, "QKCONSULT@aol.com" wrote: > Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question > might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points > meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 > points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a > daily > basis. I would say individually they are not a real large threat. Staples, Office depot, etc - 2 Kinko's - 1 - None in my area but people still ask us if we are like Kinko's. Vista Print & other online printers - 5 I would say the threat is the COMBINED effect of all the mentioned firms. They all chip away at our customer base and help commoditize our industry. -- David V. Monto Sir Speedy Printing 1837 South Road Wappingers Falls, NY 12590 Phone:845-298-8898 Fax: 845-298-8537 email: dvmonto@optonline.net I am not bound to win, but I am bound to be true. I am not bound to succeed, but I am bound to live by the light that I have. I must stand with anybody that stands right, stand with him while he is right, and part with him when he goes wrong. - -- Abraham Lincoln From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Tue Feb 5 23:43:38 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Tue Feb 5 23:43:49 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> References: <07c801c86831$d0e08380$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802052043p1666c793p5ab2a5ef58755815@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 5, 2008 8:54 PM, Mitch Evans wrote: > > All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking > business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world We lost a regular color-postcard and mailing services job mid last year than had been worth an average of about $2500/month. Immediate turnaround had always been an important requirement. But not important enough, it seems, to keep them from saving 50% by going online and giving up a little of the handholding, consultation, file tweaking, design enhancements, variable printing, and almost instant turnaround that were regularly profferred and/or required. These companies need not be everything to everybody to qualify as significant competitive entities. The simple fact of their cumulative gross volumes makes them so by definition. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From jerry at swiftyprinting.com Wed Feb 6 09:16:15 2008 From: jerry at swiftyprinting.com (Jerry) Date: Wed Feb 6 09:24:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Office Supplies In-Reply-To: <20080206015457.B59DFDD7280@rb.enter.net> References: <20080206015457.B59DFDD7280@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <018701c868ca$d57f6e80$807e4b80$@com> We are looking into the possibility of adding the option to order office supplies through our website. Does anyone have a contact for a company that will wholesale products to individual companies to sell their office supply products. The process I'm thinking about is similair what Dscount Labels, Carlson Craft and others do. Any help will be appreciated. Jerry Mechell Swifty Printing & Graphics Arlington Texas 817-460-7562 jerry@swiftyprinting.com www.swiftyprinting.com Your print communication resource. From jgross at techiowa.com Wed Feb 6 10:09:27 2008 From: jgross at techiowa.com (John Gross) Date: Wed Feb 6 10:09:43 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Horse? In-Reply-To: <095601c8685f$a7b57cd0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <004c01c868d2$44532660$6900000a@tech.local> So how big is he? Ralph that is. I had a bad cold last week and was a little hoarse. Eight inches of snow this morning and still coming. Winter in Iowa can be interesting. John A. Gross Technigraphics, Inc Iowa City, Iowa 52240 techiowa.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 7:29 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] A Horse? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We just had a horse in the shop. Pretty small one, ok it was a pony, but still anyone else out there ever had a horse in their shop. A lady was making copies or something, and her daughter got to talking about her pony, and wanted to show us, so she went out to their van, not a horse trailer or anything, just a van, and got it out and lead it in. We've had birds flying around the shop, lots of dogs. We've had deer in the parking lot, and a sea otter that was a regular visitor for a while. We've had a lady swim up and stand at the counter in her scuba gear, dripping on the carpet, to order some rack cards for her guest house. We had a guy sail in once on a sail board with wheels. We had a customer drive up in an electric car and pull out a cord and plug in to recharge while she made some copies. We've had houses in the parking lot three times now. A moving company brings them in by barge, unloads them at high tide into our parking lot where they sit until 3:00 am or so when they take them to their new location. These are regular houses, 3 bedroom two bath,1200 to 1500 square foot houses. I can't help but think this is just kind of a unique community to try and do business in. Not to mention that far far far and away my biggest customer is an old retired guy named Ralph. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com Wed Feb 6 10:18:36 2008 From: gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com (Gordon Watt) Date: Wed Feb 6 10:16:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> References: <07c801c86831$d0e08380$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> Message-ID: <010001c868d3$8b7a5ee0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> Mitch Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up something like this? I would guess it must be significant. Gord Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From xeroid at kos.net Wed Feb 6 10:57:31 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Wed Feb 6 10:58:43 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? References: <07c801c86831$d0e08380$6900a8c0@DANIEL><003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> <010001c868d3$8b7a5ee0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> Message-ID: <002901c868d8$fbad4380$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. Please point us to this website ! Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon Watt" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:18 AM Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Mitch > > Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up > something like this? I would guess it must be significant. > > Gord Watt > Xoxo Cyberprint Inc > Toronto > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans > Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM > To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking > business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the > world > -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 > years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His > average > job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers > that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. > > One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made > him > join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in > business > with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. > > With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not > ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could > be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the > outset. > Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT > increasing. > > Mitch > > Mitch Evans > Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group > 168 E. Inlet Drive > Palm Beach, FL 33480 > 561-351-6950 phone > 561-845-7525 fax > www.mitchevansconsulting.com > www.the-nextlevelgroup.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford > Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Simon Sheers" >> Vistaprint =0 >> Mimeo = 0 >> Printing for Less = 0 > ====================== > > Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good > customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one > of > > those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. > Plus > the quality was perfect. > We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. > > You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. > > Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And > Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; > PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; > citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics > wgiprint.com; To name a few. > > I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that > these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than > you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 > and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled > binderies > that we little guys can only dream of. > > Dan Huntingford > SOS Printing > 2319 Washington Street > Port Townsend, WA 98368 > Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF > sos@olympus.net > (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From owner at latsons.com Wed Feb 6 11:06:47 2008 From: owner at latsons.com (Dick Latson) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:07:13 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ennis and Check Printing Message-ID: <200802061606.m16G6nQI049296@pro35.abac.com> We have been a top 100 customer with Ennis and have done business with them for over 20 years. Their Wolfe City Plant and the Imprint Division in Ft. Scott have been great to work with. But I have had it with the poor customer service, accounting issues and delayed productions of their Ennis, Tx. Custom plant where we get our checks printed, and am ready to fire them. I hate to loose all of the customer data on the reprints we send them and so I have been reluctant to switch, but the lousy service has now forced me to look for another vendor for our check business. I would appreciate any recomendations. -Dick Dick Latson Latson's Printing & Office Supply, Inc. 1105 Main Street / P.O. Box 701 Commerce, Texas 75428 (903) 886-2710 or Fax 886-7889 email: owner@latsons.com www.latsons.com From yaakov at sparkdirectny.com Wed Feb 6 11:09:20 2008 From: yaakov at sparkdirectny.com (Yaakov Reshef) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:10:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? Message-ID: I believe that in the past the internet printers as well as the superstores were a very small threat, may be 1-2...on a 1-10 scale. Today, they are attracting a much "higher" level of customers and are getting into "our" territory more and more. I believe that if we will continue to consider them as a minor, not serious threat, we will make a major mistake. Today, I will grade them in the 6-7 risk. With a new Staples"Print and Copy center " open recently one bloc away from me(I visited them few times already and "spied" to see the clientele, the jobs as well as the customer service) , and a kinko 3 blocs away,I know that with resources, they are making serious inroads. All this does not mean we should get scared and close our doors... We need to develop more ways to compete,and I am a great believer that as a group (NAQP) we can achieve more than individually. Let this be a challenge for the NAQP board ! Yaakov Reshef SPARK Direct * Kwik Kopy Printing Marketing * Printing * Solutions 7 East 37th Street-NYC-10016 Tel: 212-328-2001 Fax: 212-328-2007(new number) yaakov@Sparkdirectny.com www.sparkdirectny.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 9:00 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy quick and small commercial printers? Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily basis. Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003 000000025 48) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From char at themasterspress.com Wed Feb 6 11:13:34 2008 From: char at themasterspress.com (Charlene Sims) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:14:02 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again Message-ID: <006501c868db$416f5140$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Just got a copy of an invitation that a customer received to look at a new Riso HC5500 that they are claiming is the fastest ink jet sheet fed printer in the world. They are inviting churches from all over the city to view it and demo it. Right smack in the center of much of my market to my customers. I might go look at it with them just to see what is going on. ch Charlene Sims The Master's Press, Inc 14550 Midway Road Dallas, Tx 75244 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 char@themasterspress.com www.themasterspress.com From mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com Wed Feb 6 11:14:46 2008 From: mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com (Mitch Evans) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:14:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <010001c868d3$8b7a5ee0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> Message-ID: <003c01c868db$649a00c0$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> G Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Gordon Watt Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:19 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Mitch Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up something like this? I would guess it must be significant. Gord Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From char at themasterspress.com Wed Feb 6 11:16:18 2008 From: char at themasterspress.com (Charlene Sims) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:16:43 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> References: <07c801c86831$d0e08380$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <003e01c86863$456b73a0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> Message-ID: <006601c868db$a2e0ff00$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Mitch you must be a writer or something like that. Very well spoken. Exactly my thoughts that I could not quite get out there. I am very much experiencing this little chipping from a lot of those competitors. I am feeling it whether I want to admit it or not. Denial can sometimes be our biggest downfall. Thanks for your input. ch Charlene Sims The Master's Press, Inc 14550 Midway Road Dallas, Tx 75244 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 char@themasterspress.com www.themasterspress.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 7:55 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From david.doost at gmail.com Wed Feb 6 11:19:00 2008 From: david.doost at gmail.com (David Doost) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:23:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ennis and Check Printing In-Reply-To: <200802061606.m16G6nQI049296@pro35.abac.com> References: <200802061606.m16G6nQI049296@pro35.abac.com> Message-ID: <47a9defe.2686460a.2dbc.411c@mx.google.com> Dick, We use Unique Checks out of Houston -800-992-4437. Very nice folks and easy to deal with. David Doost Printing Impression Kennesaw, GA 30144 770-422-8766 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dick Latson Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 11:07 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Ennis and Check Printing ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We have been a top 100 customer with Ennis and have done business with them for over 20 years. Their Wolfe City Plant and the Imprint Division in Ft. Scott have been great to work with. But I have had it with the poor customer service, accounting issues and delayed productions of their Ennis, Tx. Custom plant where we get our checks printed, and am ready to fire them. I hate to loose all of the customer data on the reprints we send them and so I have been reluctant to switch, but the lousy service has now forced me to look for another vendor for our check business. I would appreciate any recomendations. -Dick Dick Latson Latson's Printing & Office Supply, Inc. 1105 Main Street / P.O. Box 701 Commerce, Texas 75428 (903) 886-2710 or Fax 886-7889 email: owner@latsons.com www.latsons.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From cpc at clearnet.net Wed Feb 6 11:42:03 2008 From: cpc at clearnet.net (Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc.) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:42:26 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Office Supplies In-Reply-To: <018701c868ca$d57f6e80$807e4b80$@com> References: <20080206015457.B59DFDD7280@rb.enter.net> <018701c868ca$d57f6e80$807e4b80$@com> Message-ID: <47A9E35B.2070804@clearnet.net> Hi Jerry, I believe I remember our office supply sales rep telling me about a program similar to what you describe. I believe some of his accounts have no brick, just click. I believe the orders go directly to them and they ship from whatever warehouse is closest to the customer. We use SPRichards http://www.sprichards.com and there product offering can be found here http://www.iteminfo.com My rep is due in here this afternoon and I will see what they offer and who you could contact. Randy Hurley Commercial Printing & Office Supply, Inc. 17 South Third Street P.O. Box 23 Clearfield, PA 16830 814-765-4731 Fax: 814-765-1380 cpc@clearnet.net Jerry wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >We are looking into the possibility of adding the option to order office >supplies through our website. Does anyone have a contact for a company that >will wholesale products to individual companies to sell their office supply >products. The process I'm thinking about is similair what Dscount Labels, >Carlson Craft and others do. Any help will be appreciated. > >Jerry Mechell >Swifty Printing & Graphics >Arlington Texas >817-460-7562 >jerry@swiftyprinting.com >www.swiftyprinting.com >Your print communication resource. > > From mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com Wed Feb 6 11:48:06 2008 From: mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com (Mitch Evans) Date: Wed Feb 6 11:48:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <010001c868d3$8b7a5ee0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> Message-ID: <004a01c868e0$0fbaea10$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> Gordon -- the cost can be pretty steep but its coming down as more of the websites are templated or have pre-designed functionality. The real costs though are the internet marketing costs -- my client spends about $30K to $40K per month although he started much lower. Initial web-site costs were about $50K and its regularly updated/changed -- pretty small investment when you see the results. The key is to have an easy user interface with automatic pricing. Keep it simple to use and navigate. You also need to staff CSR's as they have to handle the jobs and inquiries. My client says it much better and cost effective than hiring new salesmen. Plus it works 24/7 -- he is amazed at the number of orders that come in after hours and on weekends. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Gordon Watt Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:19 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Mitch Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up something like this? I would guess it must be significant. Gord Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com Wed Feb 6 12:13:30 2008 From: mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com (Mitch Evans) Date: Wed Feb 6 12:13:27 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really yourcompetitors? In-Reply-To: <002901c868d8$fbad4380$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: <004e01c868e3$98cc7460$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> Wayne -- client's web-site is www.printpelican.com Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Wayne Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:58 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really yourcompetitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. Please point us to this website ! Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon Watt" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:18 AM Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Mitch > > Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up > something like this? I would guess it must be significant. > > Gord Watt > Xoxo Cyberprint Inc > Toronto > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans > Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM > To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking > business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the > world > -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 > years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His > average > job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers > that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. > > One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made > him > join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in > business > with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. > > With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not > ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could > be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the > outset. > Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT > increasing. > > Mitch > > Mitch Evans > Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group > 168 E. Inlet Drive > Palm Beach, FL 33480 > 561-351-6950 phone > 561-845-7525 fax > www.mitchevansconsulting.com > www.the-nextlevelgroup.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford > Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Simon Sheers" >> Vistaprint =0 >> Mimeo = 0 >> Printing for Less = 0 > ====================== > > Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good > customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one > of > > those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. > Plus > the quality was perfect. > We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. > > You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. > > Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And > Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; > PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; > citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics > wgiprint.com; To name a few. > > I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that > these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than > you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 > and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled > binderies > that we little guys can only dream of. > > Dan Huntingford > SOS Printing > 2319 Washington Street > Port Townsend, WA 98368 > Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF > sos@olympus.net > (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From ahavens at sbcglobal.net Wed Feb 6 12:20:05 2008 From: ahavens at sbcglobal.net (Havens Printing and Copy Shop) Date: Wed Feb 6 12:19:58 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again References: <006501c868db$416f5140$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Message-ID: <007601c868e4$849c3100$0301a8c0@Leah> You Go, Lady and come back and let us know. Thanks, Austin Havens, Owner Havens Printing & Copy Shop 200 N Main McPherson, KS 67460 620-241-5400 ahavens@sbcglobal.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charlene Sims" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:13 AM Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Just got a copy of an invitation that a customer received to look at a new > Riso HC5500 that they are claiming is the fastest ink jet sheet fed > printer > in the world. They are inviting churches from all over the city to view > it > and demo it. Right smack in the center of much of my market to my > customers. I might go look at it with them just to see what is going on. > > ch > > Charlene Sims > > The Master's Press, Inc > 14550 Midway Road > Dallas, Tx 75244 > 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 > char@themasterspress.com > www.themasterspress.com > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/1262 - Release Date: 2/6/2008 > 9:13 AM > > From jodib at blackfoot.net Wed Feb 6 12:20:39 2008 From: jodib at blackfoot.net (Jodi Bowser) Date: Wed Feb 6 12:21:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] roll lamination film supplier References: Message-ID: <013601c868e4$98766fb0$0101a8c0@JodiPC> Dave: we've currently been using POPP Binding www.poppbinding.com 800-437-4787 (In North Dakota) and we've also worked with Southwest Plastic Binding 800-325-3628 (outside St. Louis, MO) who are you currently receiving your laminant from? Jodi Bowser Pyramid Printing - Missoula, Montana www.pyramidprintingmt.com jodib@blackfoot.net Member NAQP #205787 Member Garden City BNI 406-728-1503 fax 406-728-0505 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 1:01 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] roll lamination film supplier > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > We have been having quality issues lately with our roll lamination film. > Usually with lighter weights, we've experienced wrinkles, thin spots, > etc. > Does anyone have suppliers with good quality film? > Thanks in advance. > > David Renna > Landmark Impressions > 35 Industrial Parkway > Woburn, MA 01801 > 781-569-0297 > www.landmarkimpressions.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From xeroid at kos.net Wed Feb 6 12:59:29 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (Wayne) Date: Wed Feb 6 12:59:34 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies reallyyourcompetitors? References: <004e01c868e3$98cc7460$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> Message-ID: <003d01c868ea$052f48c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> WOW, they have to be getting Volume to sell at those prices! 500 full colour business cards for only $5.95 cents. No wonder we lose business to online printers. Wayne Stevenhaagen Kingston ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mitch Evans" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 12:13 PM Subject: RE: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies reallyyourcompetitors? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Wayne -- client's web-site is www.printpelican.com > > Mitch > > Mitch Evans > Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group > 168 E. Inlet Drive > Palm Beach, FL 33480 > 561-351-6950 phone > 561-845-7525 fax > www.mitchevansconsulting.com > www.the-nextlevelgroup.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Wayne > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:58 AM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really > yourcompetitors? > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 > years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His > average > job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers > that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. > > > Please point us to this website ! > > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gordon Watt" > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:18 AM > Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your > competitors? > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Mitch >> >> Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up >> something like this? I would guess it must be significant. >> >> Gord Watt >> Xoxo Cyberprint Inc >> Toronto >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans >> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM >> To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' >> Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking >> business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the >> world >> -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 >> years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His >> average >> job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with >> customers >> that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. >> >> One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made >> him >> join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in >> business >> with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. >> >> With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not >> ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they >> could >> be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the >> outset. >> Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT >> increasing. >> >> Mitch >> >> Mitch Evans >> Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group >> 168 E. Inlet Drive >> Palm Beach, FL 33480 >> 561-351-6950 phone >> 561-845-7525 fax >> www.mitchevansconsulting.com >> www.the-nextlevelgroup.com >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford >> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM >> To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >> Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Simon Sheers" >>> Vistaprint =0 >>> Mimeo = 0 >>> Printing for Less = 0 >> ====================== >> >> Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good >> customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one >> of >> >> those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. >> Plus >> the quality was perfect. >> We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. >> >> You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. >> >> Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And >> Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; >> PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; >> citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics >> wgiprint.com; To name a few. >> >> I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that >> these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality >> than >> you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch >> 8 >> and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled >> binderies >> that we little guys can only dream of. >> >> Dan Huntingford >> SOS Printing >> 2319 Washington Street >> Port Townsend, WA 98368 >> Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF >> sos@olympus.net >> (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From jim at visaliaidea.com Wed Feb 6 13:49:22 2008 From: jim at visaliaidea.com (James Laber) Date: Wed Feb 6 13:49:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <20080206164232.0ACFFDD96FD@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <01e801c868f0$fcf789e0$5501a7c0@visaliaidea.local> Interesting thread! I have copied the email received yesterday below as they are one of the internet sites mentioned. I will agree we have not seen the full extent to which this is going to ultimately impact our businesses. Most of these companies are larger concerns with deeper pockets who can also afford to invest now in the emerging technologies we are hoping will be the next profit centers in our businesses. Here locally the word on the street is Regency which changed its name to Celebration West and now is going by Navastar is buying large full color equipment and will be producing for the big boxes and I imagine their own internet direct sales. Jim Laber Idea! Printing & Graphics Inc 1921 E Main St Visalia CA 93292 559-733-4149 X118 Fax: 559-636-3690 jim@visaliaidea.com http://www.visaliaidea.com/ Subject: Make Money by Re-Selling Printed Products High quality printing at your fingertips It's FREE to sign up ($99 value, now FREE). . Fast, 3-day turnaround . Drop-shipping convenience . Plain, unbranded packaging . FREE priority shipping . Unlimited FREE image uploads . FREE product samples . Satisfaction guaranteed . Open for business 24/7 Join the VistaPrint Dealer Program today and re-sell high-quality printed products such as Business Cards . Brochures . Folders . Postcards . And more! . Business Cards, Brochures, Postcards, and More! Business Cards, Brochures, Postcards, and More! So, what are you waiting for? Join Today From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 6 13:49:23 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 6 13:54:07 2008 Subject: Strong Thoughts (was RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors?) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200802061853.m16Irq1q038162@i2bnetworks.com> I have some very strong thoughts about this (so what's new right?). T This is not a challenge for the NAQP board, this is a challenge for us as individuals. Think about it for a minute...What can the board of NAQP or anyone else do to change the situation. Make online internet portals raise their prices??? I don't think so. Mitch's client may have built a successful model that is profitable, and it offers the panacea that secretly most PrintOwners have lurking in their hearts... Never having to sell. But to sell at low prices, you have to ramp up volume and dramatically increase capacity to achieve the same profitability. More equipment, more employees, more plant, more debt...in other words...more risk. Given the choice of making 10% margin on $3,000,000 in sales or 30% on $1,000,000 in sales...I choose the latter, because the latter has less inherent risk. The secret to beating the internet priners, and Kinko's and Staple and all of the other perceived threats is the same as beating Walmart.... Service. You can out service all of these "threats" by just providing superior if not extraordinary service. Thats is something an internet printer will never be able to offer. You can't make the same kind of connection over the phone, that you can in person. Teach your reps (and yourself if that is the way you do things) to be invaluable. You'll never be able to woo the price buyers, so let them be. But you can proactively find the kind of clients you can connect with and become and invaluable partner with. I feel this way to my core. I wish others did as well. S. At 08:09 AM 2/6/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I believe that in the past the internet printers as well as the >superstores were a very small threat, may be 1-2...on a 1-10 scale. >Today, they are attracting a much "higher" level of customers and are >getting into "our" territory more and more. >I believe that if we will continue to consider them as a minor, not >serious threat, we will make a major mistake. >Today, I will grade them in the 6-7 risk. >With a new Staples"Print and Copy center " open recently one bloc away >from me(I visited them few times already and "spied" to see the >clientele, the jobs as well as the customer service) , and a kinko 3 >blocs away,I know that with resources, they are making serious inroads. >All this does not mean we should get scared and close our doors... >We need to develop more ways to compete,and I am a great believer that >as a group (NAQP) we can achieve more than individually. >Let this be a challenge for the NAQP board ! > >Yaakov Reshef >SPARK Direct * Kwik Kopy Printing >Marketing * Printing * Solutions > >7 East 37th Street-NYC-10016 >Tel: 212-328-2001 >Fax: 212-328-2007(new number) >yaakov@Sparkdirectny.com >www.sparkdirectny.com > > >-----Original Message----- >From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >[mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com >Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 9:00 AM >To: printowners@printweb.org >Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and > >other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, > >VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition >to savvy >quick and small commercial printers? > >Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the >question >might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points >meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, >to 9-10 >points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost >a daily >basis. > >Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob >private at >_browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. > > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. > >(http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003 >000000025 >48) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2853 (20080206) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 6 13:58:16 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 6 13:59:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Horse? In-Reply-To: <004c01c868d2$44532660$6900000a@tech.local> References: <095601c8685f$a7b57cd0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <47A9BCF8.2338.AF1F7E3@slb.inkspot.net> > Eight inches of snow this morning and still coming. Winter in Iowa can be > interesting. > Particularly in political season. First you get "snowed" by the candidates, then by Mother Nature.... Soon it will be summer, and RAGBRAI season... Steve Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From jgross at techiowa.com Wed Feb 6 14:15:16 2008 From: jgross at techiowa.com (John Gross) Date: Wed Feb 6 14:15:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Horse? In-Reply-To: <47A9BCF8.2338.AF1F7E3@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <00c001c868f4$9bc22500$6900000a@tech.local> Naah! We didn't get snowed at all by the candidates, it was a ball. We got to dance with everyone and decide who was quick on their feet, made a good impression and had a good grip. RAGBRAI is a fun bicycle trip. I'm just 20 minutes from the second last day of this week long eating and drinking adventure. C'mon over. John A. Gross Technigraphics, Inc Iowa City, Iowa 52240 techiowa.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Steve Blatman Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 12:58 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] A Horse? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > Eight inches of snow this morning and still coming. Winter in Iowa can be > interesting. > Particularly in political season. First you get "snowed" by the candidates, then by Mother Nature.... Soon it will be summer, and RAGBRAI season... Steve Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From jeff at hprinting.biz Wed Feb 6 14:25:40 2008 From: jeff at hprinting.biz (Jeff Haines) Date: Wed Feb 6 14:26:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over Message-ID: <20080206192536.14968.29446@hm-pop1.solinus.com> I will admit to using 4over for 4 color business cards. There color is terrible. We held off on printing a presentation folder so we could match to their business cards. The color is so terrible red that we can't even come close to matching. Now we'll see what customer service is really like. Jeff Haines Printing Co. 10575 W. Main Rd. North East, PA 16428 (814) 725-1955 ? Fax (814) 725-2244 email: jeff@hprinting.biz ? www.hprinting.biz From david.doost at gmail.com Wed Feb 6 14:48:37 2008 From: david.doost at gmail.com (David Doost) Date: Wed Feb 6 14:53:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <004a01c868e0$0fbaea10$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> References: <010001c868d3$8b7a5ee0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> <004a01c868e0$0fbaea10$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> Message-ID: <47aa1014.0f87460a.3276.ffffc4ca@mx.google.com> Here is one I hadn't seen/noticed before: A local printer called to get a quote on something they can't do in-house. I couldn't find his phone # so I googled it. The top link (a sponsored one) came back with Vista Print and this is the comment below the link: Save Time & Money Buying Online! Great Alternative to Local Printers I had always seen the various paid links related to printing companies but this is the first one I noticed that seems to go after the local printer. No they are not really my competitor either or sell to my primary target but I can see how and why they are and will continue to suck some of this type of business away over time. Don't know about your market but I am noticing that in my local market most of the garage printers/micro printers and most of the local wholesalers are gone or almost out the door and don't seem to be replaced. So in one way these guys and the other like-minded internet printers are helping thin out my market from the low-ballers. I guess I should send them a thank you card (an eCard, no less)! David Doost Printing Impression 1200 Barrett Parkway Suite 4 Kennesaw, GA 30144 770-422-8766 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 11:48 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Gordon -- the cost can be pretty steep but its coming down as more of the websites are templated or have pre-designed functionality. The real costs though are the internet marketing costs -- my client spends about $30K to $40K per month although he started much lower. Initial web-site costs were about $50K and its regularly updated/changed -- pretty small investment when you see the results. The key is to have an easy user interface with automatic pricing. Keep it simple to use and navigate. You also need to staff CSR's as they have to handle the jobs and inquiries. My client says it much better and cost effective than hiring new salesmen. Plus it works 24/7 -- he is amazed at the number of orders that come in after hours and on weekends. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Gordon Watt Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:19 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Mitch Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up something like this? I would guess it must be significant. Gord Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com Wed Feb 6 15:03:33 2008 From: gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com (Gordon Watt) Date: Wed Feb 6 15:01:48 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <004a01c868e0$0fbaea10$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> References: <010001c868d3$8b7a5ee0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> <004a01c868e0$0fbaea10$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> Message-ID: <016301c868fb$59d9dff0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> Mitch Thanks for the information. Interestingly I see that Pelicanprint is here in Toronto. I'm sure that it cost them to get where they, are and to get it right. So many details and so many opportunities to get it wrong. I'm guessing their margins aren't all that bad. I'll bet that many, or most, people end up paying for add-ons just the same way you do when you buy a car. Gordon Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 11:48 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Gordon -- the cost can be pretty steep but its coming down as more of the websites are templated or have pre-designed functionality. The real costs though are the internet marketing costs -- my client spends about $30K to $40K per month although he started much lower. Initial web-site costs were about $50K and its regularly updated/changed -- pretty small investment when you see the results. The key is to have an easy user interface with automatic pricing. Keep it simple to use and navigate. You also need to staff CSR's as they have to handle the jobs and inquiries. My client says it much better and cost effective than hiring new salesmen. Plus it works 24/7 -- he is amazed at the number of orders that come in after hours and on weekends. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Gordon Watt Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:19 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Mitch Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up something like this? I would guess it must be significant. Gord Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From kathy at mpcny.com Wed Feb 6 15:10:20 2008 From: kathy at mpcny.com (Kathy Henry) Date: Wed Feb 6 15:10:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL In-Reply-To: <20080206192536.14968.29446@hm-pop1.solinus.com> References: <20080206192536.14968.29446@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <00b101c868fc$4cc22ba0$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> I am in the throws of the hell of customer service with 4over today. Our problem was that the posters we needed were larger than our press and needed UV coating. File was sent last Friday. Said that we needed delivery by Wednesday (today) and they said, no problem. We have called every day to check on the status as customer needed these for a show on Friday. "NO PROBLEM, EVERYTHING IS FINE", they said each day. My designer called them today to find out where there were. They had no clue. We received an e-mail from them this afternoon saying they would ship tomorrow. We called them again, and were told they didn't know where they were, they were sorry, there is nothing they could do. My designer refused to hang up until they told her where the order was. They told her they would call us back, she said no, she told them she would call every 5 minutes until they told us where they were. Finally, after no resolution, John got involved, they apologized, said they will print today and ship tomorrow to get them to us by Friday at their shipping expense. When you worry about companies like this, remember they are giving worse service to our customers. Our file was perfect, it was pre-paid with a credit card, and there was guaranteed service. What good is a guarantee when the job is not delivered when you need it? Nothing. To echo Scott, nothing beats customer service, and as long as the 4overs of the world are out there trying to provide it, we have got them hands down. Kathleen Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing kathy@mpcny.com "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding 125 East First Street PO Box 815 Oswego, NY 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 (fax) (315) 532-0943 (cell) -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Haines Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 2:26 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I will admit to using 4over for 4 color business cards. There color is terrible. We held off on printing a presentation folder so we could match to their business cards. The color is so terrible red that we can't even come close to matching. Now we'll see what customer service is really like. Jeff Haines Printing Co. 10575 W. Main Rd. North East, PA 16428 (814) 725-1955 ? Fax (814) 725-2244 email: jeff@hprinting.biz ? www.hprinting.biz _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/1261 - Release Date: 2/5/2008 8:57 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/1261 - Release Date: 2/5/2008 8:57 PM From hal at pickimp.com Wed Feb 6 15:21:51 2008 From: hal at pickimp.com (Hal Wendt) Date: Wed Feb 6 15:18:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over References: <20080206192536.14968.29446@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <002a01c868fd$eb0447c0$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> We've had nothing but good experience with GotPrint.com, shipping time from California to Michigan sucks. Reprints match every time too. Hal From Printernot at aol.com Wed Feb 6 15:24:42 2008 From: Printernot at aol.com (Printernot@aol.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 15:25:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet Message-ID: In a message dated 2/5/2008 11:55:34 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com writes: As I alluded to in an earlier post, and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that earned him a credibility handicap. What is his past? I've been on this list for many years and don't recall him doing anything different than what he's doing now. He operates in an unconventional manner. Some people insisted he couldn't possibly be doing what he claimed to be doing. Some claimed he was so inept he would be out of business in no time. Obviously he's still operating and still do things unconventionally. Sounds just like my neighbor who operates a copier repair business from his garage. Don Byers Colorado Springs, CO **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From QKCONSULT at aol.com Wed Feb 6 15:24:32 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 15:25:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL Message-ID: In a message dated 2/6/2008 3:12:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kathy@mpcny.com writes: When you worry about companies like this, remember they are giving worse service to our customers. Our file was perfect, it was pre-paid with a credit card, and there was guaranteed service. What good is a guarantee when the job is not delivered when you need it? Nothing. To echo Scott, nothing beats customer service, and as long as the 4overs of the world are out there trying to provide it, we have got them hands down. Just curious as to whether anyone on the list has had similar problems with a company called Growll.com. As you recall, I wrote a column last September titled, "Can you compete against Internet printers? You Betcha!" In the article I outlined my personal experiences in getting a simple job printed and the nightmares and lies I had to put up with. Of course the VP of Sales for Growll wrote a letter to Quick Printing magazine complaining about my article (they are an advertiser). The magazine wanted me to write a rebuttal letter but I refused, instead choosing to let my article stand as is. Anyway, I would be very interested if anyone on the list has had problems similar to Kathy regarding delays or excuses in getting simple jobs done. Write me privately if you want. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From mail at myprinter.biz Wed Feb 6 15:41:49 2008 From: mail at myprinter.biz (mail@myprinter.biz) Date: Wed Feb 6 15:43:12 2008 Subject: Strong Thoughts (was RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companiesreally your competitors?) In-Reply-To: <200802061853.m16Irq1q038162@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: Scott - Every now and then, having somebody smack me up side the head with the obvious is very helpful - to me anyway. Thanks for reminding me. Please do it again soon. Dan Sir Speedy Printing Center 5845 Hollywood Boulevard Hollywood, FL 33021 tel. 954.962.1309 fax 954.962.1366 dan@myprinter.biz www.myprinter.biz -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org]On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 1:49 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Strong Thoughts (was RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companiesreally your competitors?) ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I have some very strong thoughts about this (so what's new right?). T This is not a challenge for the NAQP board, this is a challenge for us as individuals. Think about it for a minute...What can the board of NAQP or anyone else do to change the situation. Make online internet portals raise their prices??? I don't think so. Mitch's client may have built a successful model that is profitable, and it offers the panacea that secretly most PrintOwners have lurking in their hearts... Never having to sell. But to sell at low prices, you have to ramp up volume and dramatically increase capacity to achieve the same profitability. More equipment, more employees, more plant, more debt...in other words...more risk. Given the choice of making 10% margin on $3,000,000 in sales or 30% on $1,000,000 in sales...I choose the latter, because the latter has less inherent risk. The secret to beating the internet priners, and Kinko's and Staple and all of the other perceived threats is the same as beating Walmart.... Service. You can out service all of these "threats" by just providing superior if not extraordinary service. Thats is something an internet printer will never be able to offer. You can't make the same kind of connection over the phone, that you can in person. Teach your reps (and yourself if that is the way you do things) to be invaluable. You'll never be able to woo the price buyers, so let them be. But you can proactively find the kind of clients you can connect with and become and invaluable partner with. I feel this way to my core. I wish others did as well. S. At 08:09 AM 2/6/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I believe that in the past the internet printers as well as the >superstores were a very small threat, may be 1-2...on a 1-10 scale. >Today, they are attracting a much "higher" level of customers and are >getting into "our" territory more and more. >I believe that if we will continue to consider them as a minor, not >serious threat, we will make a major mistake. >Today, I will grade them in the 6-7 risk. >With a new Staples"Print and Copy center " open recently one bloc away >from me(I visited them few times already and "spied" to see the >clientele, the jobs as well as the customer service) , and a kinko 3 >blocs away,I know that with resources, they are making serious inroads. >All this does not mean we should get scared and close our doors... >We need to develop more ways to compete,and I am a great believer that >as a group (NAQP) we can achieve more than individually. >Let this be a challenge for the NAQP board ! > >Yaakov Reshef >SPARK Direct * Kwik Kopy Printing >Marketing * Printing * Solutions > >7 East 37th Street-NYC-10016 >Tel: 212-328-2001 >Fax: 212-328-2007(new number) >yaakov@Sparkdirectny.com >www.sparkdirectny.com > > >-----Original Message----- >From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >[mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com >Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 9:00 AM >To: printowners@printweb.org >Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and > >other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, > >VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition >to savvy >quick and small commercial printers? > >Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the >question >might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points >meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, >to 9-10 >points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost >a daily >basis. > >Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob >private at >_browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. > > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. > >(http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003 >000000025 >48) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2853 (20080206) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From acepm2 at gmail.com Wed Feb 6 15:59:09 2008 From: acepm2 at gmail.com (Thom Gulyas) Date: Wed Feb 6 15:59:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: John, I just went to their website. Knowing how you feel about animals in the workplace, I'm surprised you used a service with a DOG on the opening/home page!! :) :) :) Thom Gulyas ACE Printing & Mailing www.acepm.com On Feb 6, 2008 3:24 PM, wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > In a message dated 2/6/2008 3:12:06 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > kathy@mpcny.com writes: > > When you worry about companies like this, remember they are giving worse > service to our customers. Our file was perfect, it was pre-paid with a > credit card, and there was guaranteed service. What good is a guarantee when > the job is not delivered when you need it? Nothing. > > To echo Scott, nothing beats customer service, and as long as the 4overs of > the world are out there trying to provide it, we have got them hands down. > > > > Just curious as to whether anyone on the list has had similar problems with > a company called Growll.com. > > As you recall, I wrote a column last September titled, "Can you compete > against Internet printers? You Betcha!" In the article I outlined my personal > experiences in getting a simple job printed and the nightmares and lies I had to > put up with. Of course the VP of Sales for Growll wrote a letter to Quick > Printing magazine complaining about my article (they are an advertiser). The > magazine wanted me to write a rebuttal letter but I refused, instead choosing to > let my article stand as is. > > Anyway, I would be very interested if anyone on the list has had problems > similar to Kathy regarding delays or excuses in getting simple jobs done. Write > me privately if you want. > > > John Stewart > Q. P. Consulting, Inc. > Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > > 2110 S. Dairy Road > West Melbourne, FL 32904 > 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 > Cell: 321-794-6259 > _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) > "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > > **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. > (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 > 48) > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Thom Gulyas ACE Printing & Mailing Berlin, Maryland 21811 www.acepm.com From greg at pressexpress.org Wed Feb 6 16:11:23 2008 From: greg at pressexpress.org (Greg Weinfurter) Date: Wed Feb 6 16:11:39 2008 Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies reallyyourcompetitors? In-Reply-To: <003d01c868ea$052f48c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> References: <004e01c868e3$98cc7460$a200a8c0@Y765TJ> <003d01c868ea$052f48c0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> Message-ID: There was once a local bank that advertised that they would make change for a dollar any way you liked it. You want four quarters, fine, you want ten dimes, fine, you want two quarters and five dimes, fine. How do they do that and stay in business? Volume! Greg On Feb 6, 2008, at 11:59 AM, Wayne wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > WOW, they have to be getting Volume to sell at those prices! > 500 full colour business cards for only $5.95 cents. No wonder we > lose business to online printers. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen > Kingston > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mitch Evans" > > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 12:13 PM > Subject: RE: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies > reallyyourcompetitors? > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Wayne -- client's web-site is www.printpelican.com >> >> Mitch >> >> Mitch Evans >> Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group >> 168 E. Inlet Drive >> Palm Beach, FL 33480 >> 561-351-6950 phone >> 561-845-7525 fax >> www.mitchevansconsulting.com >> www.the-nextlevelgroup.com >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Wayne >> Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:58 AM >> To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >> Subject: Re: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really >> yourcompetitors? >> >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 >> years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. >> His average >> job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with >> customers >> that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. >> >> >> Please point us to this website ! >> >> >> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon Watt" > > >> To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" >> >> Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:18 AM >> Subject: [SPAM?] RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your >> competitors? >> >> >>> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >>> >>> Mitch >>> >>> Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to >>> set up >>> something like this? I would guess it must be significant. >>> >>> Gord Watt >>> Xoxo Cyberprint Inc >>> Toronto >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >>> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans >>> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM >>> To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' >>> Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your >>> competitors? >>> >>> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >>> >>> All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are >>> taking >>> business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of >>> the >>> world >>> -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing >>> business in 3 >>> years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His >>> average >>> job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with >>> customers >>> that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. >>> >>> One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they >>> made >>> him >>> join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in >>> business >>> with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this >>> list. >>> >>> With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, >>> do not >>> ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and >>> they could >>> be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the >>> outset. >>> Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT >>> increasing. >>> >>> Mitch >>> >>> Mitch Evans >>> Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group >>> 168 E. Inlet Drive >>> Palm Beach, FL 33480 >>> 561-351-6950 phone >>> 561-845-7525 fax >>> www.mitchevansconsulting.com >>> www.the-nextlevelgroup.com >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >>> [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan >>> Huntingford >>> Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM >>> To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >>> Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your >>> competitors? >>> >>> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" >> > >>>> Vistaprint =0 >>>> Mimeo = 0 >>>> Printing for Less = 0 >>> ====================== >>> >>> Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from >>> a good >>> customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed >>> by one >>> of >>> >>> those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV >>> coating. >>> Plus >>> the quality was perfect. >>> We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. >>> >>> You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply >>> closets. >>> >>> Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And >>> Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; >>> PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; >>> citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics >>> wgiprint.com; To name a few. >>> >>> I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware >>> that >>> these places have better web sites than you, can print better >>> quality than >>> you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new >>> 40 inch 8 >>> and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled >>> binderies >>> that we little guys can only dream of. >>> >>> Dan Huntingford >>> SOS Printing >>> 2319 Washington Street >>> Port Townsend, WA 98368 >>> Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF >>> sos@olympus.net >>> (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From tstrickland at studiodesignsprinting.com Wed Feb 6 16:38:53 2008 From: tstrickland at studiodesignsprinting.com (tstrickland@studiodesignsprinting.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 16:39:07 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Jumbo numbering References: Message-ID: <009601c86908$abdc5e60$0500a8c0@TravisComp> Does anyone have a source for consecutive jumbo numbering? We have a customer with two large mfg. plants and they order large lots of tags that have this. We did order from Ennis but CS said their equipment broke and they now farm out the numbering part and went way up on the price to cover this. We order large lots in 50 or 100M so I'm looking for an alternate source. Thanks, Travis Studio Designs Printing Milledgeville, GA 31061 From gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com Wed Feb 6 16:46:37 2008 From: gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com (Gordon Watt) Date: Wed Feb 6 16:45:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL In-Reply-To: <00b101c868fc$4cc22ba0$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> References: <20080206192536.14968.29446@hm-pop1.solinus.com> <00b101c868fc$4cc22ba0$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: <017e01c86909$c0042b60$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> The only thing worse than losing a customer because of your own bumbling is to lose one because of someone else's bumbling. 4Over.com are the people who have that annoying stiff page in the middle of Quick Printing that you have to tear out so that the pages don't keep flipping over on you. I knew there was a reason I shouldn't like them! Gordon Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Kathy Henry Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 3:10 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I am in the throws of the hell of customer service with 4over today. Our From gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com Wed Feb 6 16:52:51 2008 From: gordwatt at xoxocyberprint.com (Gordon Watt) Date: Wed Feb 6 16:51:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <017f01c8690a$9ecec6c0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> We have several Staples in our area. They actually do us a favor as they soak up most of the nuisance customers so I would rate them as a 1. However, Kinkos, no matter how bad they are, have very effective marketing and they are definitely a competitor. I would rate them as 7 or 8. They have captured a number of the bigger companies in our area such as Telus. Gordon Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 9:00 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition to savvy quick and small commercial printers? Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the question might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, to 9-10 points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost a daily basis. Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob private at _browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp0030000 00025 48) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From russ at mobile-print.com Wed Feb 6 16:50:40 2008 From: russ at mobile-print.com (Russ Peters) Date: Wed Feb 6 16:52:03 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Jumbo numbering In-Reply-To: <009601c86908$abdc5e60$0500a8c0@TravisComp> References: <009601c86908$abdc5e60$0500a8c0@TravisComp> Message-ID: <47AA2BB0.1040602@mobile-print.com> I believe Adelene Printing still does Jumbo Numbering Adelene Printing Company 355 S Il Route 83 Grayslake, IL 60030 (847) 223-1440 Russ Peters MOBILE PRINT, INC. 201 W. Central Road Mount Prospect, IL 60056 Phone: 847.398.6155 Fax: 847.398.0788 E: Russ@Mobile-Print.com W. www.Mobile-Print.com tstrickland@studiodesignsprinting.com wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Does anyone have a source for consecutive jumbo numbering? We have a customer with two large mfg. plants and they order large lots of tags that have this. We did order from Ennis but CS said their equipment broke and they now farm out the numbering part and went way up on the price to cover this. We order large lots in 50 or 100M so I'm looking for an alternate source. > > Thanks, > Travis > > Studio Designs Printing > Milledgeville, GA 31061 > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 6 16:53:57 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 6 16:57:22 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Horse? In-Reply-To: <00c001c868f4$9bc22500$6900000a@tech.local> References: <47A9BCF8.2338.AF1F7E3@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <47A9E625.28501.B92CE54@slb.inkspot.net> Glad you didn't get snowed. Who was the best dancer? I've never gotten to ride RAGBRAI yet, although a nephew and brother- in-law have done it several times. It's still on my "bucket list." My longest ride so far was San Francisco to L.A.; my wife's was Seattle to San Diego. Steve > > Naah! We didn't get snowed at all by the candidates, it was a ball. We got > to dance with everyone and decide who was quick on their feet, made a good > impression and had a good grip. > > RAGBRAI is a fun bicycle trip. I'm just 20 minutes from the second last day > of this week long eating and drinking adventure. C'mon over. > > John A. Gross > Technigraphics, Inc > Iowa City, Iowa 52240 > techiowa.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Steve Blatman > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 12:58 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] A Horse? > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > Eight inches of snow this morning and still coming. Winter in Iowa can be > > interesting. > > > > Particularly in political season. First you get "snowed" by the > candidates, then by Mother Nature.... > > Soon it will be summer, and RAGBRAI season... > > Steve > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 6 17:02:43 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 6 17:02:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Jumbo numbering In-Reply-To: <009601c86908$abdc5e60$0500a8c0@TravisComp> Message-ID: <47A9E833.7048.B9AD532@slb.inkspot.net> Depending on the stock, would you do that digitally? Steve > > Does anyone have a source for consecutive jumbo numbering? We have a customer with two large mfg. plants and they order large lots of tags that have this. We did order from Ennis but CS said their equipment broke and they now farm out the numbering part and went way up on the price to cover this. We order large lots in 50 or 100M so I'm looking for an alternate source. > > Thanks, > Travis > > Studio Designs Printing > Milledgeville, GA 31061 > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2854 (20080206) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From sgfinke at fuse.net Wed Feb 6 17:05:03 2008 From: sgfinke at fuse.net (Scott and Gail Finke) Date: Wed Feb 6 17:05:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again In-Reply-To: <006501c868db$416f5140$0b01a8c0@CharXP> References: <006501c868db$416f5140$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Message-ID: Charlene, you've got to go! See how much these things cost, and what they promise the business-type clients (cost per copy, ink cost, etc.). And then report back -- your mission, should you choose to accept it. Might be a good investment that would eliminate charging too little per piece: offer the "economy" version, and the "premium." Gail Finke - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road Cincinnati, OH 45231 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - (513) 522-2679 Fax 522-2692 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - info@brentwood-printing.com www.brentwood-printing.com On Feb 6, 2008, at 11:13 AM, Charlene Sims wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Just got a copy of an invitation that a customer received to look > at a new > Riso HC5500 that they are claiming is the fastest ink jet sheet fed > printer > in the world. They are inviting churches from all over the city to > view it > and demo it. Right smack in the center of much of my market to my > customers. I might go look at it with them just to see what is > going on. > > ch > > Charlene Sims > > The Master's Press, Inc > 14550 Midway Road > Dallas, Tx 75244 > 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 > char@themasterspress.com > www.themasterspress.com > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 6 17:09:10 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 6 17:09:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Color Calibration for C500? In-Reply-To: <20080206192536.14968.29446@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <47A9E9B6.6233.BA0BDC3@slb.inkspot.net> We've been working on process control & calibration for our 4-color offset, and I'd like the digital to be as close as is reasonably possible. We have a C500 with a Creo. Other than using the densitometer and calibration software that comes with it, what, if anything, do you do to optimize the offset-to-digital color matching? TIA, Steve Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From sos at olympus.net Wed Feb 6 17:09:50 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Wed Feb 6 17:10:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over References: <20080206192536.14968.29446@hm-pop1.solinus.com> Message-ID: <0a2901c8690c$fe6d2930$6900a8c0@DANIEL> >I will admit to using 4over for 4 color business cards. Their color is terrible. =================== I've sent a couple jobs to 4over, and I was really impressed by the color and quality and speed. Did you have ICC profiles embedded in your files? They obviously gang run, so they can't tweek any individual file, but I'd sure bet they are printing to standard densities. Color matching between different presses, different devices, at different times using different processes is still a very difficult thing to do. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From John at mpcny.com Wed Feb 6 17:40:16 2008 From: John at mpcny.com (John Henry) Date: Wed Feb 6 17:40:28 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Color Calibration for C500? In-Reply-To: <20080206221009.4A6B0DDAD65@rb.enter.net> References: <20080206221009.4A6B0DDAD65@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <007601c86911$3ed02cd0$bc708670$@com> Just to put a gray patch on each and match them 50c/39m/39y vs 50%k I find most lasers print much darker than press. You find if you measure the patch you will be 10-20 higher on the copier. Gray balance is the best way to check any press, proof or printer. John M. Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company 125-129 East First Street Oswego, New York 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 Fax www.mpcny.com John@mpcny.com No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/1261 - Release Date: 2/5/2008 8:57 PM From sos at olympus.net Wed Feb 6 17:44:47 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Wed Feb 6 17:45:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL References: Message-ID: <0a4b01c86911$e0513cc0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> > Anyway, I would be very interested if anyone on the list has had problems > similar to Kathy regarding delays or excuses in getting simple jobs done. > Write > me privately if you want. ====================== The couple jobs, both business cards, that I sent to 4over.com both went off without a hitch. I uploaded the file, I received an email saying they had my file, later I got a PDF proof, later another email saying it was in production, later another email saying it had been shipped, later they arrived and looked great. Several times I went to their web page and checked on where the job was, and it tells you if it's still in pre-press, or in production, etc. I was very impressed. Start to finish. I think it's really intimidating. It's so easy, the quality is impeccable, the price is 1/4 of what we would have to charge to eek out a 15% profit. Again, I think a business model that just hopes our customers don't find out about all this, means we are in real trouble. In our case, I invested a couple hundred thousand dollars in a four color press and platemaker. We started to grow the full color printing. But last year it stopped growing. Today the four color press just sits. Jobs we used to print are being ordered on line at far lower prices. I can't just go out and sell, we already have relationships with virtually every business in town, (a very small town, your situation is probably different). Anyway, I'm somewhat worried. This is a situation upon which an eye must be kept. By the way, 4over is in California. They are building a brand new huge plant in the mid-west, with all new equipment, but I don't think it is finished yet. That might have something to do with less than stellar service to New York. I've also noticed many more of these companies advertising each month in various magazines. They won't all have great service. This may be our saving grace as more people try them and get burned by poor service. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From char at themasterspress.com Wed Feb 6 18:05:26 2008 From: char at themasterspress.com (Charlene Sims) Date: Wed Feb 6 18:05:39 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ennis and Check Printing In-Reply-To: <200802061606.m16G6nQI049296@pro35.abac.com> References: <200802061606.m16G6nQI049296@pro35.abac.com> Message-ID: <016301c86914$c4f6f340$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Dick have you ever used Falcon Business Forms. Have used them for as long as I can remember and have always had excellent service. I think they are in Waxahachie. 800-442-6262. Ask for Pam and tell her I sent you. ch Charlene Sims The Master's Press, Inc 14550 Midway Road Dallas, Tx 75244 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 char@themasterspress.com www.themasterspress.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dick Latson Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:07 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Ennis and Check Printing ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We have been a top 100 customer with Ennis and have done business with them for over 20 years. Their Wolfe City Plant and the Imprint Division in Ft. Scott have been great to work with. But I have had it with the poor customer service, accounting issues and delayed productions of their Ennis, Tx. Custom plant where we get our checks printed, and am ready to fire them. I hate to loose all of the customer data on the reprints we send them and so I have been reluctant to switch, but the lousy service has now forced me to look for another vendor for our check business. I would appreciate any recomendations. -Dick Dick Latson Latson's Printing & Office Supply, Inc. 1105 Main Street / P.O. Box 701 Commerce, Texas 75428 (903) 886-2710 or Fax 886-7889 email: owner@latsons.com www.latsons.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From sos at olympus.net Wed Feb 6 18:06:56 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Wed Feb 6 18:07:21 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Color Calibration for C500? References: <47A9E9B6.6233.BA0BDC3@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <0a9201c86914$f82efaf0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> > We have a C500 with a Creo. Other than using the densitometer and > calibration software that comes with it, what, if anything, do you do > to > optimize the offset-to-digital color matching? ==================== I'm awaiting an answer to this one as well. We print one notch (5%) lighter setting at our normal calibration set, and it matches pretty well. That's through our Creo to the X250. But what your really need to do is characterize the copier output, for that you need a spectrodensitomiter that can read color, then you print out the thousands of patches of different color and read them and stuff. That's where my knowledge gets a little hazy. The technicians from xpedx did all this on our Epson proofer so that it would match the press when it was installed. Xerox, Creo, had no idea how to do this when our copier was installed. They didn't even know what the densitometer was. Or how to do a basic calibration. So good luck. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 6 18:11:17 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 6 18:11:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Color Calibration for C500? In-Reply-To: <007601c86911$3ed02cd0$bc708670$@com> References: <20080206221009.4A6B0DDAD65@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <47A9F845.13641.BD99EF9@slb.inkspot.net> Thanks, John. I knew I was missing the obvious...Now, to the Creo manual to figure out how to correct gray balance if it doesn't check out... Have you recovered from your trip to FL? Steve > > Just to put a gray patch on each and match them 50c/39m/39y vs 50%k I find > most lasers print much darker than press. You find if you measure the patch > you will be 10-20 higher on the copier. > > Gray balance is the best way to check any press, proof or printer. > > John M. Henry > Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company > 125-129 East First Street > Oswego, New York 13126 > (315) 343-3531 > (315) 343-3577 Fax > www.mpcny.com > John@mpcny.com > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.20/1261 - Release Date: 2/5/2008 > 8:57 PM > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2854 (20080206) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From QKCONSULT at aol.com Wed Feb 6 18:53:52 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 18:54:16 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL Message-ID: In a message dated 2/6/2008 6:23:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, sos@olympus.net writes: Again, I think a business model that just hopes our customers don't find out about all this, means we are in real trouble. Ok, Here's the challenge. See how easy it would be for your 12-year-old daughter to place a similar order next time, using a fictitious company name and your home address and a personal credit card. See if you can place the order, or whether they attempt to confirm your "printing" status. John Stewart The Quick Consultant _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) 321-727-2442 FAX 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 Read about new book _Print Shop For Sale_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt and myself. **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From xeroid at kos.net Wed Feb 6 18:56:20 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Wed Feb 6 18:56:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: Message-ID: <7B5B09AAB32F45598D0BBD3A7AF65E75@BEDROOM> > As I alluded to in an earlier post, > and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that > earned him a credibility handicap. > > What is his past? I've been on this list for many years and don't recall > him > doing anything different than what he's doing now. He operates in an > unconventional manner. Some people insisted he couldn't possibly be doing > what he > claimed to be doing. Some claimed he was so inept he would be out of > business > in no time. Obviously he's still operating and still do things > unconventionally. I think the credibility handicap some perceive about me stems from debates on different thinking mostly involving price. And although I've always had the practice to price my products in the middle of my market place, some still believed and where even convinced I was undercutting everyone and was some kind of idiot who wouldn't last. I'm in my 14th year in the same storefront location. With what I have disclosed recently about using inkjet technology as a viable and profitable alternative to laser and offset, sheds light on the fact that you can indeed do things differently and still have success. When I disclosed the amount of profit I was able to acheive, it was to unbelievable for some on this list to accept, but indeed I was telling the truth. I have constantly changed my business model in an ever changing and more competitive print environment. I'm still changing my business model as we speak as I clearly see a decline in the demand for printing and a constantly decreasing profit margin in colour printing. Frankly this worries me. This has focused my attention on multimedia signage to add to my services and hopefully I have made enough right decisions to last a few more years. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net From dominick at fmtc.com Wed Feb 6 19:11:30 2008 From: dominick at fmtc.com (Dominick's Printing) Date: Wed Feb 6 19:11:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Color Calibration for C500? In-Reply-To: <0a9201c86914$f82efaf0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> References: <47A9E9B6.6233.BA0BDC3@slb.inkspot.net> <0a9201c86914$f82efaf0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <47AA4CB2.7080702@fmtc.com> I'll jump in here also. Along with calibration, what computer software do we need to make the monitor match the digital output? This has become a big issue for us now that we have a X-252. Joe Dominick Dominick's Quality Printing 542 W. Idaho Avenue Ontario Oregon 97914 541.881.1121 Fax 541.881.1599 www.dominicksprinting.com dominick@fmtc.com Ontario's ONLY Authorized Adobe Service Provider Microsoft Publisher Files Welcome Here! Dan Huntingford wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >> We have a C500 with a Creo. Other than using the densitometer and >> calibration software that comes with it, what, if anything, do you do >> to >> optimize the offset-to-digital color matching? > ==================== > > I'm awaiting an answer to this one as well. We print one notch (5%) > lighter setting at our normal calibration set, and it matches pretty > well. That's through our Creo to the X250. But what your really need > to do is characterize the copier output, for that you need a > spectrodensitomiter that can read color, then you print out the > thousands of patches of different color and read them and stuff. > That's where my knowledge gets a little hazy. > The technicians from xpedx did all this on our Epson proofer so that > it would match the press when it was installed. > Xerox, Creo, had no idea how to do this when our copier was > installed. They didn't even know what the densitometer was. Or how to > do a basic calibration. > > So good luck. > > Dan Huntingford > SOS Printing > 2319 Washington Street > Port Townsend, WA 98368 > Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF > sos@olympus.net > (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > From char at themasterspress.com Wed Feb 6 19:40:02 2008 From: char at themasterspress.com (Charlene Sims) Date: Wed Feb 6 19:40:13 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Horse? In-Reply-To: <095601c8685f$a7b57cd0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> References: <5DC92026-2297-4EA0-88A9-96F785E58315@ptialaska.net> <095601c8685f$a7b57cd0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <017c01c86921$f9acd570$0b01a8c0@CharXP> I have to say Dan the only thing I can say that I have done like you are talking about is having a dog in my shop. Good grief, I have never heard such a variety of things in any business. I would have to admit you must be in a pretty unique place. ch Charlene Sims The Master's Press, Inc 14550 Midway Road Dallas, Tx 75244 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 char@themasterspress.com www.themasterspress.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 7:29 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] A Horse? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We just had a horse in the shop. Pretty small one, ok it was a pony, but still anyone else out there ever had a horse in their shop. A lady was making copies or something, and her daughter got to talking about her pony, and wanted to show us, so she went out to their van, not a horse trailer or anything, just a van, and got it out and lead it in. We've had birds flying around the shop, lots of dogs. We've had deer in the parking lot, and a sea otter that was a regular visitor for a while. We've had a lady swim up and stand at the counter in her scuba gear, dripping on the carpet, to order some rack cards for her guest house. We had a guy sail in once on a sail board with wheels. We had a customer drive up in an electric car and pull out a cord and plug in to recharge while she made some copies. We've had houses in the parking lot three times now. A moving company brings them in by barge, unloads them at high tide into our parking lot where they sit until 3:00 am or so when they take them to their new location. These are regular houses, 3 bedroom two bath,1200 to 1500 square foot houses. I can't help but think this is just kind of a unique community to try and do business in. Not to mention that far far far and away my biggest customer is an old retired guy named Ralph. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 6 19:50:58 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 6 19:51:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200802070051.m170pVX1028566@i2bnetworks.com> Mine arrived today (Wednesday). That was quick. S. At 08:54 AM 2/5/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >The 2008-09 4C Practices & Pricing Study is now available for purchase from >NAQP. You can go to _www.NAQP.com_ (http://www.NAQP.com) to place your >order. NAQP/NAPL member price is $155; non-member price is $225. > >Those firms who participated in the original survey should expect to receive >their copies via 1st Class mail this week. Approximately 315 companies >participated and the margin of error was one of the best ever >achieved. Despite >some questions that required extensive detail on pricing of color >copies and 4C >process, the number of survey forms completed in their entirety was >extremely high. This was especially true in the pricing matrices for >color copying. > >The new study contains 32 different color copying pricing matrices - (16) >for 8.5 x 11 color copies and (16) for 11 x 17 color copies. The >matrices are >further broken down by average and median pricing, as well as >pricing provided >by "profit leaders." Further breakouts analyze pricing differences, if any, >broken down by various copier speeds, including pricing for copiers >of 25 cpm >and lower, 26-59 cpm and 60 cpm and higher. > >Other highlights or findings included in the study: > >Average Gross Sales of participants: $1,368,514 >Average Sales Per Employee: $123,245 >Average Profit Leader SPE: $140,018 > >34% of respondents reported annual sales between $500-999,999 > >18% of respondents reported annual sales between $1-1.5 Million >17% of respondents reported annual sales between $1.5 - 2.9 Million > >This study should prove to be a valuable resource for those companies who >are either currently offering digital color copying and/or 4C offset >printing, >or who are thinking of expanding in these areas. Given the fact that both >averages and medians are provided, readers should be able to quickly >determine >real-world pricing practices for a large variety of jobs in this industry. > >Also included are color copier ratings based upon both the copier & the >service provided for these copiers. > >The study is packed with useful information pertaining to average and >"profit leader" productivity including breakouts for DTP employees and press >operators. Hourly press rates, wash-up charges and ratings of >various presses used >by survey participants will also be found in this newly released study. > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. >(http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 >48) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2850 (20080205) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From QKCONSULT at aol.com Wed Feb 6 19:55:16 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 19:56:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released Message-ID: In a message dated 2/6/2008 7:53:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: Mine arrived today (Wednesday). That was quick. Yes, for a flat mailed on Monday via 1st Class from Melbourne, FL I would agree - very fast! John Stewart The Quick Consultant _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) 321-727-2442 FAX 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 Read about new book _Print Shop For Sale_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt and myself. **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From championprinting at yahoo.com Wed Feb 6 20:00:15 2008 From: championprinting at yahoo.com (Ted Gelletly) Date: Wed Feb 6 20:01:46 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again Message-ID: <689686.82488.qm@web38914.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I saw this unit (or its predecessor) at MAILCOM last May. Print quality similar to a 7-8 year old consumer level ink jet printer. Retail price approx $30,000. max sheet size 11 x 17, uncoated only. Was demo'ed running 10 x 13 envelopes. They were running a static image but claimed to be able to produce variable data so you could print and address the envelope in a single pass. I don't believe any of my better clients would have been impressed with the quality (or lack thereof). Ted Gelletly Champion Printing 5401 New Expansion Drive Eldersburg MD 21784 410-795-6464 ext.4 Fax 410-795-6488 ted@championprintingonline.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Scott and Gail Finke To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2008 5:05:03 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Charlene, you've got to go! See how much these things cost, and what they promise the business-type clients (cost per copy, ink cost, etc.). And then report back -- your mission, should you choose to accept it. Might be a good investment that would eliminate charging too little per piece: offer the "economy" version, and the "premium." Gail Finke - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road Cincinnati, OH 45231 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - (513) 522-2679 Fax 522-2692 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - info@brentwood-printing.com www.brentwood-printing.com On Feb 6, 2008, at 11:13 AM, Charlene Sims wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Just got a copy of an invitation that a customer received to look > at a new > Riso HC5500 that they are claiming is the fastest ink jet sheet fed > printer > in the world. They are inviting churches from all over the city to > view it > and demo it. Right smack in the center of much of my market to my > customers. I might go look at it with them just to see what is > going on. > > ch > > Charlene Sims > > The Master's Press, Inc > 14550 Midway Road > Dallas, Tx 75244 > 972/458.8758 * 972/387.0046 * fax 972/404.0317 > char@themasterspress.com > www.themasterspress.com From amanatranslation at yahoo.com Wed Feb 6 20:16:30 2008 From: amanatranslation at yahoo.com (nasr hussain) Date: Wed Feb 6 20:16:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over In-Reply-To: <0a2901c8690c$fe6d2930$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <910588.99523.qm@web31403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 4over Inc. in Glendale, CA, is truly a current day model of the old American dream. Since its inception in 2001, 4over has experienced triple digit annual growth, achieving over $42 million in sales and becoming one of the most successful trade print shops in the country. In the beginning, 4over founder Zarik Megerdichian had no background in printing. An experienced website and graphic designer, Megerdichian?s first entrepreneurial venture was an internet based business designing business cards. Working through print brokers, Megerdichian knew there had to be a better way. In 2001, Megerdichian and his wife Tina Hartounian founded 4over with a small two color used printing press. ?The two of us worked almost around the clock in the beginning,? laughs Megerdichian. Inefficiency and quality issues, as well as the desire to grow his business, led Megerdichian to Komori. ?Our Komori rep, Joe Stramel, took the time to help us choose the right press for our new business,? says Megerdichian. 4over?s first Komori press, a Lithrone 628, ran it?s first job on February 3, 2003?a day that marks another first for Megerdichian, the birth of his first child. He also marks this date as the real beginning for 4over. Their current press line-up is impressive. In addition to a pair of Lithrone S40 perfectors?a six and an eight color and a five color Lithrone S40 with coater, 4over is home to North America?s first ten color Lithrone S40 Super Perfector with double coater. This unique configuration press prints and coats both sides of the sheet in a single pass, producing bindery ready sheets as soon as they reach the press? delivery. A six color Lithrone S40 with UV is also scheduled for delivery. With five locations, the newest a 72,000 square foot production facility, and over 200 employees, 4over serves the business-to-business market entirely over the internet, producing such products as business cards, postcards, pamphlets, leaflets and brochures. ?We focus our business on the smallest possible customer,? says Megerdichian. who states that 4over?s top 100 customers are less than 1% of their total business. 4over also knows their niche, running only five different substrates and accepting no custom work. ?We know the sweet spot of our business and don?t deviate. If a customer requests a specific paper, most of the time we can substitute one of the stocks we run, but we?re not afraid to turn down business that doesn?t fit our model,? says Megerdichian. Megerdichian says that what separates 4over from the competition is their ability to provide the big three?quality, speed and price. ?Some printers say it is a challenge to deliver all three, but we do it all day, everyday.? 4over stays on the edge of technology, utilizing the most advanced equipment available in the industry. ?It is very important to have equipment that is efficient and can produce high quality products very quickly. Our entire operation is state of the art, and when you combine the quality of our equipment with the caliber of our employees, we offer a service that is second to none.? ?We have an extremely dedicated, hard working team,? says Megerdichian. The relationship at 4over is more like family than employer/employee. The dynamic group works together and all share in the success of 4over. ?We all work side by side; one hand washes the other,? says Megerdichian. 4over also gives back to their community, with their ?Believe? program, that encourages employee participation in a variety of charitable organizations. ?4over provides support for a number of community services that help the homeless, women shelters, and Toys For Tots just to name a few. We have found that this process of giving energizes our team and also allows us to give back to our neighbors in need,? says Megerdichian. Always looking to expand their horizon, 4over?s latest innovation is a software product called ?Diz 4 Biz? that allows 4over customers to easily build an internet business portal. Diz 4 Biz is totally customizable. Our customers can easily design a website that allows them to choose the products they want to offer their customers. It will streamline the order process for the end user as well for our customers,? says Megerdichian. The template based software package offers a variety of templates and images for end users to easily design business cards, flyers and brochures. ?This exciting new product will allow us to add new customers and continue to rapidly grow our business.? Megerdichian also says his relationship with Komori has played a big part in his company?s success. ?Relationships are what our business is all about. Komori has always worked with us, and helped us choose the right products to complement our business and help us grow. The technology Komori brings us is outstanding. The fast makeready, the excellent print quality and the flexibility of our presses are critical to our success.? The new LSSP brings 4over additional capacity for their rapidly expanding business. The ability to print and coat both sides of the sheet at one time is a real benefit for us. We?re looking forward to reaping the benefits of this new technology.? What lies in the future for 4over? Megerdichian already has his eye on additional press purchases and continuing 4over?s phenomenal growth rate. With a sheepish grin, he says, ?What?s in our future? You?ll just have to wait and see.? Nasr Hussain Amana Graphics Hamtramck, MI ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 6 20:23:24 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 6 20:23:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL In-Reply-To: <0a4b01c86911$e0513cc0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <47AA173C.27432.C52907C@slb.inkspot.net> I've been talking with a woman who owns a web design business. When she last called about our engaging her services, I asked about her printing. She told me that she doesn't want to take the time to deal with the needs of her business during the day--she prefers to spend the time working with and for her clients. She orders all of her printing on line, at night. I mentioned that, while she could do that, since she understands design (actually, many web designers don't, so I was giving her the benefit of the doubt), she should always get what she orders. Unlike a web business, I told her, we're able to offer advice on whether what she is ordering is the best way to accomplish her objective, or whether she might be better off ordering something else. Similarly, her favorite on-the-web printer will use the file she sends. We'll work with her if something looks "off" to us. Some customers can create a file, know it's what they want, and order their printing on line. Some customers think they can handle that, and end up disappointed. Some "should" end up disappointed, but don't know enough to realize they would have been better off with a different order. Some learn from their experience, or don't want to deal with doing any of it themselves. These last are our best prospects. We have to sell them on the higher level of service we can provide. Scott's right. Gotta go set up more sales calls. Steve > > > Anyway, I would be very interested if anyone on the list has had problems > > similar to Kathy regarding delays or excuses in getting simple jobs done. > > Write > > me privately if you want. > ====================== > > The couple jobs, both business cards, that I sent to 4over.com both went off > without a hitch. I uploaded the file, I received an email saying they had > my file, later I got a PDF proof, later another email saying it was in > production, later another email saying it had been shipped, later they > arrived and looked great. > Several times I went to their web page and checked on where the job was, and > it tells you if it's still in pre-press, or in production, etc. I was very > impressed. Start to finish. > I think it's really intimidating. It's so easy, the quality is impeccable, > the price is 1/4 of what we would have to charge to eek out a 15% profit. > > Again, I think a business model that just hopes our customers don't find out > about all this, means we are in real trouble. > > In our case, I invested a couple hundred thousand dollars in a four color > press and platemaker. We started to grow the full color printing. But last > year it stopped growing. Today the four color press just sits. Jobs we > used to print are being ordered on line at far lower prices. I can't just > go out and sell, we already have relationships with virtually every business > in town, (a very small town, your situation is probably different). > Anyway, I'm somewhat worried. > This is a situation upon which an eye must be kept. > > By the way, 4over is in California. They are building a brand new huge > plant in the mid-west, with all new equipment, but I don't think it is > finished yet. That might have something to do with less than stellar > service to New York. I've also noticed many more of these companies > advertising each month in various magazines. They won't all have great > service. This may be our saving grace as more people try them and get > burned by poor service. > > Dan Huntingford > SOS Printing > 2319 Washington Street > Port Townsend, WA 98368 > Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF > sos@olympus.net > (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2854 (20080206) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 6 20:24:11 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 6 20:24:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <47AA176B.18964.C5348EE@slb.inkspot.net> I guess even the USPS occasionally delivers "first class" service in actuality, instead of only in name. Steve > > > > In a message dated 2/6/2008 7:53:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, > smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: > > Mine arrived today (Wednesday). > > That was quick. > > > > Yes, for a flat mailed on Monday via 1st Class from Melbourne, FL I would > agree - very fast! > > John Stewart > The Quick Consultant > _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) > 321-727-2442 > FAX 321-727-2166 > Cell: 321-794-6259 > 2110 S. Dairy Road > West Melbourne, FL 32904 > > Read about new book _Print Shop For Sale_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > by Larry Hunt and myself. > > > > **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. > (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 > 48) > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2854 (20080206) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From sos at olympus.net Wed Feb 6 20:53:45 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Wed Feb 6 20:54:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Color Calibration for C500? References: <47A9E9B6.6233.BA0BDC3@slb.inkspot.net><0a9201c86914$f82efaf0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47AA4CB2.7080702@fmtc.com> Message-ID: <0aae01c8692c$4683f630$6900a8c0@DANIEL> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dominick's Printing" what computer software > do we need to make the monitor match the digital output? ===================== We use the SpyderPRO from Pantone ColorVision, it's the hockey puck thing you hang or stick on your monitor and then there is software that runs you through the monitor calibration. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From championprinting at yahoo.com Wed Feb 6 20:56:46 2008 From: championprinting at yahoo.com (Ted Gelletly) Date: Wed Feb 6 20:57:03 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over Message-ID: <853606.50185.qm@web38912.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Just goes to show, you can print crap while giving poor customer service (according to recent posts) and business savvy can over come these "minor" shortcomings. BTW, this glowing post does not look like a "normal" post. If it was "lifted" from a publication, credit should be given. Ted Gelletly Champion Printing 5401 New Expansion Drive Eldersburg MD 21784 410-795-6464 ext.4 Fax 410-795-6488 ted@championprintingonline.com ----- Original Message ---- From: nasr hussain To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2008 8:16:30 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** 4over Inc. in Glendale, CA, is truly a current day model of the old American dream. Since its inception in 2001, 4over has experienced triple digit annual growth, achieving over $42 million in sales and becoming one of the most successful trade print shops in the country. In the beginning, 4over founder Zarik Megerdichian had no background in printing. An experienced website and graphic designer, Megerdichian?s first entrepreneurial venture was an internet based business designing business cards. Working through print brokers, Megerdichian knew there had to be a better way. In 2001, Megerdichian and his wife Tina Hartounian founded 4over with a small two color used printing press. ?The two of us worked almost around the clock in the beginning,? laughs Megerdichian. Inefficiency and quality issues, as well as the desire to grow his business, led Megerdichian to Komori. ?Our Komori rep, Joe Stramel, took the time to help us choose the right press for our new business,? says Megerdichian. 4over?s first Komori press, a Lithrone 628, ran it?s first job on February 3, 2003?a day that marks another first for Megerdichian, the birth of his first child. He also marks this date as the real beginning for 4over. Their current press line-up is impressive. In addition to a pair of Lithrone S40 perfectors?a six and an eight color and a five color Lithrone S40 with coater, 4over is home to North America?s first ten color Lithrone S40 Super Perfector with double coater. This unique configuration press prints and coats both sides of the sheet in a single pass, producing bindery ready sheets as soon as they reach the press? delivery. A six color Lithrone S40 with UV is also scheduled for delivery. With five locations, the newest a 72,000 square foot production facility, and over 200 employees, 4over serves the business-to-business market entirely over the internet, producing such products as business cards, postcards, pamphlets, leaflets and brochures. ?We focus our business on the smallest possible customer,? says Megerdichian. who states that 4over?s top 100 customers are less than 1% of their total business. 4over also knows their niche, running only five different substrates and accepting no custom work. ?We know the sweet spot of our business and don?t deviate. If a customer requests a specific paper, most of the time we can substitute one of the stocks we run, but we?re not afraid to turn down business that doesn?t fit our model,? says Megerdichian. Megerdichian says that what separates 4over from the competition is their ability to provide the big three?quality, speed and price. ?Some printers say it is a challenge to deliver all three, but we do it all day, everyday.? 4over stays on the edge of technology, utilizing the most advanced equipment available in the industry. ?It is very important to have equipment that is efficient and can produce high quality products very quickly. Our entire operation is state of the art, and when you combine the quality of our equipment with the caliber of our employees, we offer a service that is second to none.? ?We have an extremely dedicated, hard working team,? says Megerdichian. The relationship at 4over is more like family than employer/employee. The dynamic group works together and all share in the success of 4over. ?We all work side by side; one hand washes the other,? says Megerdichian. 4over also gives back to their community, with their ?Believe? program, that encourages employee participation in a variety of charitable organizations. ?4over provides support for a number of community services that help the homeless, women shelters, and Toys For Tots just to name a few. We have found that this process of giving energizes our team and also allows us to give back to our neighbors in need,? says Megerdichian. Always looking to expand their horizon, 4over?s latest innovation is a software product called ?Diz 4 Biz? that allows 4over customers to easily build an internet business portal. Diz 4 Biz is totally customizable. Our customers can easily design a website that allows them to choose the products they want to offer their customers. It will streamline the order process for the end user as well for our customers,? says Megerdichian. The template based software package offers a variety of templates and images for end users to easily design business cards, flyers and brochures. ?This exciting new product will allow us to add new customers and continue to rapidly grow our business.? Megerdichian also says his relationship with Komori has played a big part in his company?s success. ?Relationships are what our business is all about. Komori has always worked with us, and helped us choose the right products to complement our business and help us grow. The technology Komori brings us is outstanding. The fast makeready, the excellent print quality and the flexibility of our presses are critical to our success.? The new LSSP brings 4over additional capacity for their rapidly expanding business. The ability to print and coat both sides of the sheet at one time is a real benefit for us. We?re looking forward to reaping the benefits of this new technology.? What lies in the future for 4over? Megerdichian already has his eye on additional press purchases and continuing 4over?s phenomenal growth rate. With a sheepish grin, he says, ?What?s in our future? You?ll just have to wait and see.? Nasr Hussain Amana Graphics Hamtramck, MI ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From QKCONSULT at aol.com Wed Feb 6 21:07:45 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 21:08:25 2008 Subject: A bit deceiving Re: [PrintOwners] 4over Message-ID: In a message dated 2/6/2008 8:54:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, amanatranslation@yahoo.com writes: 4over Inc. in Glendale, CA, is truly a current day model of the old American dream. Since its inception in 2001, 4over has experienced triple digit annual growth, achieving over $42 million in sales and becoming one of the most successful trade print shops in the country. Nasr, It is a bit deceiving, and some might even call it downright dishonest to post something such as you posted about 4Over without providing credit where it was lifted from. You clearly did not write it yourself. In fact I am curious as to why it was posted to begin with unless someone specifically asked you to post it here. In either case, this is not Quick Printing magazine where advertisements are welcome. This is a print owner's list where people try write about things they know, not copy and paste something written by others, certainly not without attribution. John Stewart The Quick Consultant _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) 321-727-2442 FAX 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 Read about new book _Print Shop For Sale_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt and myself. **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From k_graham at hotmail.com Wed Feb 6 21:13:21 2008 From: k_graham at hotmail.com (k_graham@hotmail.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 21:13:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again References: <006501c868db$416f5140$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Message-ID: > Just got a copy of an invitation that a customer received to look at a new > Riso HC5500 that they are claiming is the fastest ink jet sheet fed > printer > in the world. They are inviting churches from all over the city to view > it > and demo it. Right smack in the center of much of my market to my > customers. I might go look at it with them just to see what is going on. Take a ream of glossy paper, a usb card with your promo brochure on it and a sample from your color copier. If I am correct you can then show dissappointment that it won't replace your current system. Perhaps picking up a few clients in the process. On the other hand it may be great for those 4 color envelopes. Ken Graham CommunityPrinters.com 250-782-7108 From sos at olympus.net Wed Feb 6 21:25:51 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Wed Feb 6 21:26:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL References: Message-ID: <0ad201c86930$c22a5500$6900a8c0@DANIEL> > Here's the challenge. See how easy it would be for your 12-year-old > daughter > to place a similar order next time, using a fictitious company name and > your > home address and a personal credit card. ===================== Well, she's 13 now. But while some of these on-line printers claim to be "for the trade only" they do define trade as printers, brokers, designers. I wouldn't think it'd be hard to claim you are a designer and get in. We can test that tomorrow after school. But other's will print for anyone. Printforless.com really targets small business people, and are quite good at using Microsoft word and publisher files. But their prices are more retailish too. I really do think it's something we need to keep an eye on. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com Wed Feb 6 21:45:26 2008 From: mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com (Mitch Evans) Date: Wed Feb 6 21:45:28 2008 Subject: Strong Thoughts (was RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companiesreally your competitors?) In-Reply-To: <200802061853.m16Irq1q038162@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <006701c86933$7efd57c0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> Scott -- your comment that <>. This comment makes sense except I have never seen anyone continually make 30% on $1mm of sales but I have seen lots of folks make 10% on $3mm. Which business has more value? If you want to sell, you have two different kinds of buyers. If you want to retire with some wealth, then you need to build your sales to a higher level -- otherwise the buyers are just purchasing a job. I also strongly disagree with the inherent risk comment -- a $3mm printer today has many more options to continue to grow and the cash flow to do so. It's also a lot easier to run a company with 25 employees vs. 8 or 9 employees. The owner of the larger business has less day to day responsibility and can actually have time to work on their business and take time off. Lastly, if you are making 10% on $3mm and you make some changes you can probably find a way to increase profits to 12% or add $60K to the bottom line. What can a 30% profit company do to improve profits when it's already in the top 1% (or probably the top 0.1%) of all printing companies? What I do agree with you on is that it's all about a strong marketing & sales program backed up by superb service. Find larger customers who will partner with your company and grow together. ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I believe that in the past the internet printers as well as the >superstores were a very small threat, may be 1-2...on a 1-10 scale. >Today, they are attracting a much "higher" level of customers and are >getting into "our" territory more and more. >I believe that if we will continue to consider them as a minor, not >serious threat, we will make a major mistake. >Today, I will grade them in the 6-7 risk. >With a new Staples"Print and Copy center " open recently one bloc away >from me(I visited them few times already and "spied" to see the >clientele, the jobs as well as the customer service) , and a kinko 3 >blocs away,I know that with resources, they are making serious inroads. >All this does not mean we should get scared and close our doors... >We need to develop more ways to compete,and I am a great believer that >as a group (NAQP) we can achieve more than individually. >Let this be a challenge for the NAQP board ! > >Yaakov Reshef >SPARK Direct * Kwik Kopy Printing >Marketing * Printing * Solutions > >7 East 37th Street-NYC-10016 >Tel: 212-328-2001 >Fax: 212-328-2007(new number) >yaakov@Sparkdirectny.com >www.sparkdirectny.com > > >-----Original Message----- >From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >[mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com >Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 9:00 AM >To: printowners@printweb.org >Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Bob Hall, editor of Quick Printing magazine, has asked me whether I and > >other printers on this list consider companies such as Kinko's, Staples, > >VistaPrint, Mimeo.com, PrintingForLess.com, etc. as serious competition >to savvy >quick and small commercial printers? > >Bob would like to hear your comments as would I. My version of the >question >might suggest providing a rating on a 1-10 point scale, with 1-2 points >meaning that you feel they do not pose any serious threat whatsoever, >to 9-10 >points indicating they are negatively impacting your business on almost >a daily >basis. > >Feel free to post your comments here, or if you want, contact Bob >private at >_browndawg@aol.com_ (mailto:browndawg@aol.com) . Thanks. > > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. > >(http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003 >000000025 >48) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2853 (20080206) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com Wed Feb 6 21:47:58 2008 From: mitch at mitchevansconsulting.com (Mitch Evans) Date: Wed Feb 6 21:48:18 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? In-Reply-To: <016301c868fb$59d9dff0$8e00a8c0@D3YN3DB1> Message-ID: <006801c86933$d92b6ed0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> Gordon -- printpelican has a facility just outside of Toronto and also in south Florida -- more and more of their production is going to Florida due to the rise in the Canadian dollar vs the US dollar. The owner started as a quickprinter in Calgary. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Gordon Watt Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 3:04 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Mitch Thanks for the information. Interestingly I see that Pelicanprint is here in Toronto. I'm sure that it cost them to get where they, are and to get it right. So many details and so many opportunities to get it wrong. I'm guessing their margins aren't all that bad. I'll bet that many, or most, people end up paying for add-ons just the same way you do when you buy a car. Gordon Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 11:48 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Gordon -- the cost can be pretty steep but its coming down as more of the websites are templated or have pre-designed functionality. The real costs though are the internet marketing costs -- my client spends about $30K to $40K per month although he started much lower. Initial web-site costs were about $50K and its regularly updated/changed -- pretty small investment when you see the results. The key is to have an easy user interface with automatic pricing. Keep it simple to use and navigate. You also need to staff CSR's as they have to handle the jobs and inquiries. My client says it much better and cost effective than hiring new salesmen. Plus it works 24/7 -- he is amazed at the number of orders that come in after hours and on weekends. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Gordon Watt Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 10:19 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Mitch Would you care to mention a figure as to how much it would cost to set up something like this? I would guess it must be significant. Gord Watt Xoxo Cyberprint Inc Toronto -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Mitch Evans Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 8:55 PM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** All of the companies listed will chip into your sales -- they are taking business away from other printers and not the R. R. Donnelly's of the world -- I have a client who has built a $20mm internet printing business in 3 years. He had a traditional printing business and has evolved. His average job is over $1,000 and he has processed many jobs over $25K with customers that he has never met and are located throughout the US and Canada. One customer is a large Chamber of Commerce in an NFL city -- they made him join to the tune of $500 per year -- he does over $50K per year in business with them! He may have taken the business from someone on this list. With internet printing sales over $1 billion and growing rapidly, do not ignore their existence. New businesses spring up every day and they could be your customer except perhaps they use an internet printer at the outset. Someone is getting hurt by their sales as the total market is NOT increasing. Mitch Mitch Evans Mitch Evans Consulting & The Next Level Group 168 E. Inlet Drive Palm Beach, FL 33480 561-351-6950 phone 561-845-7525 fax www.mitchevansconsulting.com www.the-nextlevelgroup.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 3:01 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Are these companies really your competitors? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Sheers" > Vistaprint =0 > Mimeo = 0 > Printing for Less = 0 ====================== Are you sure about that? I just got a post card in the mail from a good customer, full color UV coated, I can guarantee you it was printed by one of those on-line gang run printers. No shop around here has UV coating. Plus the quality was perfect. We printed the same art as a short run digital poster last week. You might be surprised if you looked in your customer's supply closets. Can you print 5000 4/4 VU coated Post cards for $150? I can't. And Vistaprint is just the tip of the Iceberg. There's 4Over.com; PrintFirm.com; Team Concept tcpt.biz; Boss Logo 5000cards.com; citycolors.com; nextdayflyers.com; inkolor.net; Wizard Graphics wgiprint.com; To name a few. I'm not preaching doom here or anything. But you need to be aware that these places have better web sites than you, can print better quality than you, at 1/4 to 1/2 the price you can. They are buying brand new 40 inch 8 and 10 color presses and have automated job flows and JDF enabled binderies that we little guys can only dream of. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From championprinting at yahoo.com Wed Feb 6 21:55:10 2008 From: championprinting at yahoo.com (Ted Gelletly) Date: Wed Feb 6 21:55:22 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again Message-ID: <446821.61019.qm@web38915.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I didn't mention it in my earlier post, but it's perfect for churches and schools (if they can stomach the initial cost) who are already familiar with the single color digital duplicator. When you print for them, they expect the best (as they should) but when they buy their own machine, crap printing becomes the "norm". Don't you find this with most clients that bring their work in house? Ted Gelletly Champion Printing 5401 New Expansion Drive Eldersburg MD 21784 410-795-6464 ext.4 Fax 410-795-6488 ted@championprintingonline.com ----- Original Message ---- From: "k_graham@hotmail.com" To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2008 9:13:21 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > Just got a copy of an invitation that a customer received to look at a new > Riso HC5500 that they are claiming is the fastest ink jet sheet fed > printer > in the world. They are inviting churches from all over the city to view > it > and demo it. Right smack in the center of much of my market to my > customers. I might go look at it with them just to see what is going on. Take a ream of glossy paper, a usb card with your promo brochure on it and a sample from your color copier. If I am correct you can then show dissappointment that it won't replace your current system. Perhaps picking up a few clients in the process. On the other hand it may be great for those 4 color envelopes. Ken Graham CommunityPrinters.com 250-782-7108 From k_graham at hotmail.com Wed Feb 6 22:13:14 2008 From: k_graham at hotmail.com (k_graham@hotmail.com) Date: Wed Feb 6 22:13:39 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Color Calibration for C500? References: <47A9E9B6.6233.BA0BDC3@slb.inkspot.net><0a9201c86914$f82efaf0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47AA4CB2.7080702@fmtc.com> Message-ID: http://www.computer-darkroom.com/ezcolor25/ezcolor25_2.htm We have the Monaco, here is a review. I could not get a good calibration of a Fiery equipped laser printer with this which matches with the review. For that I use a SWOP color profile. I have been a believer in doing gradation adjusts before Fiery Calibration but I have found on the 240 they do not work with hammermill Color copy paper. It causes the unit to print about 10% oversaturated even after doing a additional Fiery calibration. As the problem is created doing the Gradation adjust I expect this will adversely affect the Creo units as well, though they may be better at overcoming the problem with their software? I have been using Xerox Supreme Gloss reasonably successfully, today a Xerox tech told me Xerox Color Expressions paper is the correct one to use for Gradation adjusts, I will probably order some to see if its any better, or worse. I figure optical brighteners in certain papers probably are ruining the gradation adjust. We have a DTP32 here as well for Fiery Calibrations but I find it no better that using the supplied grey patch. The EZ scan software did excellent work of calibrating the Doc 12 scanner - the 240 Xerox has its built in calibration software with the Fiery so is not necessary to use the EZ scan software. I recommend the Monaco software and calibration unit. Ken Graham Community Printers.com 250-782-7108 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dominick's Printing" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 5:11 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Color Calibration for C500? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I'll jump in here also. Along with calibration, what computer software do > we need to make the monitor match the digital output? > > This has become a big issue for us now that we have a X-252. > > Joe Dominick > > Dominick's Quality Printing > 542 W. Idaho Avenue > Ontario Oregon 97914 > 541.881.1121 > Fax 541.881.1599 > > www.dominicksprinting.com > dominick@fmtc.com > > Ontario's ONLY Authorized Adobe Service Provider > Microsoft Publisher Files Welcome Here! > > Dan Huntingford wrote: >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >>> We have a C500 with a Creo. Other than using the densitometer and >>> calibration software that comes with it, what, if anything, do you do >>> to >>> optimize the offset-to-digital color matching? >> ==================== >> >> I'm awaiting an answer to this one as well. We print one notch (5%) >> lighter setting at our normal calibration set, and it matches pretty >> well. That's through our Creo to the X250. But what your really need to >> do is characterize the copier output, for that you need a >> spectrodensitomiter that can read color, then you print out the thousands >> of patches of different color and read them and stuff. >> That's where my knowledge gets a little hazy. >> The technicians from xpedx did all this on our Epson proofer so that it >> would match the press when it was installed. >> Xerox, Creo, had no idea how to do this when our copier was installed. >> They didn't even know what the densitometer was. Or how to do a basic >> calibration. >> >> So good luck. >> >> Dan Huntingford >> SOS Printing >> 2319 Washington Street >> Port Townsend, WA 98368 >> Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF >> sos@olympus.net >> (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From swiftyprinting at mac.com Thu Feb 7 07:20:32 2008 From: swiftyprinting at mac.com (Chuck) Date: Thu Feb 7 07:20:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ink Jet Again In-Reply-To: <689686.82488.qm@web38914.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <689686.82488.qm@web38914.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6A5E7029-CEEA-4B72-B48C-C2D92457E688@mac.com> On Feb 6, 2008, at 8:00 PM, Ted Gelletly wrote: >> Just got a copy of an invitation that a customer received to look >> at a new >> Riso HC5500 that they are claiming is the fastest ink jet sheet fed >> printer I just got samples of this machine because we were interested in short run full color envelopes. The quality is not all that great for printed pieces like brochures, etc, however the printing on the envelopes was impressive. However the cost per piece at the high quality setting was between 6 and 10 cents for the ink. Chuck Pappas Arlington Swifty Printing 1386 Massachusetts Avenue Arlington, MA 02476 781-646-8700 www.arlingtonswifty.com Member: National Association of Quick Printers Print Industry of New England GATF Adobe Service Network Quark Alliance Microsoft Publisher Provider From marthabell at aol.com Thu Feb 7 08:20:39 2008 From: marthabell at aol.com (marthabell@aol.com) Date: Thu Feb 7 08:22:16 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Making 10% vs 30% In-Reply-To: <20080207024530.87AEDDDBD48@rb.enter.net> References: <20080207024530.87AEDDDBD48@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <8CA37A35DEA591F-1320-3563@webmail-da16.sysops.aol.com> Mitch and fiends, You would know I would have to weigh in on this one. History always have seen us crying Chicken Little.? Franchises, suppliers, now mega stores, internet.? But you are right.? We need to set up our business models that work.? And that does involve selling somewhere: And service, somewhere.? Our industry averages about 1/3 of our sales level in assets to support that level.? Thus, to produce and finance $3,000,000 requires about 1,000,000 in assets.? Further, that is about half in accounts receivable and about half in equipment.? A decent return on that asset base might be 12% or $120,000.? Not to mention, you need to earn $1,600,000 pay the income tax on it and then leave that in the company to support it.? I know that we can get a lot of financing.? Buy my formal financial education always stated that financing decisions are independent of responsible business decisions. Any company that does not provide a return on their utilized assets, has little reason to really exist, except for the ego of the owner. (which might be OK).? Some of us smaller business have leveraged cash flows to diversify into other investments that lower our risk levels, and give us our lives back. Smaller businesses are not always harder than dealing with scores of employees. My goal has been to produce $2,000,000 in sales and make a 25% margin with 7 employees.? Haven't made it yet.? But if I get half way there. I'll survive.? Always, thanks for all of your input.? That's what makes a horse race. Henry Marthabelle's Prinitng and Mailing Kansas City, MO 816-531-7774 ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 21:45:26 -0500 From: "Mitch Evans" Subject: RE: Strong Thoughts (was RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companiesreally your competitors?) To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Message-ID: <006701c86933$7efd57c0$6501a8c0@Y765TJ> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Scott -- your comment that <>. This comment makes sense except I have never seen anyone continually make 30% on $1mm of sales but I have seen lots of folks make 10% on $3mm. Which business has more value? If you want to sell, you have two different kinds of buyers. If you want to retire with some wealth, then you need to build your sales to a higher level -- otherwise the buyers are just purchasing a job. I also strongly disagree with the inherent risk comment -- a $3mm printer today has many more options to continue to grow and the cash flow to do so. It's also a lot easier to run a company with 25 employees vs. 8 or 9 employees. The owner of the larger business has less day to day responsibility and can actually have time to work on their business and take time off. Lastly, if you are making 10% on $3mm and you make some changes you can probably find a way to increase profits to 12% or add $60K to the bottom line. What can a 30% profit company do to improve profits when it's already in the top 1% (or probably the top 0.1%) of all printing companies? What I do agree with you on is that it's all about a strong marketing & sales program backed up by superb service. Find larger customers who will partner with your company and grow together. Message-ID: <146901c86995$67119bf0$c801a8c0@Scott> Does anyone have a vendor for manual pegboard checks other than Eastern Systems. We ordered check for a very good customer before Christmas and they still have not shipped yet. Thanks, Scott K. Scott Schoppert Printing Impressions 68 Reliance Road Martinsburg, WV 25403 (304) 267-7327 scott@printing-impressions.com From hal at pickimp.com Thu Feb 7 09:29:22 2008 From: hal at pickimp.com (Hal Wendt) Date: Thu Feb 7 09:27:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over References: <853606.50185.qm@web38912.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <008f01c86995$f9537920$0301a8c0@sbcglobal.net> 42 million in sales. This just proves that these internet companies won't impact us, we're so special. Hal ----- Original Message ----- From: Ted Gelletly To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 8:56 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Just goes to show, you can print crap while giving poor customer service (according to recent posts) and business savvy can over come these "minor" shortcomings. BTW, this glowing post does not look like a "normal" post. If it was "lifted" from a publication, credit should be given. Ted Gelletly Champion Printing 5401 New Expansion Drive Eldersburg MD 21784 410-795-6464 ext.4 Fax 410-795-6488 ted@championprintingonline.com ----- Original Message ---- From: nasr hussain To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2008 8:16:30 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** 4over Inc. in Glendale, CA, is truly a current day model of the old American dream. Since its inception in 2001, 4over has experienced triple digit annual growth, achieving over $42 million in sales and becoming one of the most successful trade print shops in the country. In the beginning, 4over founder Zarik Megerdichian had no background in printing. An experienced website and graphic designer, Megerdichian?s first entrepreneurial venture was an internet based business designing business cards. Working through print brokers, Megerdichian knew there had to be a better way. In 2001, Megerdichian and his wife Tina Hartounian founded 4over with a small two color used printing press. ?The two of us worked almost around the clock in the beginning,? laughs Megerdichian. Inefficiency and quality issues, as well as the desire to grow his business, led Megerdichian to Komori. ?Our Komori rep, Joe Stramel, took the time to help us choose the right press for our new business,? says Megerdichian. 4over?s first Komori press, a Lithrone 628, ran it?s first job on February 3, 2003?a day that marks another first for Megerdichian, the birth of his first child. He also marks this date as the real beginning for 4over. Their current press line-up is impressive. In addition to a pair of Lithrone S40 perfectors?a six and an eight color and a five color Lithrone S40 with coater, 4over is home to North America?s first ten color Lithrone S40 Super Perfector with double coater. This unique configuration press prints and coats both sides of the sheet in a single pass, producing bindery ready sheets as soon as they reach the press? delivery. A six color Lithrone S40 with UV is also scheduled for delivery. With five locations, the newest a 72,000 square foot production facility, and over 200 employees, 4over serves the business-to-business market entirely over the internet, producing such products as business cards, postcards, pamphlets, leaflets and brochures. ?We focus our business on the smallest possible customer,? says Megerdichian. who states that 4over?s top 100 customers are less than 1% of their total business. 4over also knows their niche, running only five different substrates and accepting no custom work. ?We know the sweet spot of our business and don?t deviate. If a customer requests a specific paper, most of the time we can substitute one of the stocks we run, but we?re not afraid to turn down business that doesn?t fit our model,? says Megerdichian. Megerdichian says that what separates 4over from the competition is their ability to provide the big three?quality, speed and price. ?Some printers say it is a challenge to deliver all three, but we do it all day, everyday.? 4over stays on the edge of technology, utilizing the most advanced equipment available in the industry. ?It is very important to have equipment that is efficient and can produce high quality products very quickly. Our entire operation is state of the art, and when you combine the quality of our equipment with the caliber of our employees, we offer a service that is second to none.? ?We have an extremely dedicated, hard working team,? says Megerdichian. The relationship at 4over is more like family than employer/employee. The dynamic group works together and all share in the success of 4over. ?We all work side by side; one hand washes the other,? says Megerdichian. 4over also gives back to their community, with their ?Believe? program, that encourages employee participation in a variety of charitable organizations. ?4over provides support for a number of community services that help the homeless, women shelters, and Toys For Tots just to name a few. We have found that this process of giving energizes our team and also allows us to give back to our neighbors in need,? says Megerdichian. Always looking to expand their horizon, 4over?s latest innovation is a software product called ?Diz 4 Biz? that allows 4over customers to easily build an internet business portal. Diz 4 Biz is totally customizable. Our customers can easily design a website that allows them to choose the products they want to offer their customers. It will streamline the order process for the end user as well for our customers,? says Megerdichian. The template based software package offers a variety of templates and images for end users to easily design business cards, flyers and brochures. ?This exciting new product will allow us to add new customers and continue to rapidly grow our business.? Megerdichian also says his relationship with Komori has played a big part in his company?s success. ?Relationships are what our business is all about. Komori has always worked with us, and helped us choose the right products to complement our business and help us grow. The technology Komori brings us is outstanding. The fast makeready, the excellent print quality and the flexibility of our presses are critical to our success.? The new LSSP brings 4over additional capacity for their rapidly expanding business. The ability to print and coat both sides of the sheet at one time is a real benefit for us. We?re looking forward to reaping the benefits of this new technology.? What lies in the future for 4over? Megerdichian already has his eye on additional press purchases and continuing 4over?s phenomenal growth rate. With a sheepish grin, he says, ?What?s in our future? You?ll just have to wait and see.? Nasr Hussain Amana Graphics Hamtramck, MI ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From ernie at allegratampa.com Thu Feb 7 09:46:43 2008 From: ernie at allegratampa.com (Ernie Kautzmann) Date: Thu Feb 7 09:47:27 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 38 In-Reply-To: <20080207024530.87AEDDDBD48@rb.enter.net> References: <20080207024530.87AEDDDBD48@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <002101c86998$424012e0$d301a8c0@ManagerComputer> Good point John about the posting referring to 4 over. Where did he get this information? What was his purpose. Thanks for Choosing Allegra Print and Imaging 3110 Cherry Palm Drive Tampa, Florida 33619 (813) 664-1129 - Fax (813) 664-0578 Be Sure to Visit Our Website at http://www.allegratampa.com Online. On Press. On Time! Our Mission is to provide the Graphic Communication Tools & Services our Clients need to be successful. -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of printowners-request@printweb.org Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 9:46 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: PrintOwners Digest, Vol 30, Issue 38 Send PrintOwners mailing list submissions to printowners@printweb.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to printowners-request@printweb.org You can reach the person managing the list at printowners-owner@printweb.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of PrintOwners digest..." ***** This is a PrintOwners List Digest ***** Today's Topics: 1. Re: 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released (Steve Blatman) 2. Re: Color Calibration for C500? (Dan Huntingford) 3. Re: 4over (Ted Gelletly) 4. A bit deceiving Re: [PrintOwners] 4over (QKCONSULT@aol.com) 5. Re: Ink Jet Again (k_graham@hotmail.com) 6. Re: 4over HELL (Dan Huntingford) 7. RE: Strong Thoughts (was RE: [PrintOwners] Are these companiesreally your competitors?) (Mitch Evans) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2008 20:24:11 -0500 From: "Steve Blatman" Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Message-ID: <47AA176B.18964.C5348EE@slb.inkspot.net> I guess even the USPS occasionally delivers "first class" service in actuality, instead of only in name. Steve > > > > In a message dated 2/6/2008 7:53:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, > smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: > > Mine arrived today (Wednesday). > > That was quick. > > > > Yes, for a flat mailed on Monday via 1st Class from Melbourne, FL I would > agree - very fast! > > John Stewart > The Quick Consultant > _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) > 321-727-2442 > FAX 321-727-2166 > Cell: 321-794-6259 > 2110 S. Dairy Road > West Melbourne, FL 32904 > > Read about new book _Print Shop For Sale_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > by Larry Hunt and myself. > > > > **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. > (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp0030000 00025 > 48) > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2854 (20080206) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 17:53:45 -0800 From: "Dan Huntingford" Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Color Calibration for C500? To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Message-ID: <0aae01c8692c$4683f630$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dominick's Printing" what computer software > do we need to make the monitor match the digital output? ===================== We use the SpyderPRO from Pantone ColorVision, it's the hockey puck thing you hang or stick on your monitor and then there is software that runs you through the monitor calibration. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2008 17:56:46 -0800 (PST) From: Ted Gelletly Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Message-ID: <853606.50185.qm@web38912.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Just goes to show, you can print crap while giving poor customer service (according to recent posts) and business savvy can over come these "minor" shortcomings. BTW, this glowing post does not look like a "normal" post. If it was "lifted" from a publication, credit should be given. Ted Gelletly Champion Printing 5401 New Expansion Drive Eldersburg MD 21784 410-795-6464 ext.4 Fax 410-795-6488 ted@championprintingonline.com ----- Original Message ---- From: nasr hussain To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2008 8:16:30 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** 4over Inc. in Glendale, CA, is truly a current day model of the old American dream. Since its inception in 2001, 4over has experienced triple digit annual growth, achieving over $42 million in sales and becoming one of the most successful trade print shops in the country. In the beginning, 4over founder Zarik Megerdichian had no background in printing. An experienced website and graphic designer, Megerdichianb From ahavens at sbcglobal.net Thu Feb 7 09:48:42 2008 From: ahavens at sbcglobal.net (Havens Printing and Copy Shop) Date: Thu Feb 7 09:49:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Check Vendor needed References: <146901c86995$67119bf0$c801a8c0@Scott> Message-ID: <004201c86998$88dfc150$0301a8c0@Leah> DFS has several pages of "One Write" check system in their catalog. Austin Havens, Owner Havens Printing & Copy Shop 200 N Main McPherson, KS 67460 620-241-5400 ahavens@sbcglobal.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "K. Scott Schoppert" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 8:26 AM Subject: [PrintOwners] Check Vendor needed > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > Does anyone have a vendor for manual pegboard checks other than Eastern > Systems. > > We ordered check for a very good customer before Christmas and they > still have not shipped yet. > > > > > Thanks, > > Scott > > > K. Scott Schoppert > Printing Impressions > 68 Reliance Road > Martinsburg, WV 25403 > (304) 267-7327 > > scott@printing-impressions.com > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1263 - Release Date: 2/6/2008 > 8:14 PM > > From markath1 at verizon.net Thu Feb 7 09:45:08 2008 From: markath1 at verizon.net (Rick Martin) Date: Thu Feb 7 09:53:43 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Check Vendor needed In-Reply-To: <146901c86995$67119bf0$c801a8c0@Scott> Message-ID: <000401c86998$0ccac560$660a0a0a@advanced8l9v8x> We use Wilmer Just got an order, ships UPS from Ohio in about 6 working days. 800-4wilmer Good Luck Rick Martin Advanced Print & Copy 229 Memorial Avenue W Springfield, MA 01089 413-736-9808 markath1@verizon.net www.advancedprintandcopy.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of K. Scott Schoppert Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 9:26 AM To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Subject: [PrintOwners] Check Vendor needed ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Does anyone have a vendor for manual pegboard checks other than Eastern Systems. We ordered check for a very good customer before Christmas and they still have not shipped yet. Thanks, Scott K. Scott Schoppert Printing Impressions 68 Reliance Road Martinsburg, WV 25403 (304) 267-7327 scott@printing-impressions.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From barryt99 at gmail.com Thu Feb 7 10:40:01 2008 From: barryt99 at gmail.com (Barry Takayesu) Date: Thu Feb 7 10:40:21 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 2/6/08, QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: > Here's the challenge. See how easy it would be for your 12-year-old daughter > to place a similar order next time, using a fictitious company name and your > home address and a personal credit card. A circumvention that I heard from a printer friend was when he placed an order for 75,000 brochures through a 'Trade House' in Toronto, a hundred miles away, all went well. However, another Non-trade printer from the same city began pursuing the end user with undercut prices and his customer asked if he could match these numbers. Upon digging, he found that the two printers were related. But really, you don't need to be related, just need 2 individuals in collusion. The bad guys go to a different school than we do. We lock our cars. They use a rock and screw driver. That wasn't in the manual. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Barry Takayesu 10592 Wellington Rd Prestige Print & Graphics St.Thomas, ON N5P 3T1 519 631-8800 barry@prestigeprint.ca From bbahn at creativeimaginginc.com Thu Feb 7 10:42:34 2008 From: bbahn at creativeimaginginc.com (Bernard Bahn) Date: Thu Feb 7 10:45:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Font Conversion Software Message-ID: Can anyone suggest a reliable software that would convert Mac Postscript fonts to PC Postscript fonts? We've never had much luck, but maybe things have changed. Respectfully, Bernie Bahn | President | Creative Imaging Inc 1568 Fencorp Drive, STE. 200 | St. Louis MO 63026 Office 636-717-0690 ext 102 | Fax 636-717-0695 | bbahn@creativeimaginginc.com http://www.creativeimaginginc.com Xerox iGen3 on demand color printing and copying From kellycrom at gmail.com Thu Feb 7 10:55:09 2008 From: kellycrom at gmail.com (Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics) Date: Thu Feb 7 10:55:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Font Conversion Software In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <003001c869a1$d1cb1e60$6d01a8c0@KELLY> I use the program Crossfont (http://www.acutesystems.com). I have pretty much been able to convert any font I throw at it. Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Bernard Bahn > Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 9:43 AM > To: multiple recipients of Print Owners > Subject: [PrintOwners] Font Conversion Software > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Can anyone suggest a reliable software that would convert Mac > Postscript > fonts to PC Postscript fonts? We've never had much luck, but > maybe things > have changed. > > > Respectfully, > > > > Bernie Bahn | President | Creative Imaging Inc > 1568 Fencorp Drive, STE. 200 | St. Louis MO 63026 > > Office 636-717-0690 ext 102 | Fax 636-717-0695 | > bbahn@creativeimaginginc.com > > http://www.creativeimaginginc.com > Xerox iGen3 on demand color printing and copying > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From copythatnyc at aol.com Thu Feb 7 11:19:29 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (copythatnyc@aol.com) Date: Thu Feb 7 11:21:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CA37BC59C6DC0C-56C-58F@FWM-D02.sysops.aol.com> I had a problem myself once, when a customer of mine went to CompUSA to purchase a computer.? The salesperson ask him some questions & before you know it, he sold him on business cards & brochures with free set-up & printing for almost half of what I would charge.? I send a registered letter to CompUSA about this problem, but of course without any respondence.? That customer came in to see if I could match the price...well he's not my customer no more.? But I did inquire as to how he got those "ahem" great prices, that I should go to him for my work. So maybe those mega shops are putting us on morphine drip. Tommy Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Barry Takayesu To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 10:40 am Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** On 2/6/08, QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: > Here's the challenge. See how easy it would be for your 12-year-old daughter > to place a similar order next time, using a fictitious company name and your > home address and a personal credit card. A circumvention that I heard from a printer friend was when he placed an order for 75,000 brochures through a 'Trade House' in Toronto, a hundred miles away, all went well. However, another Non-trade printer from the same city began pursuing the end user with undercut prices and his customer asked if he could match these numbers. Upon digging, he found that the two printers were related. But really, you don't need to be related, just need 2 individuals in collusion. The bad guys go to a different school than we do. We lock our cars. They use a rock and screw driver. That wasn't in the manual. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Barry Takayesu 10592 Wellington Rd Prestige Print & Graphics St.Thomas, ON N5P 3T1 519 631-8800 barry@prestigeprint.ca _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Thu Feb 7 11:35:42 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Thu Feb 7 11:36:15 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 120# Glossy on a Doc 12? Message-ID: <47AB335E.6010604@sugarloafprint.com> Has anyone ever push 120# glossy stock (324 gsm) through a Doc 12? -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From kk1127 at mindspring.com Thu Feb 7 11:38:44 2008 From: kk1127 at mindspring.com (John Hughes) Date: Thu Feb 7 11:40:15 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over References: <910588.99523.qm@web31403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <033601c869a7$e7acde20$0b01a8c0@NOTEBOOK> Brought to you by the 4 Over PR Department . John Hughes Kwik Kopy Printing kk1127@mindspring.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "nasr hussain" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 8:16 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > > > 4over Inc. in Glendale, CA, is truly a current day > model of the old American dream. Since its inception > in 2001, 4over has experienced triple digit annual > growth, achieving over $42 million in sales and > becoming one of the most successful trade print shops > in the country. > > In the beginning, 4over founder Zarik Megerdichian had > no background in printing. An experienced website and > graphic designer, Megerdichian's first entrepreneurial > venture was an internet based business designing > business cards. Working through print brokers, > Megerdichian knew there had to be a better way. In > 2001, Megerdichian and his wife Tina Hartounian > founded 4over with a small two color used printing > press. "The two of us worked almost around the clock > in the beginning," laughs Megerdichian. Inefficiency > and quality issues, as well as the desire to grow his > business, led Megerdichian to Komori. > > "Our Komori rep, Joe Stramel, took the time to help us > choose the right press for our new business," says > Megerdichian. 4over's first Komori press, a Lithrone > 628, ran it's first job on February 3, 2003-a day that > marks another first for Megerdichian, the birth of his > first child. He also marks this date as the real > beginning for 4over. Their current press line-up is > impressive. In addition to a pair of Lithrone S40 > perfectors-a six and an eight color and a five color > Lithrone S40 with coater, 4over is home to North > America's first ten color Lithrone S40 Super Perfector > with double coater. This unique configuration press > prints and coats both sides of the sheet in a single > pass, producing bindery ready sheets as soon as they > reach the press' delivery. A six color Lithrone S40 > with UV is also scheduled for delivery. > > With five locations, the newest a 72,000 square foot > production facility, and over 200 employees, 4over > serves the business-to-business market entirely over > the internet, producing such products as business > cards, postcards, pamphlets, leaflets and brochures. > "We focus our business on the smallest possible > customer," says Megerdichian. who states that 4over's > top 100 customers are less than 1% of their total > business. 4over also knows their niche, running only > five different substrates and accepting no custom > work. "We know the sweet spot of our business and > don't deviate. If a customer requests a specific > paper, most of the time we can substitute one of the > stocks we run, but we're not afraid to turn down > business that doesn't fit our model," says > Megerdichian. > > > Megerdichian says that what separates 4over from the > competition is their ability to provide the big > three-quality, speed and price. "Some printers say it > is a challenge to deliver all three, but we do it all > day, everyday." 4over stays on the edge of > technology, utilizing the most advanced equipment > available in the industry. "It is very important to > have equipment that is efficient and can produce high > quality products very quickly. Our entire operation > is state of the art, and when you combine the quality > of our equipment with the caliber of our employees, we > offer a service that is second to none." > > "We have an extremely dedicated, hard working team," > says Megerdichian. The relationship at 4over is more > like family than employer/employee. The dynamic group > works together and all share in the success of 4over. > "We all work side by side; one hand washes the other," > says Megerdichian. 4over also gives back to their > community, with their "Believe" program, that > encourages employee participation in a variety of > charitable organizations. "4over provides support for > a number of community services that help the homeless, > women shelters, and Toys For Tots just to name a few. > We have found that this process of giving energizes > our team and also allows us to give back to our > neighbors in need," says Megerdichian. > > Always looking to expand their horizon, 4over's latest > innovation is a software product called "Diz 4 Biz" > that allows 4over customers to easily build an > internet business portal. Diz 4 Biz is totally > customizable. Our customers can easily design a > website that allows them to choose the products they > want to offer their customers. It will streamline the > order process for the end user as well for our > customers," says Megerdichian. The template based > software package offers a variety of templates and > images for end users to easily design business cards, > flyers and brochures. "This exciting new product will > allow us to add new customers and continue to rapidly > grow our business." > > Megerdichian also says his relationship with Komori > has played a big part in his company's success. > "Relationships are what our business is all about. > Komori has always worked with us, and helped us choose > the right products to complement our business and help > us grow. The technology Komori brings us is > outstanding. The fast makeready, the excellent print > quality and the flexibility of our presses are > critical to our success." The new LSSP brings 4over > additional capacity for their rapidly expanding > business. The ability to print and coat both sides of > the sheet at one time is a real benefit for us. We're > looking forward to reaping the benefits of this new > technology." > > What lies in the future for 4over? Megerdichian > already has his eye on additional press purchases and > continuing 4over's phenomenal growth rate. With a > sheepish grin, he says, "What's in our future? You'll > just have to wait and see." > > Nasr Hussain > Amana Graphics > Hamtramck, MI > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Looking for last minute shopping deals? > Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From jgross at techiowa.com Thu Feb 7 11:39:19 2008 From: jgross at techiowa.com (John Gross) Date: Thu Feb 7 11:40:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Horse? In-Reply-To: <47A9E625.28501.B92CE54@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <000501c869a7$ffbd4c70$6900000a@tech.local> Obama stepped on my toes least. John A. Gross Technigraphics, Inc Iowa City, Iowa 52240 techiowa.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Steve Blatman Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 3:54 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] A Horse? Importance: High ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Glad you didn't get snowed. Who was the best dancer? I've never gotten to ride RAGBRAI yet, although a nephew and brother- in-law have done it several times. It's still on my "bucket list." My longest ride so far was San Francisco to L.A.; my wife's was Seattle to San Diego. Steve > > Naah! We didn't get snowed at all by the candidates, it was a ball. We got > to dance with everyone and decide who was quick on their feet, made a good > impression and had a good grip. > > RAGBRAI is a fun bicycle trip. I'm just 20 minutes from the second last day > of this week long eating and drinking adventure. C'mon over. > > John A. Gross > Technigraphics, Inc > Iowa City, Iowa 52240 > techiowa.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Steve Blatman > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 12:58 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] A Horse? > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > Eight inches of snow this morning and still coming. Winter in Iowa can be > > interesting. > > > > Particularly in political season. First you get "snowed" by the > candidates, then by Mother Nature.... > > Soon it will be summer, and RAGBRAI season... > > Steve > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From jdaghir at gmail.com Thu Feb 7 12:03:25 2008 From: jdaghir at gmail.com (Jeff Daghir) Date: Thu Feb 7 12:09:03 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Font Conversion Software In-Reply-To: <003001c869a1$d1cb1e60$6d01a8c0@KELLY> References: <003001c869a1$d1cb1e60$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: <83d5b9620802070903w689a3142v134523863dda4397@mail.gmail.com> There's also TransType from Font Lab. www.fontlab.com -- Jeff Daghir MPS Printing, Inc. "The Ink & Paper People" Madison, IN www.mpsprinting.com jeff_daghir@mpsprinting.com From smc at sorrentomesa.com Thu Feb 7 12:18:52 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Thu Feb 7 12:20:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] If you love movies like I love movies... In-Reply-To: <000501c869a7$ffbd4c70$6900000a@tech.local> References: <47A9E625.28501.B92CE54@slb.inkspot.net> <000501c869a7$ffbd4c70$6900000a@tech.local> Message-ID: <200802071719.m17HJP9v083544@i2bnetworks.com> Then you are going to love this... I usually get in at about 6:00 AM to start the day and usually have iTunes in the background while I work. This morning I found an iTunes radio channel that I've never listened to before, and if movies are your thing, you'll just flip.... Its an Internet radio channel devoted to nothing but movie scores (right now I'm listening to the theme from the movie "The Right Stuff" and I got goosebumps) so on iTunes/Radio/Ambient/ about halfway down Gotradio - The Big Score enjoy. S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From rsmith at smithprintinginc.com Thu Feb 7 12:38:17 2008 From: rsmith at smithprintinginc.com (Randy Smith) Date: Thu Feb 7 12:28:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Customer Service Rep: paying commission are a bonus Message-ID: <002301c869b0$39c0b3f0$468c10ac@SMITHPRINT.local> I interested in knowing if any of you are paying a commission are a bonus to your CSR, based on sales they generate. What is the criteria that is set for this person? Thanks for your help, Randy Smith Smith Printing Company, Inc. P.O.Box 37 Leeds, AL 35094 Office: 205.699.2284 Fax: 205.699.8660 e-mail: rsmith@smithprintinginc.com From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Thu Feb 7 13:10:38 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Thu Feb 7 13:11:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <7B5B09AAB32F45598D0BBD3A7AF65E75@BEDROOM> References: <7B5B09AAB32F45598D0BBD3A7AF65E75@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <47AB499E.30602@sugarloafprint.com> From what I remember, you where a one man shop working 15-20 hours. Is this still true today? xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >> As I alluded to in an earlier post, >> and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that >> earned him a credibility handicap. >> >> What is his past? I've been on this list for many years and don't >> recall him >> doing anything different than what he's doing now. He operates in an >> unconventional manner. Some people insisted he couldn't possibly be >> doing what he >> claimed to be doing. Some claimed he was so inept he would be out of >> business >> in no time. Obviously he's still operating and still do things >> unconventionally. > > > I think the credibility handicap some perceive about me stems from > debates on different thinking mostly involving price. And although > I've always had the practice to price my products in the middle of my > market place, some still believed and where even convinced I was > undercutting everyone and was some kind of idiot who wouldn't last. > I'm in my 14th year in the same storefront location. With what I have > disclosed recently about using inkjet technology as a viable and > profitable alternative to laser and offset, sheds light on the fact > that you can indeed do things differently and still have success. When > I disclosed the amount of profit I was able to acheive, it was to > unbelievable for some on this list to accept, but indeed I was telling > the truth. I have constantly changed my business model in an ever > changing and more competitive print environment. I'm still changing my > business model as we speak as I clearly see a decline in the demand > for printing and a constantly decreasing profit margin in colour > printing. Frankly this worries me. This has focused my attention on > multimedia signage to add to my services and hopefully I have made > enough right decisions to last a few more years. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From xeroid at kos.net Thu Feb 7 16:00:14 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:12:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet References: <7B5B09AAB32F45598D0BBD3A7AF65E75@BEDROOM> <47AB499E.30602@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <51355FD641374C85B7BBECDA84AB044A@BEDROOM> > From what I remember, you where a one man shop working 15-20 hours. Is > this still true today? Not quite .... I am a one man inside shop, working 9-3 M-F with sales reps outside. Why do you ask? Everything is so completly automated and push button, it only takes one to perform the tasks necessary inside. I don't do any off the street small stuff to take me away from my computer screen where almost all of my products are produced from. A business card order for example is simply designing it on screen, commanding it to print, and when complete it's a quick visit to the business card slitter. A full box of cards can be ready in less than 15 minutes. Of course letterheads and envelopes are even easier. Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates Kingston, Ontario, Canada xeroid@kos.net >>> As I alluded to in an earlier post, >>> and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that >>> earned him a credibility handicap. >>> >>> What is his past? I've been on this list for many years and don't recall >>> him >>> doing anything different than what he's doing now. He operates in an >>> unconventional manner. Some people insisted he couldn't possibly be >>> doing what he >>> claimed to be doing. Some claimed he was so inept he would be out of >>> business >>> in no time. Obviously he's still operating and still do things >>> unconventionally. >> >> >> I think the credibility handicap some perceive about me stems from >> debates on different thinking mostly involving price. And although I've >> always had the practice to price my products in the middle of my market >> place, some still believed and where even convinced I was undercutting >> everyone and was some kind of idiot who wouldn't last. I'm in my 14th >> year in the same storefront location. With what I have disclosed recently >> about using inkjet technology as a viable and profitable alternative to >> laser and offset, sheds light on the fact that you can indeed do things >> differently and still have success. When I disclosed the amount of profit >> I was able to acheive, it was to unbelievable for some on this list to >> accept, but indeed I was telling the truth. I have constantly changed my >> business model in an ever changing and more competitive print >> environment. I'm still changing my business model as we speak as I >> clearly see a decline in the demand for printing and a constantly >> decreasing profit margin in colour printing. Frankly this worries me. >> This has focused my attention on multimedia signage to add to my services >> and hopefully I have made enough right decisions to last a few more >> years. >> >> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >> xeroid@kos.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> > > > -- > Ron Sardo > Sugarloaf Print Shop > mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com > www.sugarloafprint.com > 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From jim at visaliaidea.com Fri Feb 8 13:13:48 2008 From: jim at visaliaidea.com (James Laber) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:13:09 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Epson Stylus Pro 7600 Ultrachrome In-Reply-To: <20080208170004.9E744DE0A30@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <002f01c86a7e$5a40d140$5501a7c0@visaliaidea.local> Anyone ever replaced the print heads on one of these? Where do you find them and the instructions. Easy or very difficult? TIA Jim Laber Idea! Printing & Graphics Inc 1921 E Main St Visalia CA 93292 559-733-4149 X118 Fax: 559-636-3690 jim@visaliaidea.com http://www.visaliaidea.com/ From actionprintsteve at hotmail.com Sat Feb 9 10:41:47 2008 From: actionprintsteve at hotmail.com (Steve Davison) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:13:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] DI press owners group? Message-ID: I remember seeing a DI press owner's group. Is it still around? I just installed a Heidelburg DI and it would sure be nice to have some input on supplies, parts and the operation questions.. Thanks!Steve DavisonAction Print110 W. 13th StreetHelena, MT 59601 406-442-7595 steve@actionprintinc.com _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging.?You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join From bill at mauiprintworks.com Sun Feb 10 02:22:07 2008 From: bill at mauiprintworks.com (Maui Print Works) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Sales Gurus - Turning a bureaucrat Message-ID: I need advice on how to turn a Stupid donation request into a sales call. Here's the scenario. I got a fax from SCORE, they're supposed to be "Counselors to America's Small Business" They're having an Entrepreneur and Business Fair and are asking for donations that could be given away as prizes and could I give 500 business cards. The real odd thing is in the last paragraph. "If cash is given, gift certificates to Office Max or Kinko's will be purchased." WOW that just blew my mind. What do they think I am? Yep I think I'll just give cash to send to my competitor. How can they help small business when they don't even understand small business. Well my mind Ranted and Raved for a while. Then I thought, well why don't I go see the guy and see if I can turn some of those gift certificates toward my shop. What do I say? What would you say? What would you do? Bill Marsh Maui Print Works 70 Central Ave., Wailuku HI 96793 bill@mauiprintworks.com 808-242-6634 From borzou at falconprintandcopy.com Thu Feb 7 17:06:04 2008 From: borzou at falconprintandcopy.com (Borzou Azabdaftari) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:13 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <98f5b19a0802051053q4077257drfd8a8fc295b1c7b4@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080201190550.27129DC5E78@rb.enter.net> <47A74E58.5010506@sugarloafprint.com> <005601c86758$46b26ae0$0100a8c0@megy2yn7o6rj96> <47A76C41.1070208@sugarloafprint.com> <84f70d5e0802041204r174f31cdk70ef95635840f802@mail.gmail.com> <98f5b19a0802041448v7cf3a565t483442ce6595eb26@mail.gmail.com> <25891D4C9F3D455B8F6D7E0BBF3F190E@BEDROOM> <200802050044.m150ifMC010132@i2bnetworks.com> <98f5b19a0802051053q4077257drfd8a8fc295b1c7b4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1387BAB5-74B9-4350-8EE0-A0D81BF2E6D3@falconprintandcopy.com> Late to this one: "As unlikely as it seems that the big players would spend their R&D > resources to develop low-cost equipment that uses low-cost consumables > that will destroy their market for color, this bottom up trend *is* > quite likely to erode more and more of our market, pushing us further > and further up the ladder of profitable offerings and new revenue > streams." Its not unlikely at all, but its unlikely it has anything to with Wayne's set up. This clearly a list vs wayne pissing contest. Borzou Azabdaftari Falcon Print and Copy 1921 Gallows Road Suite 150 Vienna, VA 22182 t.703.442.0124 f.703.442.0134 borzou@falconprintandcopy.com On Feb 5, 2008, at 1:53 PM, Michael Vogel wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > On Feb 5, 2008 8:54 AM, Borzou Azabdaftari > wrote: >> >> Can we all stop >> with the questions about this. I've only been reading one out of >> ten, >> but its still really annoying. > > > It is not a membership requirement, Borzou, that you read every post. > Skip them if the tenor of the thread annoys you, as we all do with > things that are not of interest. As I alluded to in an earlier post, > and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that > earned him a credibility handicap. > > But that doesn't disqualify him from having the possibility of ever > having something pertinent to contribute. From all the questions and > answers, we have learned a lot about his system and can deduce that > it's not ready for prime time. But we've also been exposed to an > up-and-coming technology that could be the "next wave" and my (our?) > antennae have been alerted to watch for future developments. > > As unlikely as it seems that the big players would spend their R&D > resources to develop low-cost equipment that uses low-cost consumables > that will destroy their market for color, this bottom up trend *is* > quite likely to erode more and more of our market, pushing us further > and further up the ladder of profitable offerings and new revenue > streams. > > All such conversations have merit. > > > > -- > Michael Vogel > Sir Speedy Printing > 9 Research Drive > Milford, CT 06460 > tel 203-877-1231 > fax 203-878-2679 > mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com > www.eSirSpeedy.com > ==================================== > Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to > criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. > ~Lord Bacon > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From borzou at falconprintandcopy.com Thu Feb 7 14:36:51 2008 From: borzou at falconprintandcopy.com (Borzou Azabdaftari) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:28 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over In-Reply-To: <033601c869a7$e7acde20$0b01a8c0@NOTEBOOK> References: <910588.99523.qm@web31403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <033601c869a7$e7acde20$0b01a8c0@NOTEBOOK> Message-ID: <41BEEF9C-E797-414F-A99D-4B6FDBE4F7AE@falconprintandcopy.com> I'm going to apologize in advance if this is redundant. I've been putting in just over 80 hours a week the last few weeks (I know, its a good thing), and have been checking this list fairly sporadically. I still have over 100 unread emails just in my print list box. So please forgive me if someone's already pointed this out. Someone (I believe Scott) made an excellent point about the larger online placed targeting new businesses. VistaPrint, for example, doesn't want our customers. They're business model is based solely on attracting new businesses, and their marketing completely focuses on new businesses formed. While our current customers may be safe, our future customer base is in jeopardy. A company like 4over, is taking customer's from us as well, but they've also become a valued research for a lot of us. Their 42M is coming out of our pie, but there's still plenty for everyone to eat as long as you make sure you get yours. The ultimate outcome for each individual store is going to depend on how they react to the changing print environment, but the rules are pretty simple. 1. Don't offer 14 pt coated stock with UV coating. Unless you're going to sub it out to 4 over, you're going to have to charge WAY more than them, and/or go out of business. 2. Don't hate your customers. No matter what they do. Appreciate them, and they'll appreciate you. Remember their names, ask about their kids. Customer service and personal relationships will keep your business thriving. They should feel comfortable calling you and asking for anything. I tell my customer's if they want me to print "dunce" on an employee's head I'll find a way to do it. The more they lean on your for art, layout, and value-added services, the longer they'll stay around. Its not all about lower prices. 3. Quality. If it doesn't look good, run it again. Everything you print is a piece of advertising for you. Even if you know a customer will accept a white spot, or a scratch, or some toning, or whatever, it will and does reflect on you. Putting out crap will burn you, even if you never hear about it. Putting out good work turns into referrals, even if you don't know where they come from. 4. This kind of ties into 1, 2 and 3, but use stocks others won't use. We use 130# classic linen abw for our business cards. Its expensive, but if anyone should have an awesome business card, a printer should. We sell a LOT of 130# linen now. I've had two people stumble upon my card somewhere, tell their current printer they want to use that stock, and have their printer tell them no. They came to me, got quotes (one card was 2/0, the other 4/4), and both, independently went back to their other printers, to see why they couldn't do it. After they saw I was willing to do it, both printer's called their respective paper companies, and offered to match my price. Both customer's said no, and are now regular customer's of mine. It kind of ties into all of them, don't ever assume your customer's won't go somewhere else, give them whatever they want, and try to do things others won't do. I'm in interst of full disclosure, and just a little background on my situation, I'm 28, and been in the industry for exactly 3.5 years. My father basically called me one day and said he was selling the shop, unless I wanted it. Here I am, and he retired a year after I came on. We've seen about 30% growth every year, with no marketing of any substance. I've been doing some pretty serious networking, but its mostly been from just having really good equipment, a really good crew, and putting out really good work. I spend more on employees, equipment and supplies than most, and probably have smaller margins, but its working out pretty well. That being said, we're tiny. We're a 2000 sq ft shop, with four full-time employees, including myself. I'm definitely still very wet behind the ears, and am certainly no expert on anything. My opinions are based on my experience here, but I stand strongly behind them. I'm quite confident things are going to work out the way I laid out above. Borzou Azabdaftari Falcon Print and Copy 1921 Gallows Road Suite 150 Vienna, VA 22182 t.703.442.0124 f.703.442.0134 borzou@falconprintandcopy.com On Feb 7, 2008, at 11:38 AM, John Hughes wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Brought to you by the 4 Over PR Department . > > John Hughes > Kwik Kopy Printing > kk1127@mindspring.com > ----- Original Message ----- From: "nasr hussain" > > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 8:16 PM > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> >> >> >> >> 4over Inc. in Glendale, CA, is truly a current day >> model of the old American dream. Since its inception >> in 2001, 4over has experienced triple digit annual >> growth, achieving over $42 million in sales and >> becoming one of the most successful trade print shops >> in the country. >> >> In the beginning, 4over founder Zarik Megerdichian had >> no background in printing. An experienced website and >> graphic designer, Megerdichian's first entrepreneurial >> venture was an internet based business designing >> business cards. Working through print brokers, >> Megerdichian knew there had to be a better way. In >> 2001, Megerdichian and his wife Tina Hartounian >> founded 4over with a small two color used printing >> press. "The two of us worked almost around the clock >> in the beginning," laughs Megerdichian. Inefficiency >> and quality issues, as well as the desire to grow his >> business, led Megerdichian to Komori. >> >> "Our Komori rep, Joe Stramel, took the time to help us >> choose the right press for our new business," says >> Megerdichian. 4over's first Komori press, a Lithrone >> 628, ran it's first job on February 3, 2003-a day that >> marks another first for Megerdichian, the birth of his >> first child. He also marks this date as the real >> beginning for 4over. Their current press line-up is >> impressive. In addition to a pair of Lithrone S40 >> perfectors-a six and an eight color and a five color >> Lithrone S40 with coater, 4over is home to North >> America's first ten color Lithrone S40 Super Perfector >> with double coater. This unique configuration press >> prints and coats both sides of the sheet in a single >> pass, producing bindery ready sheets as soon as they >> reach the press' delivery. A six color Lithrone S40 >> with UV is also scheduled for delivery. >> >> With five locations, the newest a 72,000 square foot >> production facility, and over 200 employees, 4over >> serves the business-to-business market entirely over >> the internet, producing such products as business >> cards, postcards, pamphlets, leaflets and brochures. >> "We focus our business on the smallest possible >> customer," says Megerdichian. who states that 4over's >> top 100 customers are less than 1% of their total >> business. 4over also knows their niche, running only >> five different substrates and accepting no custom >> work. "We know the sweet spot of our business and >> don't deviate. If a customer requests a specific >> paper, most of the time we can substitute one of the >> stocks we run, but we're not afraid to turn down >> business that doesn't fit our model," says >> Megerdichian. >> >> >> Megerdichian says that what separates 4over from the >> competition is their ability to provide the big >> three-quality, speed and price. "Some printers say it >> is a challenge to deliver all three, but we do it all >> day, everyday." 4over stays on the edge of >> technology, utilizing the most advanced equipment >> available in the industry. "It is very important to >> have equipment that is efficient and can produce high >> quality products very quickly. Our entire operation >> is state of the art, and when you combine the quality >> of our equipment with the caliber of our employees, we >> offer a service that is second to none." >> >> "We have an extremely dedicated, hard working team," >> says Megerdichian. The relationship at 4over is more >> like family than employer/employee. The dynamic group >> works together and all share in the success of 4over. >> "We all work side by side; one hand washes the other," >> says Megerdichian. 4over also gives back to their >> community, with their "Believe" program, that >> encourages employee participation in a variety of >> charitable organizations. "4over provides support for >> a number of community services that help the homeless, >> women shelters, and Toys For Tots just to name a few. >> We have found that this process of giving energizes >> our team and also allows us to give back to our >> neighbors in need," says Megerdichian. >> >> Always looking to expand their horizon, 4over's latest >> innovation is a software product called "Diz 4 Biz" >> that allows 4over customers to easily build an >> internet business portal. Diz 4 Biz is totally >> customizable. Our customers can easily design a >> website that allows them to choose the products they >> want to offer their customers. It will streamline the >> order process for the end user as well for our >> customers," says Megerdichian. The template based >> software package offers a variety of templates and >> images for end users to easily design business cards, >> flyers and brochures. "This exciting new product will >> allow us to add new customers and continue to rapidly >> grow our business." >> >> Megerdichian also says his relationship with Komori >> has played a big part in his company's success. >> "Relationships are what our business is all about. >> Komori has always worked with us, and helped us choose >> the right products to complement our business and help >> us grow. The technology Komori brings us is >> outstanding. The fast makeready, the excellent print >> quality and the flexibility of our presses are >> critical to our success." The new LSSP brings 4over >> additional capacity for their rapidly expanding >> business. The ability to print and coat both sides of >> the sheet at one time is a real benefit for us. We're >> looking forward to reaping the benefits of this new >> technology." >> >> What lies in the future for 4over? Megerdichian >> already has his eye on additional press purchases and >> continuing 4over's phenomenal growth rate. With a >> sheepish grin, he says, "What's in our future? You'll >> just have to wait and see." >> >> Nasr Hussain >> Amana Graphics >> Hamtramck, MI >> >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________________________________ >> Looking for last minute shopping deals? >> Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From copythatnyc at aol.com Fri Feb 8 18:10:55 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability Message-ID: <8CA38BEFDDC3F4E-E3C-1BC0@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> If an employee gets in a car accident non work related.? Employee is has no fault insurance.? Is the employee intitled to disability?? I was told by my insurance agent that, if the employee has no fault, that she can't file for disability while she is getting money for the no fault.? Anyone have any experience in this? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From brianoday at eprint.us Thu Feb 7 18:46:12 2008 From: brianoday at eprint.us (Brian O'Day) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL In-Reply-To: <8CA37BC59C6DC0C-56C-58F@FWM-D02.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA37BC59C6DC0C-56C-58F@FWM-D02.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004a01c869e3$9f79ee40$800101df@eprint.local> Yesterday I was at the reception area. A 30 year old guy came in and asked if he could see a COLOR book. I asked him to clarify and he said he needed the number of the purple he wanted so he could spec it when ordering a banner on the WEB. I asked him if I cpuld quote it he said no he could get it cheaper on the web. I told him to ask the web shop to send him a reference book he stated he just wanted so borrow mine for a few minutes. When I asked him " What's in it for me and don't you support the local economy?" he got mad and left. Sure made me feel better than getting used! Somehow printers need to quit getting used to help our customers order on line. Brian O'Day ePrint 9970 SW Greenburg Rd Portland, Oregon brianoday@eprint.us 503-684-2679 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of copythatnyc@aol.com Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 8:19 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I had a problem myself once, when a customer of mine went to CompUSA to purchase a computer.? The salesperson ask him some questions & before you know it, he sold him on business cards & brochures with free set-up & printing for almost half of what I would charge.? I send a registered letter to CompUSA about this problem, but of course without any respondence.? That customer came in to see if I could match the price...well he's not my customer no more.? But I did inquire as to how he got those "ahem" great prices, that I should go to him for my work. So maybe those mega shops are putting us on morphine drip. Tommy Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Barry Takayesu To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 10:40 am Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** On 2/6/08, QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: > Here's the challenge. See how easy it would be for your 12-year-old daughter > to place a similar order next time, using a fictitious company name and your > home address and a personal credit card. A circumvention that I heard from a printer friend was when he placed an order for 75,000 brochures through a 'Trade House' in Toronto, a hundred miles away, all went well. However, another Non-trade printer from the same city began pursuing the end user with undercut prices and his customer asked if he could match these numbers. Upon digging, he found that the two printers were related. But really, you don't need to be related, just need 2 individuals in collusion. The bad guys go to a different school than we do. We lock our cars. They use a rock and screw driver. That wasn't in the manual. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - Barry Takayesu 10592 Wellington Rd Prestige Print & Graphics St.Thomas, ON N5P 3T1 519 631-8800 barry@prestigeprint.ca _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From melissa at kwiksolutions.com Fri Feb 8 11:33:56 2008 From: melissa at kwiksolutions.com (Melissa Uber) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:36 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] DPM34 HSC Message-ID: <004201c86a70$66b7ebb0$3e00000a@Melissa> Just throwing this one out there ? has anyone who owns a DPM34HSC ever had the laser data board fail? And if so, how old was the machine? We?ve had ours for 2 years and for the last year we?ve been complaining about void areas at the lead edge or outside side when we do screens. Finally got it resolved last week and the bill came to $5200.00!!!! Thanks, Melissa Melissa Uber Kwik Solutions...Everything in Print! HYPERLINK "mailto:melissa@kwiksolutions.com"melissa@kwiksolutions.com Jamestown - 20 W. 3rd St, Jamestown, NY 14701 (716) 483-3227 Warren - 326 Penna Ave W., Warren, PA 16365 (814) 726-5679 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1266 - Release Date: 2/8/2008 10:06 AM From xeroid at kos.net Thu Feb 7 19:43:36 2008 From: xeroid at kos.net (xeroid) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:40 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] printpelican.com - could someone check this please References: <7B5B09AAB32F45598D0BBD3A7AF65E75@BEDROOM> <47AB499E.30602@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <327A4A81D9CE4A8E848F59EE4D7868E4@BEDROOM> Not sure if the problem is from my end or is a problem with the Printpelican online pricing sytem? If I price a 9X12 evelope, black plus one PMS ... it is cheaper if you order 1500 than when you order 1000 ? Is this an error with their online ordering system ... are they even aware ? Wayne Stevenhaagen & Assocaites Kingston, Ontario, Canada From cyndy at pioneerprintinginc.com Fri Feb 8 15:15:35 2008 From: cyndy at pioneerprintinginc.com (Cyndy Wendt Harkins) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Down Today Message-ID: Just wondering if PO is down today? PONG seems to be alive and well. -- Cyndy Wendt Harkins President Pioneer Printing, Inc. 3133 S. 7th., Suite D Lincoln, Nebraska 68502 cyndy@pioneerprintinginc.com 402.483.7575 From slb at inkspot.net Thu Feb 7 18:35:23 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:43 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Help needed with Gradation controls on C500 Creo In-Reply-To: <002301c869b0$39c0b3f0$468c10ac@SMITHPRINT.local> Message-ID: <47AB4F6B.21466.11160B6F@slb.inkspot.net> I'm trying to use the gradation controls on our Creo, and have a quick question for anyone who has done that already, that the manual doesn't answer. TIA, Steve Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From mark at pipsturgeonbay.com Fri Feb 8 10:34:42 2008 From: mark at pipsturgeonbay.com (Mark Lake) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] can't delete folder Message-ID: I have a folder that will not delete. If I choose it and delete it, it goes away but next time the computer is rebooted, there it is again. There is nothing in it. I have deleted it and emptied the trash but it keeps coming back, just like a bad dream. Mark Lake PIP Printing 368 Jefferson Street Sturgeon Bay, WI 54235 920.743.7370 920.743.4633 Fax www.pipsturgeonbay.com Mark@pipsturgeonbay.com To send a file to us, please use the link below http://www.pip.com/Center/SendFile.asp?AddressID=845 E-mail message checked by PC Tools Spyware Doctor (5.0.0.187) Database version: 5.09130 http://www.pctools.com/spyware-doctor/ From segass at heritageprinting.com Fri Feb 8 13:21:11 2008 From: segass at heritageprinting.com (Steve Gass) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: Inkjet (new RISO 5500) / 2nd KM6500 In-Reply-To: <00da01c8684f$384b1950$0301a8c0@Leah> Message-ID: <001801c86a7f$62518680$6a1da8c0@BIGdell> Hello, Talked to RISO today on the phone and the major issue I have with the unit is it does not run GLOSS paper. I am talking with Capitol Office Solutions about putting in a second KM6500 in the next 30 days. Our first machine came in May 1st of 2007. First 3 Months (May-July) average: 18,800 clicks per month Second 3 Months (Aug-Oct) average: 28,300 per month Third 3 Months (Nov-Jan) average: 59,500 per month For February, we have done 38,600 clicks. When ordering the first KM6500, I wanted to do 10k clicks for the first 3 months, then 20k (2nd Qtr) then 30k (3rd qtr). (1 click equals 11x17) Thanks, Steve Gass Heritage Printing & Graphics, Inc. Leonardtown, Maryland Cell: 240-298-0102 Our Mission: To help your company achieve better results by improving the image you project in the marketplace. -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Havens Printing and Copy Shop Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 6:31 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: SPAM-LOW: Re: [PrintOwners] Inkjet (new RISO) ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** When you remember that the RISO started from the mimeograph family, this new machine is a welcome surprise. With a little time and some more ingenuity we may see a very competitive machine, quality wise. I'll be watching. Austin Havens, Owner Havens Printing & Copy Shop 200 N Main McPherson, KS 67460 620-241-5400 ahavens@sbcglobal.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles A. Lincoln" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2008 4:31 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] Inkjet (new RISO) > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I demoed one of these units in Denver and while the speed was incredible, > the quality was not that great. I think a person could tweak the file, > slow down the machine and get acceptable quality. These units are inkjet > and the tanks are huge. > > _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > > Charles Lincoln > ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY > 612 30th Avenue > Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 > (907) 451-1111 > fax (907) 451-4511 > > _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: > 269.19.20/1260 - Release Date: 2/5/2008 9:44 AM > > _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From braddpotter at juno.com Fri Feb 8 14:04:27 2008 From: braddpotter at juno.com (Brad Potter) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Is there a way to make a windows XP box call a dvd as a screen saver? (that will loop??) Message-ID: <20080208.110427.20050.0@webmail04.vgs.untd.com> Short question . I want a screen saver function that has both still and video in it. There are two purposes. One is to operate on a screen at a trade show I am doing. Pix of me as superman, video of equipment running. Picture of our big color machine. (business to business trade show) I have the raw images like stills, but I also have video clips of equipment running. The SIMPLE answer would be to put the video clips in the windows "my picrures" folder, and then have the "screen saver" in windows call that folder. That is easy, we do it with stills, but putting video files in that folder does not seem to work. The OTHER way would be to use a program to make a dvd. The downside is that I would have to remake the "dvd" every time we added a special, or when I want to put my "Brad as a Leprechan" in the rotation next month. But then I would need the screen saver function to call that dvd everytime the screen was unused. Believe it or not, people do look at the screen saver, and I KNOW we have made sales based on people saying that "I didn't know you did that" Go ahead and yell at me that I am not doing a good job of selling or communicating, but HEY isn't that what I am doing? thanx brad Brad Potter Your Printing Super Hero 3480 SE Bethel, Suite A Port Orchard, WA 98366 360.876.5350 voice 360.876.5615 fax _____________________________________________________________ Want to work all of your life? Click here for investment information and start saving today. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2121/fc/Ioyw6i3mJ0PqBvdvtID9pVIgoEIrIQzSnd3ej5Mmh5m1Mu5Tc5Kilm/ From jacemeister at gmail.com Fri Feb 8 16:10:23 2008 From: jacemeister at gmail.com (Jace Prejean) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:14:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Motor Message-ID: One of the motors in my Accufast tabber just died and I'm having a rough time finding a replacement. I've contacted companies over the internet and called around here. Even Grainger doesn't carry them! It is a Pittman GM9434G900-R6 motor. If you know of a vendor who carries these small motors, or a replacement for it, I'd appreciate a referral. TIA -- Jace Prejean Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc 922 Sunset Ave Houma, LA 70360 Phone 985-868-8273 www.BayouPrinting.com From lbaribeau at paragon-print.com Mon Feb 11 07:04:33 2008 From: lbaribeau at paragon-print.com (Linda Baribeau) Date: Mon Feb 11 06:57:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability References: <8CA38BEFDDC3F4E-E3C-1BC0@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <001a01c86ca6$44984560$042967d3@kp4> I had an employee that had a hysterectomy. Obviously not work related. Yes she collected disability. Course Wisconsin pays for whatever reason. Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tommy Melendez" To: Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 5:10 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > If an employee gets in a car accident non work related.? Employee is has no fault insurance.? Is the employee intitled to disability?? I was told by my insurance agent that, if the employee has no fault, that she can't file for disability while she is getting money for the no fault.? Anyone have any experience in this? > > > > Copy That, Inc. > "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" > 3515 E. Tremont Avenue > Bronx, N.Y. 10465 > 718.892.1859 > 718.892.2315 Fax > www.copythatnyc.com > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From rsmith at smithprintinginc.com Mon Feb 11 07:18:26 2008 From: rsmith at smithprintinginc.com (Randy Smith) Date: Mon Feb 11 07:08:27 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] FW: Customer Service Rep: paying commission are a bonus Message-ID: <000601c86ca8$3421e040$6701a8c0@SMITHPRINT.local> -----Original Message----- From: Randy Smith [mailto:rsmith@smithprintinginc.com] Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 11:38 AM To: PrintOwners (printowners@printweb.org) Subject: Customer Service Rep: paying commission are a bonus I interested in knowing if any of you are paying a commission are a bonus to your CSR, based on sales they generate. What is the criteria that is set for this person? Thanks for your help, Randy Smith Smith Printing Company, Inc. P.O.Box 37 Leeds, AL 35094 Office: 205.699.2284 Fax: 205.699.8660 e-mail: rsmith@smithprintinginc.com From bob at kwiksolutions.com Mon Feb 11 07:28:31 2008 From: bob at kwiksolutions.com (Bob Uber) Date: Mon Feb 11 07:36:00 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Motor References: Message-ID: <003a01c86ca9$9ff8ba90$7700000a@Typesetting> You can try Typac Inc. in Baldwinsville NY. We use them to service our Accufast tabber. 800/356-8964 or 315/638-9431. Bob Uber Kwik Solutions 20 W. 3rd St Jamestown, NY 14701 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jace Prejean" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 4:10 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] Motor > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > One of the motors in my Accufast tabber just died and I'm having a rough > time finding a replacement. I've contacted companies over the internet and > called around here. Even Grainger doesn't carry them! > > It is a Pittman GM9434G900-R6 motor. > > If you know of a vendor who carries these small motors, or a replacement > for > it, I'd appreciate a referral. > > TIA > -- > Jace Prejean > Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc > 922 Sunset Ave > Houma, LA 70360 > Phone 985-868-8273 > > www.BayouPrinting.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.2/1270 - Release Date: 2/10/2008 > 12:21 PM > > From John at mpcny.com Mon Feb 11 08:02:52 2008 From: John at mpcny.com (John Henry) Date: Mon Feb 11 08:02:15 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <20080211111357.94D28E05416@rb.enter.net> References: <20080211111357.94D28E05416@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <005201c86cae$696b05f0$3c4111d0$@com> "Not quite .... I am a one man inside shop, working 9-3 M-F with sales reps Outside." Wayne Stevenhaagen Wayne I am getting close to adding a salesperson. What are you paying yours? (More than one?) Salary or pure commission. Also what sales volume a month do they bring each? I know I am looking for about $400,000 as my fist year goal for full time salesperson. John M. Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company 125-129 East First Street Oswego, New York 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 Fax www.mpcny.com John@mpcny.com No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.2/1270 - Release Date: 2/10/2008 12:21 PM From bherion at bucksdigital.com Mon Feb 11 08:06:06 2008 From: bherion at bucksdigital.com (Bob Herion) Date: Mon Feb 11 08:06:46 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: can't delete folder In-Reply-To: <20080211111448.8C316E05CD4@rb.enter.net> References: <20080211111448.8C316E05CD4@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20080211080100.03215ea0@bucksdigital.com> At 06:14 AM 2/11/2008, you wrote: >I have a folder that will not delete. If I choose it and delete it, it goes >away but next time the computer is rebooted, there it is again. There is >nothing in it. I have deleted it and emptied the trash but it keeps coming >back, just like a bad dream. > >Mark Lake >PIP Printing Sounds like you can delete it, but there is a setting that is recreating the folder on startup. Have you run any virus or spyware software to see if anything snuck in on you? Need more info. Is this a folder you originally created yourself? Bob Herion - Ask me about variable data printing on our iGen3's Bucks Digital Printing v.215.579.4200 f.215-579-9510 90 Walker Lane Newtown, PA 18940 www.bucksdigital.com From tufelkinder at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 08:44:02 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Mon Feb 11 08:44:34 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Epson Stylus Pro 7600 Ultrachrome In-Reply-To: <002f01c86a7e$5a40d140$5501a7c0@visaliaidea.local> References: <20080208170004.9E744DE0A30@rb.enter.net> <002f01c86a7e$5a40d140$5501a7c0@visaliaidea.local> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802110544hf44304dx78666430616c2b2b@mail.gmail.com> James, Found a service manual for the 7600 online. We changed the pump/cap assembly, not the printheads, though, and that was a bit tricky. I imagine the printheads would be a bit more difficult yet. Where are you getting your replacement heads from? Service manual: http://tecun.cimex.com.cu/tecun/software/Soporte%20Tecnico/Manuales%20de%20Servicio/Epson/Ink%20Jet/SP76_9600_A.pdf Repair Manual: http://www.eserviceinfo.com/download.php?fileid=10251 Exploded Diagram (of the 9600, but they're pretty much the same): http://fileshare.eshop.bg/downloadsm/11566/EPSON_9600.html Good luck! Don't lose any screws. :-) Walt Mercersburg Printing Mercersburg, PA http://mercersburg.net 800-955-3902 tufelkinder@gmail.com -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From tufelkinder at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 08:51:25 2008 From: tufelkinder at gmail.com (Walt) Date: Mon Feb 11 08:51:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Epson Stylus Pro 7600 Ultrachrome In-Reply-To: <84f70d5e0802110544hf44304dx78666430616c2b2b@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080208170004.9E744DE0A30@rb.enter.net> <002f01c86a7e$5a40d140$5501a7c0@visaliaidea.local> <84f70d5e0802110544hf44304dx78666430616c2b2b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <84f70d5e0802110551sbce3d3v85098ef791464e5@mail.gmail.com> A better link for the service manual: http://www.jesseheap.com/SP76_9600_A.pdf Walt -~ Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so. -- Bertrand Russell From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Mon Feb 11 09:20:47 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Mon Feb 11 09:21:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <51355FD641374C85B7BBECDA84AB044A@BEDROOM> References: <7B5B09AAB32F45598D0BBD3A7AF65E75@BEDROOM> <47AB499E.30602@sugarloafprint.com> <51355FD641374C85B7BBECDA84AB044A@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <47B059BF.7030108@sugarloafprint.com> Why do I ask? To get a feel for what type of volume you are doing. xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >> From what I remember, you where a one man shop working 15-20 hours. >> Is this still true today? > > > > Not quite .... I am a one man inside shop, working 9-3 M-F with sales > reps outside. Why do you ask? Everything is so completly automated > and push button, it only takes one to perform the tasks necessary > inside. I don't do any off the street small stuff to take me away from > my computer screen where almost all of my products are produced from. > A business card order for example is simply > designing it on screen, commanding it to print, and when complete it's > a quick visit to the business card slitter. A full box of cards can > be ready in less than 15 minutes. Of course letterheads and envelopes > are even easier. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > >>>> As I alluded to in an earlier post, >>>> and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that >>>> earned him a credibility handicap. >>>> >>>> What is his past? I've been on this list for many years and don't >>>> recall him >>>> doing anything different than what he's doing now. He operates in an >>>> unconventional manner. Some people insisted he couldn't possibly be >>>> doing what he >>>> claimed to be doing. Some claimed he was so inept he would be out >>>> of business >>>> in no time. Obviously he's still operating and still do things >>>> unconventionally. >>> >>> >>> I think the credibility handicap some perceive about me stems from >>> debates on different thinking mostly involving price. And although >>> I've always had the practice to price my products in the middle of >>> my market place, some still believed and where even convinced I was >>> undercutting everyone and was some kind of idiot who wouldn't last. >>> I'm in my 14th year in the same storefront location. With what I >>> have disclosed recently about using inkjet technology as a viable >>> and profitable alternative to laser and offset, sheds light on the >>> fact that you can indeed do things differently and still have >>> success. When I disclosed the amount of profit I was able to >>> acheive, it was to unbelievable for some on this list to accept, but >>> indeed I was telling the truth. I have constantly changed my >>> business model in an ever changing and more competitive print >>> environment. I'm still changing my business model as we speak as I >>> clearly see a decline in the demand for printing and a constantly >>> decreasing profit margin in colour printing. Frankly this worries >>> me. This has focused my attention on multimedia signage to add to my >>> services and hopefully I have made enough right decisions to last a >>> few more years. >>> >>> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >>> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >>> xeroid@kos.net >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Ron Sardo >> Sugarloaf Print Shop >> mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com >> www.sugarloafprint.com >> 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From dennis.trump at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 09:31:29 2008 From: dennis.trump at gmail.com (Dennis Trump) Date: Mon Feb 11 09:32:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] DI press owners group? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41aa6a080802110631t70c6a41bkd76731dde02eb949@mail.gmail.com> It's a Google group - DI Pressowners. I'll forward an invitation to you. -- Dennis Trump Trump Direct a print and direct mail communications company Decatur IL www.trumpdirect.com trump@trumpdirect.com 217.429.9001 On Feb 9, 2008 9:41 AM, Steve Davison wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > I remember seeing a DI press owner's group. Is it still around? > > I just installed a Heidelburg DI and it would sure be nice to have some input on supplies, parts and the operation questions.. > > Thanks!Steve DavisonAction Print110 W. 13th StreetHelena, MT 59601 406-442-7595 steve@actionprintinc.com > _________________________________________________________________ > Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. > http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join_______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > From QKCONSULT at aol.com Mon Feb 11 09:51:36 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Mon Feb 11 09:52:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Spot varnishing color copies Message-ID: I'm inclined to believe that it can't be done, but I am curious as to whether anyone has tried to spot varnish something off a digital color copier. We have a special request and it involves only 350 covers printed on 100# matt stock and customer wants to use some spot varnish. Registration questions aside, will a varnish adhere and dry properly? Has anyone actually done this? Thanks. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp003000000025 48) From cpurvine1 at cox.net Mon Feb 11 09:56:44 2008 From: cpurvine1 at cox.net (Cora Purvine) Date: Mon Feb 11 09:57:21 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability In-Reply-To: <8CA38BEFDDC3F4E-E3C-1BC0@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA38BEFDDC3F4E-E3C-1BC0@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <006301c86cbe$516d9020$6501a8c0@corapurvine> Why would she get disability if it is non-work related anyway???? Class Act Printing and Foil Cora & Bernie Purvine, Owners 5801 W. Juno Ave. Wichita, KS 67215-1742 Ph/Fax: 316-522-0733 cpurvine1@cox.net www.ClassActPrinting.biz -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Tommy Melendez Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 5:11 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** If an employee gets in a car accident non work related.? Employee is has no fault insurance.? Is the employee intitled to disability?? I was told by my insurance agent that, if the employee has no fault, that she can't file for disability while she is getting money for the no fault.? Anyone have any experience in this? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners __________ NOD32 2863 (20080211) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com From bob at quickerprinter.com Mon Feb 11 10:01:18 2008 From: bob at quickerprinter.com (R Lavarnway) Date: Mon Feb 11 10:02:40 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Motor References: Message-ID: <006001c86cbe$f91b96a0$6701a8c0@pc3> We've replaced both of ours on the KT-2. We got them directly from Asmarc factory, 1-800-362-5734. hth Bob LaVarnway QP Printing & Mailing Elmira, NY 14901 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jace Prejean" To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 4:10 PM Subject: [PrintOwners] Motor > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > One of the motors in my Accufast tabber just died and I'm having a rough > time finding a replacement. I've contacted companies over the internet and > called around here. Even Grainger doesn't carry them! > > It is a Pittman GM9434G900-R6 motor. > > If you know of a vendor who carries these small motors, or a replacement > for > it, I'd appreciate a referral. > > TIA > -- > Jace Prejean > Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc > 922 Sunset Ave > Houma, LA 70360 > Phone 985-868-8273 > > www.BayouPrinting.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From segass at heritageprinting.com Mon Feb 11 10:07:46 2008 From: segass at heritageprinting.com (Steve Gass) Date: Mon Feb 11 10:09:15 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Maybe to help the newcomers In-Reply-To: <47B059BF.7030108@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <019f01c86cbf$dcfcfda0$6a1da8c0@BIGdell> Good Morning, Maybe to help the newcomers, under 2 years on list, to this list understand your business, a re-introduction from Wayne Stevenhaagen and others would be welcomed by the rest of us. Company History? How did you got into printing? Type of printing? Commercial, copiers only, presses only, Digital, DTP, film/plate, etc. How many employees? Sales per employee? Benefits given to employees? Sales? Under $500k, 500k-1m, 1m-3m, or over 3m in sales Front-end software: PrintSmith, PrintLeader, etc. Equipment List Thanks, Steve Gass Heritage Printing & Graphics, Inc. Office: 301-475-1705 Cell: 240-298-0102 Our Mission: To help your company achieve better results by improving the image you project in the marketplace. -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Ron Sardo Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 9:21 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: SPAM-LOW: Re: [PrintOwners] New High Speed Ink Jet ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Why do I ask? To get a feel for what type of volume you are doing. xeroid wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >> From what I remember, you where a one man shop working 15-20 hours. >> Is this still true today? > > > > Not quite .... I am a one man inside shop, working 9-3 M-F with sales > reps outside. Why do you ask? Everything is so completly automated > and push button, it only takes one to perform the tasks necessary > inside. I don't do any off the street small stuff to take me away from > my computer screen where almost all of my products are produced from. > A business card order for example is simply > designing it on screen, commanding it to print, and when complete it's > a quick visit to the business card slitter. A full box of cards can > be ready in less than 15 minutes. Of course letterheads and envelopes > are even easier. > > Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates > Kingston, Ontario, Canada > xeroid@kos.net > > >>>> As I alluded to in an earlier post, >>>> and Scott has since reiterated, Wayne has a "past" on this list that >>>> earned him a credibility handicap. >>>> >>>> What is his past? I've been on this list for many years and don't >>>> recall him >>>> doing anything different than what he's doing now. He operates in an >>>> unconventional manner. Some people insisted he couldn't possibly be >>>> doing what he >>>> claimed to be doing. Some claimed he was so inept he would be out >>>> of business >>>> in no time. Obviously he's still operating and still do things >>>> unconventionally. >>> >>> >>> I think the credibility handicap some perceive about me stems from >>> debates on different thinking mostly involving price. And although >>> I've always had the practice to price my products in the middle of >>> my market place, some still believed and where even convinced I was >>> undercutting everyone and was some kind of idiot who wouldn't last. >>> I'm in my 14th year in the same storefront location. With what I >>> have disclosed recently about using inkjet technology as a viable >>> and profitable alternative to laser and offset, sheds light on the >>> fact that you can indeed do things differently and still have >>> success. When I disclosed the amount of profit I was able to >>> acheive, it was to unbelievable for some on this list to accept, but >>> indeed I was telling the truth. I have constantly changed my >>> business model in an ever changing and more competitive print >>> environment. I'm still changing my business model as we speak as I >>> clearly see a decline in the demand for printing and a constantly >>> decreasing profit margin in colour printing. Frankly this worries >>> me. This has focused my attention on multimedia signage to add to my >>> services and hopefully I have made enough right decisions to last a >>> few more years. >>> >>> Wayne Stevenhaagen & Associates >>> Kingston, Ontario, Canada >>> xeroid@kos.net >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> PrintOwners Discussion List >>> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >>> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Ron Sardo >> Sugarloaf Print Shop >> mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com >> www.sugarloafprint.com >> 570-788-5099 . Fax: 570-788-6077 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 . Fax: 570-788-6077 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From championprinting at yahoo.com Mon Feb 11 10:16:53 2008 From: championprinting at yahoo.com (Ted Gelletly) Date: Mon Feb 11 10:17:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability Message-ID: <672882.40133.qm@web38908.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I think some folks are confusing disability with workman's compensation. WC is intended to pay workers injured on the job. Disability pays when you are unable to work (e.g. heart attack, surgery ,etc.) Ted Gelletly Champion Printing 5401 New Expansion Drive Eldersburg MD 21784 410-795-6464 ext.4 Fax 410-795-6488 ted@championprintingonline.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Cora Purvine To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 9:56:44 AM Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Why would she get disability if it is non-work related anyway???? Class Act Printing and Foil Cora & Bernie Purvine, Owners 5801 W. Juno Ave. Wichita, KS 67215-1742 Ph/Fax: 316-522-0733 cpurvine1@cox.net www.ClassActPrinting.biz -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Tommy Melendez Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 5:11 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** If an employee gets in a car accident non work related.? Employee is has no fault insurance.? Is the employee intitled to disability?? I was told by my insurance agent that, if the employee has no fault, that she can't file for disability while she is getting money for the no fault.? Anyone have any experience in this? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com From bob.weatherallprinting at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 10:31:06 2008 From: bob.weatherallprinting at gmail.com (Bob Lehman) Date: Mon Feb 11 10:34:49 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] DI press owners group? References: Message-ID: <00a701c86cc3$24f074e0$0b00000a@wp.com> Contact Mike Vinocur at www.mike@footcom.com Bob Lehman Weatherall Printing Co., Inc. P.O. Box 677 Tupelo, MS 38802 Ph 662-842-5284 Fax 662-844-4533 bob@weatherallprinting.com www.weatherallprinting.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Davison" To: Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2008 9:41 AM Subject: [PrintOwners] DI press owners group? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I remember seeing a DI press owner's group. Is it still around? I just installed a Heidelburg DI and it would sure be nice to have some input on supplies, parts and the operation questions.. Thanks!Steve DavisonAction Print110 W. 13th StreetHelena, MT 59601 406-442-7595 steve@actionprintinc.com _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join_______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 11:06:11 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Mon Feb 11 11:07:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Sales Gurus - Turning a bureaucrat In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802110806n13555d4eqf56d6a43947accbb@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 10, 2008 2:22 AM, Maui Print Works wrote: > > "If > cash is given, gift certificates to Office Max or Kinko's will be > purchased." > How can they > help small business when they don't even understand small business. I would certainly go to them to educate them on what small business is. They should quickly see the error of their ways and I would be very surprised if they didn't redirect those gift certificates -- to you and to other small local businesses. There might also be a nice news story here about the misperceptions about small business and the importance to a community of supporting local/small business. I would definitely seek a local pr person to work this angle as well. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From copythatnyc at aol.com Mon Feb 11 11:09:59 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 11:11:39 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Brians O'Day discussion In-Reply-To: <004a01c869e3$9f79ee40$800101df@eprint.local> References: <8CA37BC59C6DC0C-56C-58F@FWM-D02.sysops.aol.com> <004a01c869e3$9f79ee40$800101df@eprint.local> Message-ID: <8CA3ADFAF36C691-7F8-14A4@WEBMAIL-MC06.sysops.aol.com> Wish I had him Brian, I would of had a field day with him. We boost great service for what we do in-house.? I had a client that needed menu's for his grand opening of his restaurant.? He gave us a $50 deposit which was based on us doing the whole job, not just the artwork.? We are a full service provider.? We are not simply a?typographic house.? Once I provided the first sample in black & white not color, which is what the menu was to be printed.? He provided me a quote from another?printer.?Name & info was blocked out but I can see it was an email type of page.? ?He said and I quote.? If you can match or beat this price you can do the printing also.? Which I responded, If you can pay me $350 for the set-up you can have the artwork.? Order took 1? hours to set-up.? He was?pissed off.? When he first approached me, it was stipulated that this price was for the whole project, not just for setting up.? Of course he asked for the deposit back, which I stated I have?your signature on original order based on full project, not partial.? I personally wouldn't want this type of client for future orders.? Hence the reason why I stated?John Stewarts request at 7-8 rating?with online ordering. Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Brian O'Day To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Sent: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 6:46 pm Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Yesterday I was at the reception area. A 30 year old guy came in and asked f he could see a COLOR book. I asked him to clarify and he said he needed he number of the purple he wanted so he could spec it when ordering a anner on the WEB. I asked him if I cpuld quote it he said no he could get t cheaper on the web. I told him to ask the web shop to send him a eference book he stated he just wanted so borrow mine for a few minutes. hen I asked him " What's in it for me and don't you support the local conomy?" he got mad and left. Sure made me feel better than getting used! omehow printers need to quit getting used to help our customers order on ine. Brian O'Day Print 970 SW Greenburg Rd ortland, Oregon rianoday@eprint.us 03-684-2679 -----Original Message----- rom: printowners-bounces@printweb.org mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of copythatnyc@aol.com ent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 8:19 AM o: printowners@printweb.org ubject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I had a problem myself once, when a customer of mine went to CompUSA to urchase a computer.? The salesperson ask him some questions & before you now it, he sold him on business cards & brochures with free set-up & rinting for almost half of what I would charge.? I send a registered letter o CompUSA about this problem, but of course without any respondence.? That ustomer came in to see if I could match the price...well he's not my ustomer no more.? But I did inquire as to how he got those "ahem" great rices, that I should go to him for my work. So maybe those mega shops are putting us on morphine drip. Tommy Copy That, Inc. Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 515 E. Tremont Avenue ronx, N.Y. 10465 18.892.1859 18.892.2315 Fax ww.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- rom: Barry Takayesu o: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only printowners@printweb.org> ent: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 10:40 am ubject: Re: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** On 2/6/08, QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: Here's the challenge. See how easy it would be for your 12-year-old aughter to place a similar order next time, using a fictitious company name and our home address and a personal credit card. A circumvention that I heard from a printer friend was when he placed n order for 75,000 brochures through a 'Trade House' in Toronto, a undred miles away, all went well. However, another Non-trade printer rom the same city began pursuing the end user with undercut prices nd his customer asked if he could match these numbers. Upon digging, e found that the two printers were related. But really, you don't eed to be related, just need 2 individuals in collusion. The bad guys go to a different school than we do. We lock our cars. hey use a rock and screw driver. That wasn't in the manual. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- arry Takayesu 10592 Wellington Rd restige Print & Graphics St.Thomas, ON N5P 3T1 19 631-8800 barry@prestigeprint.ca ______________________________________________ rintOwners Discussion List ost: PrintOwners@printweb.org nfo: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ ore new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - ttp://webmail.aol.com ______________________________________________ rintOwners Discussion List ost: PrintOwners@printweb.org nfo: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ______________________________________________ rintOwners Discussion List ost: PrintOwners@printweb.org nfo: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From copythatnyc at aol.com Mon Feb 11 11:27:20 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 11:28:18 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability In-Reply-To: <006301c86cbe$516d9020$6501a8c0@corapurvine> References: <8CA38BEFDDC3F4E-E3C-1BC0@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> <006301c86cbe$516d9020$6501a8c0@corapurvine> Message-ID: <8CA3AE21BB0BC91-7F8-15ED@WEBMAIL-MC06.sysops.aol.com> This is what my insurance agent told me.? It won't reflect on me, in reference to the rates going up.? He just said that no-fault should be taking care of everything. Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Cora Purvine To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Sent: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 9:56 am Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Why would she get disability if it is non-work related anyway???? Class Act Printing and Foil Cora & Bernie Purvine, Owners 5801 W. Juno Ave. Wichita, KS 67215-1742 Ph/Fax: 316-522-0733 cpurvine1@cox.net www.ClassActPrinting.biz -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Tommy Melendez Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 5:11 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Disability ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** If an employee gets in a car accident non work related.? Employee is has no fault insurance.? Is the employee intitled to disability?? I was told by my insurance agent that, if the employee has no fault, that she can't file for disability while she is getting money for the no fault.? Anyone have any experience in this? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners __________ NOD32 2863 (20080211) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From sos at olympus.net Mon Feb 11 11:40:25 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Mon Feb 11 11:41:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Sales Gurus - Turning a bureaucrat References: Message-ID: <00be01c86ccc$ce23f3d0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Maui Print Works" > I need advice on how to turn a Stupid donation request into a sales call. > Here's the scenario. > I got a fax from SCORE, they're supposed to be "Counselors to America's > Small Business" > They're having an Entrepreneur and Business Fair and are asking for > donations that could be given away as prizes and could I give 500 > business cards. The real odd thing is in the last paragraph. "If cash is > given, gift certificates to Office Max or Kinko's will be purchased." > WOW that just blew my mind. ======================= In my experience SCORE volunteers are retired big business executives. They think they'll do a favor for us small little inky dinky businesses who obviously don't know what we're doing. This attitude is what you get. Congratulations on seeing it as a sales opportunity. Teach them the score. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From jdaghir at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 12:27:18 2008 From: jdaghir at gmail.com (Jeff Daghir) Date: Mon Feb 11 12:27:54 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Spot varnishing color copies In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <83d5b9620802110927y4dcb56aah3b9f72a97657aede@mail.gmail.com> Not exactly what you're asking but I did recently play around with a press-applied aqueous coating over a color copy. I used an aqueous coating from Kentucky Shine and applied it with our AB Dick 9910 over output from our KM C500. Kentucky Shine sent me samples of two products to try, KS-190 which is a high gloss coating and KS-196 which is gloss coating with a more aggressive "bite" and better rub resistance. They sent me two samples because they were afraid the high gloss coating would not adhere well to toner. They were correct - the high gloss coating would not lay down well over the toner - it was splotchy and uneven. The KS-193 did adhere to the toner but I would classify more as a semi-gloss - there was only a very slight difference between the coated and uncoated samples. Initially I tried to apply the coating with the Kompac dampening on the press since I thought it would be convenient to only have to clean up the two rollers in the Kompac. The Kompac was able to apply the coating but it applied way too much. The sheets kept blocking and sticking together. So I removed the Komapc and all of the rollers except for the minimum required to transport the coating from the ink fountain to one form roller and applied the coating using the ink train. It worked reasonably well. The coating does dry pretty quickly so you shouldn't let it sit idle on the press for more than 10 or 15 minutes. But it cleaned up very easily with a mixture of water, ammonia and some dishwashing liquid. Even after it had dried it was still pretty easy to clean up. I was doing a flood coating but I see no reason you couldn't do a spot coating with a cut blanket or an adhesive-backed blanket. I think you would have a hard time justifying it for purely aesthetic reasons as it just didn't look much glossier than uncoated prints but I could see doing it for protection on postcards or self-mailers. I did have some problems with the self-mailers I coated - the tail end of the 12x18 80# gloss text kept wrinkling when fed through the 9910. I didn't fiddle with it long enough to figure out if I could get it to feed without wrinkling or it it is an avoidable problem because the sheets are no longer flat after having gone through the fuser. On a related note I was experimenting with how heavy a sheet the C500 could handle. To my surprise it fed and fused a 15 point low density C1S blank from Carolina without any problems. It didn't seem to care if it was long-grain or short-grain. It made for some really nice, stiff business cards. -- Jeff Daghir MPS Printing, Inc. "The Ink & Paper People" Madison, IN www.mpsprinting.com jeff_daghir@mpsprinting.com John asked: > I'm inclined to believe that it can't be done, but I am curious as to > whether anyone has tried to spot varnish something off a digital color copier. We > have a special request and it involves only 350 covers printed on 100# matt > stock and customer wants to use some spot varnish. Registration questions aside, > will a varnish adhere and dry properly? Has anyone actually done this? From robin at protypeonline.com Mon Feb 11 13:11:14 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:11:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 4over HELL Message-ID: <566F7C35-2A91-4653-BDEB-BA0D2B09D7AA@protypeonline.com> 110% agree with you Brian. Sort of like the tv ad where the guy uses software to do his taxes instead of a live person. When he has trouble, his wife says, "well, why don't you call the box (that the sofware was in)?" If some folks want to order off the internet -- then they have to be willing to use them and NOT us, when they have questions, etc. AND, this guy sure had, shall I say, "NERVE", coming in and asking and then admitting he was USING you! Good for you Brian!!! robiin Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From robin at protypeonline.com Mon Feb 11 13:16:06 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:16:43 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet Message-ID: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> John, REALLY????? You think a brand new outside sales rep can generate $400,000 of NEW sales in one year?! I think you are dreaming! And when I get a chance, I'm going to look in my file folder with info. on these things and see what some of the industry consultants think is a realistic number. Does your $400,000 include some existing accounts? Robin Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From copythatnyc at aol.com Mon Feb 11 13:33:25 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:33:48 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under Message-ID: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per folder from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? Now it looks as though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going to be an extra $66.55 even before the job is completed.? I've never up charged customer before.? Especially when I don't stipulate 10% over or under on the pricing.? What if anything have you guys done in this case? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From slb at inkspot.net Mon Feb 11 13:33:49 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:34:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Heavy stock in C500 In-Reply-To: <83d5b9620802110927y4dcb56aah3b9f72a97657aede@mail.gmail.com> References: Message-ID: <47B04EBD.9458.1B49A49@slb.inkspot.net> We've run 12x18 100# Cougar cover through ours, as well as 100# Hammermill Color Copy cover. Both go through fine, but sometimes mark on the first side when we print the second side. We also routinely run 12pt Kromekote through it, but that's in the list of approved papers, so I'd expect it to work. What's the heaviest stock you put through yours (coated & uncoated), and how well does it work? I have a couple of potential customers who use 14pt or heavier business cards and postcards, and I'd been reluctant to go after that business, since I didn't think a C500 would do it. I've never shied away from pushing the limits of our equipment, though...what works for you? Steve > > On a related note I was experimenting with how heavy a sheet the C500 > could handle. To my surprise it fed and fused a 15 point low density > C1S blank from Carolina without any problems. It didn't seem to care > if it was long-grain or short-grain. It made for some really nice, > stiff business cards. > -- > Jeff Daghir > MPS Printing, Inc. > "The Ink & Paper People" > Madison, IN > www.mpsprinting.com > jeff_daghir@mpsprinting.com > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From slb at inkspot.net Mon Feb 11 13:36:51 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:37:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <47B04F73.30182.1B760B9@slb.inkspot.net> Robin, John is talking about running a 4 or more color MO (half size) press. Most of the figures I've seen (from Dave Fellman or John Stewart, for example) assume a small-press shop. Larger equipment implies the possibility of larger jobs, which might well allow the higher figure, but I'd be very interested to read about what the gurus see.... Steve > > John, > REALLY????? You think a brand new outside sales rep can generate > $400,000 of NEW sales in one year?! I think you are dreaming! And when > I get a chance, I'm going to look in my file folder with info. on > these things and see what some of the industry consultants think is a > realistic number. > Does your $400,000 include some existing accounts? > Robin > > Robin Niewold > Pro-Type Printing, Inc. > 130 N. Market Street > Paxton, IL 60957 > 217.379.4715 > robin@protypeonline.com > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From jacemeister at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 13:44:00 2008 From: jacemeister at gmail.com (Jace Prejean) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:44:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Motor In-Reply-To: <006001c86cbe$f91b96a0$6701a8c0@pc3> References: <006001c86cbe$f91b96a0$6701a8c0@pc3> Message-ID: Thanks to all who responded, on and off list. I have one coming in tomorrow. -- Jace Prejean Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc 922 Sunset Ave Houma, LA 70360 Phone 985-868-8273 www.BayouPrinting.com On Feb 11, 2008 9:01 AM, R Lavarnway wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > We've replaced both of ours on the KT-2. We got them directly from Asmarc > factory, 1-800-362-5734. > > hth > > Bob LaVarnway > QP Printing & Mailing > Elmira, NY 14901 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jace Prejean" > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 4:10 PM > Subject: [PrintOwners] Motor > > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > One of the motors in my Accufast tabber just died and I'm having a > rough > > time finding a replacement. I've contacted companies over the internet > and > > called around here. Even Grainger doesn't carry them! > > > > It is a Pittman GM9434G900-R6 motor. > > > > If you know of a vendor who carries these small motors, or a replacement > > for > > it, I'd appreciate a referral. > > > > TIA > > -- > > Jace Prejean > > Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc > > 922 Sunset Ave > > Houma, LA 70360 > > Phone 985-868-8273 > > > > www.BayouPrinting.com > > _______________________________________________ > From robin at protypeonline.com Mon Feb 11 13:52:05 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:52:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: Spot varnishing color copies Message-ID: <8C4A6514-34E3-479A-8D91-14F3B64F88C2@protypeonline.com> Wasn't there a big discussion on this a couple weeks ago? Maybe a couple months? On this list or maybe NAQP listserve.....I thought lots and lots of printers were doing this....maybe not spot, but definitely "coating" digital color on their offset presses. ???? Robin Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From cpurvine1 at cox.net Mon Feb 11 13:52:55 2008 From: cpurvine1 at cox.net (Cora Purvine) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:53:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under In-Reply-To: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <00b001c86cdf$5064a8a0$6501a8c0@corapurvine> Tommy, is there a chance that he will re-order. If so that might be an option to get rid of the extras. Sounds kind of cheap though. I charge $3.50 just for laser printed ones and am thinking about going up. I had a customer tell me that another company had ask him $10.00 per folder. Cora. Class Act Printing and Foil Cora & Bernie Purvine, Owners 5801 W. Juno Ave. Wichita, KS 67215-1742 Ph/Fax: 316-522-0733 cpurvine1@cox.net www.ClassActPrinting.biz -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Tommy Melendez Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 12:33 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per folder from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? Now it looks as though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going to be an extra $66.55 even before the job is completed.? I've never up charged customer before.? Especially when I don't stipulate 10% over or under on the pricing.? What if anything have you guys done in this case? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners __________ NOD32 2865 (20080211) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com From slb at inkspot.net Mon Feb 11 13:53:16 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Mon Feb 11 13:56:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under In-Reply-To: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <47B0534C.9207.1C66564@slb.inkspot.net> Tommy, Most foil folders I've seen from places like Foliomaster quote prices assuming a 2" x 4" image area, with price adders for more coverage. I haven't experienced 10% over/under billing from folder vendors -- although it seems routine in continuous forms, and sometimes in continuous labels, but it's something we always try to remember to ask about on brokered jobs. If I know a vendor bills 10% over/under, I'll quote the prices to the customer that way, and bill for whatever we deliver. On the rare occasion when a vendor didn't disclose (and I know I asked), I've sometimes been able to negotiate either returning the excess folders as unorders, or holding them for the next order, and paying when we sell them. Unless they're *very* customer service oriented, though, they'll probably stick to their billing. I'll let others chime in about appropriate markups on brokered work. This is an example, though, of why even doubling the net price might not be enough, and marking it up 50% can be way too little. When I did similar things early in my "printing" experience, I chalked it up to "tuition" and tried not to repeat it. Experience, in my case though, is what enables me to recognize a mistake when I make it again.... YMMV, Steve > > I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per > folder from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? Now > it looks as though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going to be > an extra $66.55 even before the job is completed.? I've never up > charged customer before.? Especially when I don't stipulate 10% over > or under on the pricing.? What if anything have you guys done in this > case? > > > > Copy That, Inc. > "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" > 3515 E. Tremont Avenue > Bronx, N.Y. 10465 > 718.892.1859 > 718.892.2315 Fax > www.copythatnyc.com > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From copythatnyc at aol.com Mon Feb 11 14:00:23 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:01:26 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under In-Reply-To: <00b001c86cdf$5064a8a0$6501a8c0@corapurvine> References: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> <00b001c86cdf$5064a8a0$6501a8c0@corapurvine> Message-ID: <8CA3AF77D2E927E-1308-FA3@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> I know this company & they will have re-orders.? Their sales rep. is someone I used to do a lot business for.? She used to sale hover rounds.? I use to print all her forms.? Now she is working for this company & passing me the work.? She is doing another 500 6 x 9 folders that I'm thinking on raising the prices per piece on those to compensate for the overages. Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Cora Purvine To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Sent: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 1:52 pm Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Tommy, is there a chance that he will re-order. If so that might be an option to get rid of the extras. Sounds kind of cheap though. I charge $3.50 just for laser printed ones and am thinking about going up. I had a customer tell me that another company had ask him $10.00 per folder. Cora. Class Act Printing and Foil Cora & Bernie Purvine, Owners 5801 W. Juno Ave. Wichita, KS 67215-1742 Ph/Fax: 316-522-0733 cpurvine1@cox.net www.ClassActPrinting.biz -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Tommy Melendez Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 12:33 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per folder from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? Now it looks as though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going to be an extra $66.55 even before the job is completed.? I've never up charged customer before.? Especially when I don't stipulate 10% over or under on the pricing.? What if anything have you guys done in this case? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners __________ NOD32 2865 (20080211) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From smc at sorrentomesa.com Mon Feb 11 14:03:42 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:05:17 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> References: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <200802111904.m1BJ4JZM027142@i2bnetworks.com> I heard a unsubstantiated rumour that John has a 220V cattleprod... S. At 10:16 AM 2/11/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >John, >REALLY????? You think a brand new outside sales rep can generate >$400,000 of NEW sales in one year?! I think you are dreaming! And when >I get a chance, I'm going to look in my file folder with info. on >these things and see what some of the industry consultants think is a >realistic number. >Does your $400,000 include some existing accounts? >Robin > >Robin Niewold >Pro-Type Printing, Inc. >130 N. Market Street >Paxton, IL 60957 >217.379.4715 >robin@protypeonline.com > > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2865 (20080211) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From jacemeister at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 14:06:56 2008 From: jacemeister at gmail.com (Jace Prejean) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:07:40 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <47B04F73.30182.1B760B9@slb.inkspot.net> References: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> <47B04F73.30182.1B760B9@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: I don't know about now, but prior to Hurricane Katrina I know there were printing salespeople in New Orleans selling in excess of $1 million per year. -- Jace Prejean Bayou Printing & Graphics, Inc 922 Sunset Ave Houma, LA 70360 Phone 985-868-8273 www.BayouPrinting.com On Feb 11, 2008 12:36 PM, Steve Blatman wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Robin, > > John is talking about running a 4 or more color MO (half size) press. > Most of the figures I've seen (from Dave Fellman or John Stewart, for > example) assume a small-press shop. Larger equipment implies the > possibility of larger jobs, which might well allow the higher figure, > but I'd be very interested to read about what the gurus see.... > > Steve > > > > > > John, > > REALLY????? You think a brand new outside sales rep can generate > > $400,000 of NEW sales in one year?! I think you are dreaming! And when > > I get a chance, I'm going to look in my file folder with info. on > > these things and see what some of the industry consultants think is a > > realistic number. > > Does your $400,000 include some existing accounts? > > Robin > > > > Robin Niewold > > Pro-Type Printing, Inc. > > 130 N. Market Street > > Paxton, IL 60957 > > 217.379.4715 > > robin@protypeonline.com > > > Steve Blatman > Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. > 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA > Tel: 610-647-0776 > Fax: 610-647-4560 > > > From copythatnyc at aol.com Mon Feb 11 14:10:00 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:10:27 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <200802111904.m1BJ4JZM027142@i2bnetworks.com> References: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> <200802111904.m1BJ4JZM027142@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <8CA3AF8D5266648-1308-106B@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> LOLOLOLOL Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Scott Cappel To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 2:03 pm Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? ? I heard a unsubstantiated rumour that John has a 220V cattleprod...? ? S.? ? ? At 10:16 AM 2/11/2008, you wrote:? >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? >? >John,? >REALLY????? You think a brand new outside sales rep can generate? >$400,000 of NEW sales in one year?! I think you are dreaming! And when? >I get a chance, I'm going to look in my file folder with info. on? >these things and see what some of the industry consultants think is a? >realistic number.? >Does your $400,000 include some existing accounts?? >Robin? >? >Robin Niewold? >Pro-Type Printing, Inc.? >130 N. Market Street? >Paxton, IL 60957? >217.379.4715? >robin@protypeonline.com? >? >? >? >_______________________________________________? >PrintOwners Discussion List? >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org? >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners? >? >? >__________ NOD32 2865 (20080211) Information __________? >? >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.? >http://www.eset.com? >? ? _____________________________________________? ? Scott Cappel? ? Sorrento Mesa Printing? 7398 Trade Street? San Diego, CA 92121-2422? 858-527-0800? 858-527-1740 FAX? http://www.sorrentomesa.com? ? LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa? ? Direct Links for Learning:? http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html? http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html? http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html? ? Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider? Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider? Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level? Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider? ? Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego? ? _______________________________________________? PrintOwners Discussion List? Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org? Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners? ? ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From kathy at mpcny.com Mon Feb 11 14:09:56 2008 From: kathy at mpcny.com (Kathy Henry) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:10:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <200802111904.m1BJ4JZM027142@i2bnetworks.com> References: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> <200802111904.m1BJ4JZM027142@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <002701c86ce1$b107f7f0$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> And if he ever tried to use it on me, he would find it stuck up his you-know-what... Kathleen Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing kathy@mpcny.com "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding 125 East First Street PO Box 815 Oswego, NY 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 (fax) (315) 532-0943 (cell) -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 2:04 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I heard a unsubstantiated rumour that John has a 220V cattleprod... S. At 10:16 AM 2/11/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >John, >REALLY????? You think a brand new outside sales rep can generate >$400,000 of NEW sales in one year?! I think you are dreaming! And when >I get a chance, I'm going to look in my file folder with info. on >these things and see what some of the industry consultants think is a >realistic number. >Does your $400,000 include some existing accounts? >Robin > >Robin Niewold >Pro-Type Printing, Inc. >130 N. Market Street >Paxton, IL 60957 >217.379.4715 >robin@protypeonline.com > > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2865 (20080211) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1267 - Release Date: 2/8/2008 8:12 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1267 - Release Date: 2/8/2008 8:12 PM From russ at mobile-print.com Mon Feb 11 14:13:03 2008 From: russ at mobile-print.com (Russ Peters) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:13:48 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under In-Reply-To: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <47B09E3F.7090901@mobile-print.com> 10% over/under is pretty standard, especially with things like folders, continuous forms, ad specialties, etc. We bill the customer for the overs. This isn't really an upcharge...the per-piece price isn't going up, just the quantity. I have a clause in my Terms of Sale which mention that 10% under/over constitutes acceptable delivery and the final price will be prorated to reflect the actual quantity. Of more concern, however, is your markup. I would add at least 100% markup to a small order like this. I usually factor in tax and shipping, then double my total cost. Russ Peters MOBILE PRINT, INC. 201 W. Central Road Mount Prospect, IL 60056 Phone: 847.398.6155 Fax: 847.398.0788 E: Russ@Mobile-Print.com W. www.Mobile-Print.com Tommy Melendez wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per folder from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? Now it looks as though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going to be an extra $66.55 even before the job is completed.? I've never up charged customer before.? Especially when I don't stipulate 10% over or under on the pricing.? What if anything have you guys done in this case? > > > > Copy That, Inc. > "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" > 3515 E. Tremont Avenue > Bronx, N.Y. 10465 > 718.892.1859 > 718.892.2315 Fax > www.copythatnyc.com > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > From John at mpcny.com Mon Feb 11 14:22:17 2008 From: John at mpcny.com (John Henry) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:23:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Outside Sales Goal In-Reply-To: <20080211190131.84A8AE081D1@rb.enter.net> References: <20080211190131.84A8AE081D1@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <001801c86ce3$6ade51f0$409af5d0$@com> Yes $400,000 this is for a company doing over a million in current sales and about $300,000 would be existing accounts and $100,000 in new sales. Kathy handles over that now and brought in more than that last year in new sales. She is not even doing full time sales. I think Expecting over $100,000 in new sales and to handle the rest in current is not out of line. Fellmen had ramp up program I recall. Some reason the $100,000 in new sales was what I recall as good goal. The avage salesperson "costs" 22-26% of all sales they bring in. A bad one ever more. So with overhead and paying them in the $40,000 You need them to doing at least $200,000 or your losing money. You likely will not see a real profit to your in that $400,000 a year range. John M. Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing Company 125-129 East First Street Oswego, New York 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 Fax www.mpcny.com John@mpcny.com No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.2/1270 - Release Date: 2/10/2008 12:21 PM From QKCONSULT at aol.com Mon Feb 11 14:23:17 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:23:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet Message-ID: There is a somewhat linear relationship between what an outside sales rep can bring in and produce and the size of the firm itself. It is almost a Catch 22 situation. Sales reps working for smaller companies (those with sales in the $300-999M range) tend to produce sales in $250,000 to $280,000, and this assumes 6-9 years experience working with this firm. At the other end of the spectrum, sales reps working for larger companies (those with sales in the $2 million + range) tend to be able to produce sales in $500,000 to $550,000, and this assumes about the same years experience. So, experience in sales (either overall or with the firm itself) does not seem to be the primary factor controlling how much they can sell. Of course their sales "expertise" as well as the ability of owners to truly manage sales reps is a key factor. However, I think single most important factor related to realistic sales levels is the printing capabilities of the firm itself. Larger firms by their very nature typically have larger capacity, a greater mix of services and the capability to produce jobs of greater complexity and thus $$$$. Personally, I think a firm would have great, great difficulty bringing on a new sales rep, even one with substantial experience and some accounts, and even with all the support and capabilities of a new firm, who could achieve anywhere near the $400,000 level in the first year. Your mileage may very! There is some excellent data on outside sales reps in the 2007-08 Wage and Benefits Study, including compensation levels, experience, and sales levels achieved by various breakouts. This study can be purchased from NAQP at: _www.naqp.org_ (http://www.naqp.org) John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From QKCONSULT at aol.com Mon Feb 11 14:25:29 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:25:55 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet Message-ID: In a message dated 2/11/2008 2:14:23 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, kathy@mpcny.com writes: And if he ever tried to use it on me, he would find it stuck up his you-know-what... Kathleen Henry And then you could use it up his rear as well! John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From copythatnyc at aol.com Mon Feb 11 14:28:38 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:29:03 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under In-Reply-To: <47B09E3F.7090901@mobile-print.com> References: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> <47B09E3F.7090901@mobile-print.com> Message-ID: <8CA3AFB6F99D7D7-1308-11C9@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> Thanks for all the reply's.?? As always I got good information for future pricing. Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Russ Peters To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 2:13 pm Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? ? 10% over/under is pretty standard, especially with things like folders, continuous forms, ad specialties, etc. We bill the customer for the overs. This isn't really an upcharge...the per-piece price isn't going up, just the quantity.? ? I have a clause in my Terms of Sale which mention that 10% under/over constitutes acceptable delivery and the final price will be prorated to reflect the actual quantity.? ? Of more concern, however, is your markup. I would add at least 100% markup to a small order like this. I usually factor in tax and shipping, then double my total cost.? ? Russ Peters? MOBILE PRINT, INC.? 201 W. Central Road? Mount Prospect, IL 60056? Phone: 847.398.6155? Fax: 847.398.0788? E: Russ@Mobile-Print.com? W. www.Mobile-Print.com? ? ? Tommy Melendez wrote:? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? >? > I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per folder from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? Now it looks as though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going to be an extra $66.55 even before the job is completed.? I've never up charged customer before.? Especially when I don't stipulate 10% over or under on the pricing.? What if anything have you guys done in this case?? >? >? >? > Copy That, Inc.? > "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service"? > 3515 E. Tremont Avenue? > Bronx, N.Y. 10465? > 718.892.1859? > 718.892.2315 Fax? > www.copythatnyc.com? >? > ________________________________________________________________________? > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com? > _______________________________________________? > PrintOwners Discussion List? > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org? > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners? >? >? >? > _______________________________________________? PrintOwners Discussion List? Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org? Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners? ? ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From acepm2 at gmail.com Mon Feb 11 14:30:31 2008 From: acepm2 at gmail.com (Thom Gulyas) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:31:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet In-Reply-To: <002701c86ce1$b107f7f0$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> References: <8234A2D1-0F73-4FEB-BBE0-3E39EA2FDB76@protypeonline.com> <200802111904.m1BJ4JZM027142@i2bnetworks.com> <002701c86ce1$b107f7f0$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: Kathleen, What you and John choose to do in the privacy of your own printing plant..... please post to YouTube! HA! Thom Gulyas ACE Printing & Mailing www.acepm.com On Feb 11, 2008 2:09 PM, Kathy Henry wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > And if he ever tried to use it on me, he would find it stuck up his > you-know-what... > > Kathleen Henry > Mitchell Printing & Mailing > kathy@mpcny.com > > > "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding > > > 125 East First Street > PO Box 815 > Oswego, NY 13126 > (315) 343-3531 > (315) 343-3577 (fax) > (315) 532-0943 (cell) > > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel > Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 2:04 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Outside Sales Goal WAS: New High Speed Ink Jet > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > I heard a unsubstantiated rumour that John has a 220V cattleprod... > > S. > > > > > At 10:16 AM 2/11/2008, you wrote: > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >John, > >REALLY????? You think a brand new outside sales rep can generate > >$400,000 of NEW sales in one year?! I think you are dreaming! And when > >I get a chance, I'm going to look in my file folder with info. on > >these things and see what some of the industry consultants think is a > >realistic number. > >Does your $400,000 include some existing accounts? > >Robin > > > >Robin Niewold > >Pro-Type Printing, Inc. > >130 N. Market Street > >Paxton, IL 60957 > >217.379.4715 > >robin@protypeonline.com > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >PrintOwners Discussion List > >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > >__________ NOD32 2865 (20080211) Information __________ > > > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > >http://www.eset.com > > > > _____________________________________________ > > Scott Cappel > > Sorrento Mesa Printing > 7398 Trade Street > San Diego, CA 92121-2422 > 858-527-0800 > 858-527-1740 FAX > http://www.sorrentomesa.com > > LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > > Direct Links for Learning: > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html > http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > > Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider > Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider > Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level > Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > > Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1267 - Release Date: 2/8/2008 > 8:12 PM > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1267 - Release Date: 2/8/2008 > 8:12 PM > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > -- Thom Gulyas ACE Printing & Mailing Berlin, Maryland 21811 www.acepm.com From jodib at blackfoot.net Mon Feb 11 14:49:20 2008 From: jodib at blackfoot.net (Jodi Bowser) Date: Mon Feb 11 14:50:17 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under References: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <00af01c86ce7$317f9870$0101a8c0@JodiPC> Tommy: after noticing most of our vendors quote with a 10% over/under, we include that with our quote verbage as well whether the job is done inside or out. 99% of my inhouse jobs the customer is receiving a few extra, but in those instances when it is special order paper, and we missed on guessing how extra to order (or the press or folder is hungry that day) we're covered. Jodi Bowser Pyramid Printing - Missoula, Montana www.pyramidprintingmt.com jodib@blackfoot.net Member NAQP #205787 Member Garden City BNI 406-728-1503 fax 406-728-0505 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tommy Melendez" To: Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 11:33 AM Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per folder > from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? Now it looks as > though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going to be an extra $66.55 > even before the job is completed.? I've never up charged customer before.? > Especially when I don't stipulate 10% over or under on the pricing.? What > if anything have you guys done in this case? > > > > Copy That, Inc. > "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" > 3515 E. Tremont Avenue > Bronx, N.Y. 10465 > 718.892.1859 > 718.892.2315 Fax > www.copythatnyc.com > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://webmail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From ssheers at sheergraphics.com Mon Feb 11 15:25:28 2008 From: ssheers at sheergraphics.com (Simon Sheers) Date: Mon Feb 11 15:25:58 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released In-Reply-To: <20080207012337.52000DDB86E@rb.enter.net> References: <20080207012337.52000DDB86E@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: Today's mail did not bring any survey, some four mailing days after Scott received his copy. Chicago is 1,262 miles from Melbourne, Florida, whilst San Diego, California is 2,500 miles. The mailman did deliver however, an advertising postcard of ours marked 'Nixi' (Not Deliverable as Addressed). Which is the identical address to which we mail invoices that are promptly paid! > Mine arrived today (Wednesday). (February 6, Ronald Reagan's birthday.) > > That was quick. > > S. Now where is the field for comments about the USPS in the mailing survey? Please reply to Simon Sheers at: Sheer Graphics Inc. 47 Chestnut Avenue, Westmont, IL 60559-1127 Tel: (630) 654-4422 Printing the message . . . and a whole lot more From jeff at hprinting.biz Mon Feb 11 15:32:19 2008 From: jeff at hprinting.biz (Jeff Haines) Date: Mon Feb 11 15:33:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released In-Reply-To: References: <20080207012337.52000DDB86E@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <20080211203213.8469.15133@hm-pop1.solinus.com> At 03:25 PM 2/11/2008, you wrote: >Today's mail did not bring any survey, some four >mailing days after Scott received his copy. >Chicago is 1,262 miles from Melbourne, Florida, >whilst San Diego, California is 2,500 miles. I finally got mine today. Jeff Haines Printing Co. 10575 W. Main Rd. North East, PA 16428 (814) 725-1955 ? Fax (814) 725-2244 email: jeff@hprinting.biz ? www.hprinting.biz From QKCONSULT at aol.com Mon Feb 11 15:46:48 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Mon Feb 11 15:47:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study Message-ID: Jesse from Bull's Head Printers in Connecticut posted the following comment on the NAQP list serv and I thought I would pass them on with his permission: I received my copy on Friday, 2/8, and read it over the weekend. Phenomenal information! This will help me price more aggressively while watching the bottom line grow. I've seen a few questions come up in this list regarding how to price for color copies; here is the answer. Along with Larry Hunt's Color Copier News, I have everything I need to be profitable in the color copy arena. I outsource 4-color printing and this study gives me a pricing guideline that will allow me to be more competitive. If you didn't participate in the study - BUY IT! Jesse Bull's Head Printers 200 Main Street, 3B Monroe, CT 06468 John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From smc at sorrentomesa.com Mon Feb 11 16:01:06 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Mon Feb 11 16:02:02 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200802112101.m1BL1hQs054578@i2bnetworks.com> So far, an excellent study. Only major boo boo I found was on Page 11, Portrait and Landcape listings are flipped, but we all know what its supposed to say, so it might not even be worth mentioning. Considering an effort of this magnitude and value, I would say that once again you've done a fabulous job John. Thank you. S. At 12:46 PM 2/11/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Jesse from Bull's Head Printers in Connecticut posted the following comment >on the NAQP list serv and I thought I would pass them on with his permission: > >I received my copy on Friday, 2/8, and read it over the weekend. Phenomenal >information! This will help me price more aggressively while watching the >bottom line grow. I've seen a few questions come up in this list >regarding how >to price for color copies; here is the answer. Along with Larry Hunt's Color >Copier News, I have everything I need to be profitable in the color >copy arena. > I outsource 4-color printing and this study gives me a pricing guideline >that will allow me to be more competitive. If you didn't participate in the >study - BUY IT! > > >Jesse > > >Bull's Head Printers >200 Main Street, 3B >Monroe, CT 06468 > > > > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy >Awards. Go to AOL Music. >(http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2865 (20080211) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From QKCONSULT at aol.com Mon Feb 11 16:42:06 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Mon Feb 11 16:42:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study Message-ID: In a message dated 2/11/2008 4:03:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: So far, an excellent study. Only major boo boo I found was... Considering an effort of this magnitude and value, I would say that once again you've done a fabulous job John. Well folks, I have just written Scott an angry, private email filled, as I do occasionally, with obscenities informing him that somehow his copy must have been the only copy where the tables were switched and that they are perfectly fine on all the other copies! There was probably a mystery spike in the electrical connects or maybe the fact that we were using a Fiery Rip instead of a Creo Rip that would cause something this disastrous to occur. Seriously, I can't believe the proofing that is done on something like this only to have two tables totally switched... sort of like proofing a daily newspaper just before it goes to press only to miss the glaring spelling error in the main headline on page 1 as the papers come off the web. Anyway, thanks Scott for pointing out that mistake as well as your compliments. As I told Scott, I really don't know whether we should attempt to insert a small erratum notice in the books that are awaiting fulfillment up at NAPL headquarters, or just wait for the few other nitpickers like Scott to catch this error. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From rick at jmjprinting.com Mon Feb 11 17:12:17 2008 From: rick at jmjprinting.com (Rick Foster) Date: Mon Feb 11 17:10:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: 10% over & under In-Reply-To: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3AF3B8F47ECA-1308-DAF@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: In reference to the message sent by Tommy Melendez, on 2/11/08, at 1:33 PM -0500: This comes up occasionally on the list. Some vendors actually use the 10% over rule to their advantage and always ship 10% over. How they can always hit exactly 10% over and never the quantity orders is way too obvious. Others are more honest and you do get the occasional 1-2% over/under. The key is to figure out early if this vendor is one who uses the over/under rule to boost income by 10% and just remember to adjust for that when quoting. Unfortunately you don't usually know this until after the first order. If you plan to buy out anything it is safe to assume there is the chance of over/under and you should price accordingly, and let the customer know there could be a slight over run as well as the possibility it could be short, up to 10% either way. We usually follow this up with, and since it is priced per piece you will only be paying for what is actually delivered if short, would you be interested in purchasing the overage if the is any? Depending on the product and the customer most times they buy the overs, if not we recycle them. > >I needed 500 folders gold stamped.? I received a price of 1.331 per >folder from the company.? I quoted the client 1.9965 per folder.? >Now it looks as though, based on the 10% overage run that it's going >to be an extra $66.55 even before the job is completed.? I've never >up charged customer before.? Especially when I don't stipulate 10% >over or under on the pricing.? What if anything have you guys done >in this case? -- Rick _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Rick B. Foster JMJ Printing Co. LLC - Snohomish, WA mailto:rick@jmjprinting.com http://www.jmjprinting.com 425.334.9716 Your Full Service Print Shop 425.397.9716 Fax We Appreciate Your Business! _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ From copythatnyc at aol.com Mon Feb 11 17:59:46 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Mon Feb 11 17:59:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CA3B18EE760960-1308-200D@WEBMAIL-MC11.sysops.aol.com> Like always X-cellent John. Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: QKCONSULT@aol.com To: printowners@printweb.org Sent: Mon, 11 Feb 2008 4:42 pm Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** In a message dated 2/11/2008 4:03:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: So far, an excellent study. Only major boo boo I found was... Considering an effort of this magnitude and value, I would say that once again you've done a fabulous job John. Well folks, I have just written Scott an angry, private email filled, as I do occasionally, with obscenities informing him that somehow his copy must have been the only copy where the tables were switched and that they are perfectly fine on all the other copies! There was probably a mystery spike in the electrical connects or maybe the fact that we were using a Fiery Rip instead of a Creo Rip that would cause something this disastrous to occur. Seriously, I can't believe the proofing that is done on something like this only to have two tables totally switched... sort of like proofing a daily newspaper just before it goes to press only to miss the glaring spelling error in the main headline on page 1 as the papers come off the web. Anyway, thanks Scott for pointing out that mistake as well as your compliments. As I told Scott, I really don't know whether we should attempt to insert a small erratum notice in the books that are awaiting fulfillment up at NAPL headquarters, or just wait for the few other nitpickers like Scott to catch this error. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From gamble at choiceonemail.com Mon Feb 11 19:36:46 2008 From: gamble at choiceonemail.com (Rick Bird) Date: Mon Feb 11 19:36:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] printpelican.com - could someone check this please In-Reply-To: <327A4A81D9CE4A8E848F59EE4D7868E4@BEDROOM> References: <7B5B09AAB32F45598D0BBD3A7AF65E75@BEDROOM><47AB499E.30602@sugarloafprint.com> <327A4A81D9CE4A8E848F59EE4D7868E4@BEDROOM> Message-ID: <045a01c86d0f$591785f0$0301a8c0@RICK> I say order the 1500 and send them to your client tell them it was 2 for 1 this week...:) Rick Bird Gamble Printing & Mailing Inc. 3649 California Road Orchard Park, NY 14127 (716) 662-1515 (716) 662-5917 - Fax gamble@choiceonemail.com - email -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of xeroid Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 7:44 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] printpelican.com - could someone check this please ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Not sure if the problem is from my end or is a problem with the Printpelican online pricing sytem? If I price a 9X12 evelope, black plus one PMS ... it is cheaper if you order 1500 than when you order 1000 ? Is this an error with their online ordering system ... are they even aware ? Wayne Stevenhaagen & Assocaites Kingston, Ontario, Canada _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From slb at inkspot.net Mon Feb 11 19:54:29 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Mon Feb 11 19:54:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] 2008-09 4C Practices and Pricing Study Released In-Reply-To: <20080211203213.8469.15133@hm-pop1.solinus.com> References: Message-ID: <47B0A7F5.1302.3111B7B@slb.inkspot.net> I got mine (near Philadelphia) on Friday. Steve > > At 03:25 PM 2/11/2008, you wrote: > >Today's mail did not bring any survey, some four > >mailing days after Scott received his copy. > >Chicago is 1,262 miles from Melbourne, Florida, > >whilst San Diego, California is 2,500 miles. > > > I finally got mine today. > > Jeff > > Haines Printing Co. > 10575 W. Main Rd. > North East, PA 16428 > (814) 725-1955 • Fax (814) 725-2244 > email: jeff@hprinting.biz • www.hprinting.biz > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2866 (20080211) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From robin at protypeonline.com Tue Feb 12 08:55:11 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Tue Feb 12 08:55:25 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] IKON CPP 650 folder Message-ID: <693961B4-3E30-42E1-993E-A7A12CE66944@protypeonline.com> Does anyone on this list have the KM 6500 or IKON CPP 650 WITH the folder that can be used either inline or off-line? I have been told that digital color folded on this unit does not crack? True? And, what is the heaviest stock that it will fold....without cracking? Cost of the unit? I want to save time and not use our tri-creaser (tabletop unit) to score THEN put through our folder..... robin Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From bob at gallagherprint.com Tue Feb 12 09:10:22 2008 From: bob at gallagherprint.com (Bob Gallagher) Date: Tue Feb 12 09:12:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] IKON CPP 650 folder In-Reply-To: <693961B4-3E30-42E1-993E-A7A12CE66944@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: On 2/12/08 8:55 AM, "Robin Niewold" wrote: > > Does anyone on this list have the KM 6500 or IKON CPP 650 WITH the > folder that can be used either inline or off-line? We have the 6500 with the folder and can fold either inline or post afterwards. It's great for short run letter folds, but it does crack some. Probably doesn't crack as much as a regular folder because the roller pressure at the folds isn't as tight as those on a production folder. What impresses us the most about it is that it will do a gate fold. We got it under the NAQP contract. I'll have to dig around to see what the cost was. Bob Gallagher Gallagher Printing, Inc. 601 W. Main Street Palmyra, PA 17078 717-838-1527 1-888-838-1527 Fax 717-838-5715 http://www.gallagherprint.com An Adobe Service Provider A Microsoft Publisher Provider Member, Adobe Solutions Network From rsmith at smithprintinginc.com Tue Feb 12 09:26:36 2008 From: rsmith at smithprintinginc.com (Randy Smith) Date: Tue Feb 12 09:16:27 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Paying commision or bonus to inside sales rep. Message-ID: <000a01c86d83$463e98f0$6501a8c0@SMITHPRINT.local> I want to know if you pay a bonus or a commission to your inside sales people? I have a young person who I believe could generate additional sales for us. I want to offer this person some type of an incentive. My question is do I pay them a bonus or a commission based on sales over a certain sales volume? What has worked for you? Randy Smith Smith Printing Company, Inc. P.O.Box 37 Leeds, AL 35094 Office: 205.699.2284 Fax: 205.699.8660 e-mail: rsmith@smithprintinginc.com From kirk at centralmichigangraphics.com Tue Feb 12 09:26:58 2008 From: kirk at centralmichigangraphics.com (Kirk Squiers) Date: Tue Feb 12 09:27:04 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] You gotta see this (Off) Message-ID: <5251CFF745ED1F4786517DE164D258B1198506@fpserver.FP.local> Check out our website. We have a presidential bumper sticker for sale. Going like Hotcakes!! Call our 800# give us your credit card #, We are selling for $5.00 each. Put it in an envelope with a .42 stamp. Sold about 300 already. (You do the math) Going to get rich on this one. Hope she beats Obama so I can have another few months to sell em:) Don't try stealing my idea either. I'll sick Stewart on ya! Kirk K. Squiers Central Michigan Graphics 1200 E. Oakland Lansing, Michigan 48906 www.centralmichigangraphics.com 517-230-8600 kirk@centralmichigangraphics.com From kellycrom at gmail.com Tue Feb 12 10:01:37 2008 From: kellycrom at gmail.com (Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics) Date: Tue Feb 12 10:02:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] ASN question Message-ID: <039701c86d88$2b23de90$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Does anyone know if it's possible to install just one part of CS3(Design Premium) from the ASN package on a different computer? I have the package installed on one Mac in prepress, but I have another designer who I want to work on some design in Flash, and I only have CS3 Standard on his computer. I really don't want to have to spend another $700 to get another copy of Flash(unless there is a cheaper way to upgrade my CS3 Standard package, which I haven't seemed to find). Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com From Minmandon at aol.com Tue Feb 12 10:06:03 2008 From: Minmandon at aol.com (Minmandon@aol.com) Date: Tue Feb 12 10:06:24 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] You gotta see this (Off) Message-ID: In a message dated 2/12/2008 9:28:10 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, kirk@centralmichigangraphics.com writes: www.centralmichigangraphics.com This sticker has been around for a while. A new one that I saw recently "Monica Lewinsky is voting Republican. The Democrats have left a bad taste in her mouth." Don Carney Minuteman Press Deerfield 954 421-9904 **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From smc at sorrentomesa.com Tue Feb 12 10:07:48 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Tue Feb 12 10:08:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] ASN question In-Reply-To: <039701c86d88$2b23de90$6d01a8c0@KELLY> References: <039701c86d88$2b23de90$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: <200802121508.m1CF8PkA017428@i2bnetworks.com> You can do a partial install on one computer but not part of the same package on another since they will both have the same serial number. Ebay can have legit copies of Flash, maybe even one version back for a better price. S. At 07:01 AM 2/12/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Does anyone know if it's possible to install just one part of CS3(Design >Premium) from the ASN package on a different computer? I have the package >installed on one Mac in prepress, but I have another designer who I want to >work on some design in Flash, and I only have CS3 Standard on his computer. >I really don't want to have to spend another $700 to get another copy of >Flash(unless there is a cheaper way to upgrade my CS3 Standard package, >which I haven't seemed to find). > >Kelly Crom >Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > >We've Moved!!! >2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 >Plymouth, MN 55441 >New Phone: (763)231-6970 >kellycrom@gmail.com >www.applied-graphics.com > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2867 (20080212) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From stalprint at charter.net Tue Feb 12 10:16:02 2008 From: stalprint at charter.net (Mark Stallings) Date: Tue Feb 12 10:16:18 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Score direction for folding Message-ID: <47B1B832.9080008@charter.net> Remember seeing somewhere - maybe in a magazine an article, that explained the proper direction to score a sheet that is to be folded. Best I can remember, you score so the fold in the opposite direction that you would think makes sense. Anyone have a link to an article or diagram explaining this? Thanks -- Mark Stallings Stallings Printing 1709 Walt Arney Road Lenoir, NC 28645 828-758-1126 stalprint@charter.net From smc at sorrentomesa.com Tue Feb 12 10:36:25 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Tue Feb 12 10:37:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Score direction for folding In-Reply-To: <47B1B832.9080008@charter.net> References: <47B1B832.9080008@charter.net> Message-ID: <200802121537.m1CFb3sO022275@i2bnetworks.com> http://tinyurl.com/2e3ppm S. at 07:16 AM 2/12/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Remember seeing somewhere - maybe in a magazine an article, that >explained the proper direction to score a sheet that is to be folded. >Best I can remember, you score so the fold in the opposite direction >that you would think makes sense. >Anyone have a link to an article or diagram explaining this? >Thanks > >-- >Mark Stallings >Stallings Printing >1709 Walt Arney Road >Lenoir, NC 28645 >828-758-1126 >stalprint@charter.net > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2868 (20080212) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From dominick at fmtc.com Tue Feb 12 10:55:47 2008 From: dominick at fmtc.com (Dominick's Printing) Date: Tue Feb 12 10:56:20 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Photoshop operating question Message-ID: <47B1C183.6080605@fmtc.com> I am very short of time, and before I spend some research time, wondered if any of you have had this problem. I have pasted the message from my daughter. I have never seen this before, and wonder if anybody has a "fix"...... """My Adobe Photoshop program won't work!! I don't really know what I did. I somehow shifted it in folders, and after I moved it back to where it was supposed to be, it quit working! I really would like this program back, because not only is it my favorite program, and I have several files that I can now no longer open. It is Photoshop CS2.""" She owns her own full version of Macintosh CS2, (not the Education version), as it is required for her college work. There are no CD's, just the huge download file, that she does not have with her. Your help is greatly appreciated. Joe Dominick Dominick's Quality Printing 542 W. Idaho Avenue Ontario Oregon 97914 541.881.1121 Fax 541.881.1599 www.dominicksprinting.com dominick@fmtc.com Ontario's ONLY Authorized Adobe Service Provider Microsoft Publisher Files Welcome Here! From sos at olympus.net Tue Feb 12 12:06:18 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Tue Feb 12 12:06:48 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Score direction for folding References: <47B1B832.9080008@charter.net> <200802121537.m1CFb3sO022275@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <022a01c86d99$96725bc0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Sheet face up. Score down so that the pushed down part of the score is like a hinge on the inside. If the sheet tends to fold up after scoring, you are pushing it back down when folding, or yes folding against the score. Having built a few cabinets, I remember it that way. You want the hinge on the inside, hidden when folded. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From jgross at techiowa.com Tue Feb 12 12:19:22 2008 From: jgross at techiowa.com (John Gross) Date: Tue Feb 12 12:19:33 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Score direction for folding In-Reply-To: <022a01c86d99$96725bc0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <000801c86d9b$68cf1760$1e00000a@tech.local> Or........., fold with the bump on the inside. Sort of counter intuitive really. John A. Gross Technigraphics, Inc Iowa City, Iowa 52240 techiowa.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 11:06 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Score direction for folding ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Sheet face up. Score down so that the pushed down part of the score is like a hinge on the inside. If the sheet tends to fold up after scoring, you are pushing it back down when folding, or yes folding against the score. Having built a few cabinets, I remember it that way. You want the hinge on the inside, hidden when folded. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From eugene at zapcolor.com Tue Feb 12 12:50:17 2008 From: eugene at zapcolor.com (Eugene Montanez) Date: Tue Feb 12 12:50:36 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Video Posted of UV Machine Message-ID: Here is a video I posted showing a sample job being done on the UV Coater. My operator and the machine were NOT going at full speed, since some people have commented on that! http://tinyurl.com/2twoaa Eugene Montanez ZAP Printing & Graphics 127 Radio Rd Corona, CA 92879 951-734-8181 Zapit@zapcolor.com From bob at gallagherprint.com Tue Feb 12 13:00:40 2008 From: bob at gallagherprint.com (Bob Gallagher) Date: Tue Feb 12 13:00:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Photoshop operating question In-Reply-To: <47B1C183.6080605@fmtc.com> Message-ID: On 2/12/08 10:55 AM, "Dominick's Printing" wrote: > """My Adobe Photoshop program won't work!! I don't really know what I did. I > somehow > shifted it in folders, and after I moved it back to where it was supposed to > be, it quit working! I'm far from an expert, but do know that applications have to be kept in the application folder. Assuming she returned the entire folder to Applications, she could try deleting the Preferences file and then starting Photoshop again. That solves a lot of other evils and may work with this problem. From nbaker at perfpress.com Tue Feb 12 14:08:54 2008 From: nbaker at perfpress.com (Nate Baker) Date: Tue Feb 12 14:09:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ripit For Sale In-Reply-To: <20080117170005.11DD0D7B905@rb.enter.net> References: <20080117170005.11DD0D7B905@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <20AE6845-1CED-4089-9186-2B7E9AFA88F2@perfpress.com> I've listed it on Ebay. Bidding ends in a couple of hours. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&Item=130196119787&Category=97233&_trksid=p3907.m29 We currently output film with it, so it comes with a Vastech DT-14 film processor as well as the packaged stuff from Ripit. 2003 11,650 images. Ugraded software (w/dongle), in-rip trapping & imposition. Poly plate processor HP PS10 proofer IBM server We used the poly plates when all we had was 3302's. When we started running process on a 20" landscape, we went to film. We just bought a Dimension, because I'm tired of stripping:-) Thanks, Nate Baker Perfection Press, Inc. 18009 Skypark Circle, Suite E Irvine, CA 92614 949-862-7482 direct 949-862-7484 fax nbaker@perfpress.com On Jan 17, 2008, at 9:00 AM, printowners-request@printweb.org wrote: > Send PrintOwners mailing list submissions to > printowners@printweb.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > printowners-request@printweb.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > printowners-owner@printweb.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of PrintOwners digest..." > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Digest ***** > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Slitting or kiss cutting (Robin Niewold) > 2. RE: Scanning (Rick Martin) > 3. Delta RIP 7 for sale... (Thom Gulyas) > 4. Re: Dahlgren Water System parts (John Steffes) > 5. Re: Dahlgren Water System parts (Chris) > 6. RE: Scanning (John Gross) > 7. What is the value of a used Heidelberg DI press (Peter Church) > 8. Re: What is the value of a used Heidelberg DI press > (Dan Huntingford) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 01:53:05 -0600 > From: Robin Niewold > Subject: [PrintOwners] Slitting or kiss cutting > To: printowners printowners > Message-ID: <54FD3044-1742-4D7C-9D45-BCEA451DFBEA@protypeonline.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes > > we have a rosback "tank" that we use for slitting (I call it kiss > cutting) the liner on transfer tape after we apply the tape to forms. > The machine is incredibly old and is to the point of needing > substantial money put into it to rebuild. What new equipment is out > there that can do this for us? Our rosback is a friction feed and we > have 5 slitting heads and we use them all at the same time quite a > bit. For jobs that have 10 or more slits per piece of tape and the > slits are only 1/2" apart from each other, we use dies we have made on > our windmill letterpress but the rosback is much faster when only 1-4 > slits are needed and we are slitting quantities of 25000 sheets. > robin > > Robin Niewold > Pro-Type Printing, Inc. > 130 N. Market Street > Paxton, IL 60957 > 217.379.4715 > robin@protypeonline.com > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 07:05:09 -0500 > From: "Rick Martin" > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Scanning > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Message-ID: <000001c85901$38b7fb40$660a0a0a@advanced8l9v8x> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > When we bought our DPX Genesis platemaker, the scanner software > ( QP lite > they call it) does have a despeckle feature as well as something > they call > "sanding" which will remove even more from the original. There is > a sliding > scale on this feature to adjust how much you want to take off the > original. > It is really pretty neat. > > Hope it helps. > > Rick Martin > Advanced Print & Copy > 229 Memorial Avenue > W Springfield, MA 01089 > 413-736-9808 > markath1@verizon.net > www.advancedprintandcopy.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of John Gross > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 4:34 PM > To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Scanning > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Is there a function in Adobe or Paperport's Scansoft for deskewing and > despeckle that anyone is aware of? > > Or does anyone have a software that will accomplish this? > > Thank you > > John A. Gross > Technigraphics, Inc > Iowa City, Iowa 52240 > techiowa.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 07:06:35 -0500 > From: "Thom Gulyas" > Subject: [PrintOwners] Delta RIP 7 for sale... > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > , printownersng > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > I just wanted to get this out before I list it on eBay. > > I have a Delta 7 RIP that I want to sell and thought it best to offer > it to you folks FIRST before I list online. > > It comes with windows NT Server 4.0 loaded on an IBM series 220 > server. All manuals for the RIP, original software and dongle are > included. > > Please contact me directly if you are interested. I'll be placing this > on eBay over the weekend. > > Thanks! > > Thom Gulyas > ACE Printing & Mailing > www.acepm.com > > > > > -- > Thom Gulyas > ACE Printing & Mailing > Berlin, Maryland 21811 > www.acepm.com > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:19:06 -0500 > From: "John Steffes" > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Dahlgren Water System parts > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > The roller Store talks about Diamond (Dahlgren) parts on their > website. > > http://www.therollerstore.com/rollers/syntac_rollers/dahlgren_pages/ > Dahlgren_Diamond_parts_Crestlines.pdf > > - > > > > > On Jan 16, 2008 6:25 PM, Bill Werkheiser wrote: > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Any suggestions on where to get parts since they are out of business? >> Thanks. >> >> -- >> Bill Werkheiser >> SE PrinTech, Inc. >> Coastal Mailing Services, Inc. >> http://WeLoveToPrint.com >> 315 E Banks Street - P O Box 27 >> Glennville, GA 30427 >> (912) 654-3610 voice >> (912) 654-3611 fax >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> >> > > > -- > John Steffes > Printing Plus > Delray Beach, FL > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:01:03 -0600 > From: Chris > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Dahlgren Water System parts > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Message-ID: <003501c85911$663e8ab0$6800a8c0@ipsmachine> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=response > > Dampener Coating Equipment > 800 527 5301 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Werkheiser" > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 5:25 PM > Subject: [PrintOwners] Dahlgren Water System parts > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Any suggestions on where to get parts since they are out of business? >> Thanks. >> >> -- >> Bill Werkheiser >> SE PrinTech, Inc. >> Coastal Mailing Services, Inc. >> http://WeLoveToPrint.com >> 315 E Banks Street - P O Box 27 >> Glennville, GA 30427 >> (912) 654-3610 voice >> (912) 654-3611 fax >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:46:29 -0600 > From: "John Gross" > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Scanning > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Message-ID: <001601c85917$beb8c880$6900000a@tech.local> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > This is to clean up text. I did find it in Scansoft, but there is no > control over the size of the speckles it removes. I can vary the > size in my > large format scanning software. I think that the scansoft function > will do > the job for me though. Thanks > > John A. Gross > Technigraphics, Inc > Iowa City, Iowa 52240 > techiowa.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Jodi Bowser > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 8:21 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Scanning > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > John: > > Is this to 'despeckle' a photo or? There are features in Photoshop > that > allow you to > do a Gaussain Blur and despeckle.....will some of those features > work for > you? > > Jodi Bowser > Pyramid Printing - Missoula, Montana > www.pyramidprintingmt.com > jodib@blackfoot.net > Member NAQP #205787 > Member Garden City BNI > 406-728-1503 > fax 406-728-0505 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John Gross" > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2008 2:34 PM > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Scanning > > >> ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >> Is there a function in Adobe or Paperport's Scansoft for deskewing >> and >> despeckle that anyone is aware of? >> >> Or does anyone have a software that will accomplish this? >> >> Thank you >> >> John A. Gross >> Technigraphics, Inc >> Iowa City, Iowa 52240 >> techiowa.com >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> PrintOwners Discussion List >> Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >> Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners >> > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 11:15:44 -0500 > From: "Peter Church" > Subject: [PrintOwners] What is the value of a used Heidelberg DI press > To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" > > Message-ID: <003201c85924$37a20980$7d01a8c0@key.local> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > I have a Heidelberg DI press. It has about 11 million impressions > and is in > good shape. It is the plus model; not the original model and not > the newer > Pro model. > > I also have a 26 inch four color Komori Lithrone and a CTP device > for that > press. So, we do not use the DI very much. The Komori is always > inkded up in > four color and it is so easy to make plates for it, that we tend to > run all > our short run jobs on that press because it is so easy to do. > > So, I am selling the DI. My used equipment dealer is offering me > $50k and he > will take it away. > > Do you think this is a good deal or does it have more value? > > Thanks, > > Peter Church > Keystone Press, LLC > 9 Old Falls Road > Manchester, NH 03103 > phone: 603-622-5222 > fax: 603-622-9432 > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 08:41:39 -0800 > From: "Dan Huntingford" > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] What is the value of a used Heidelberg DI > press > To: "Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only" > > Message-ID: <082401c85927$d5752540$6900a8c0@DANIEL> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > >> So, I am selling the DI. My used equipment dealer is offering me >> $50k and >> he >> will take it away. >> >> Do you think this is a good deal or does it have more value? > =================== > > I've seen older DI selling for under $50,000. Probably yours has > more value > if you can find someone who wants it. If you're in a hurry, the > dealer's > offer probably isn't too bad. He'll have to spend some time > selling it, > advertising it, etc. and then stand behind it and certainly deserves a > profit for his trouble. So I'd guess $50k is a good offer. > > Dan Huntingford > SOS Printing > 2319 Washington Street > Port Townsend, WA 98368 > Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF > sos@olympus.net > (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > End of PrintOwners Digest, Vol 29, Issue 57 > ******************************************* From prtquick at eos.net Tue Feb 12 14:18:12 2008 From: prtquick at eos.net (Scott Finke) Date: Tue Feb 12 14:16:35 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Score direction for folding In-Reply-To: <000801c86d9b$68cf1760$1e00000a@tech.local> References: <000801c86d9b$68cf1760$1e00000a@tech.local> Message-ID: I print some package hang tags. I provided them scored (correctly, on the inside) the first time we did them. The customer sent them to Guatemala to be assembled with bottles, glitter and a ribbon. In Guat. they folded everything backwards, not against the score! Since there is such a language gap there, we now score them 'backwards' all the time for this one. Scott Finke - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Visit our new location! Brentwood Printing & Envelope, Inc. 8630 Winton Road Cincinnati, Ohio 45231 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Phone: (513) 522.2679 Fax (513) 522.2692 Email: info@brentwood-printing.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - www.Brentwood-Printing.com - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Send us your file at: http://www.brentwood-printing.com/servicecenter/send_file.html - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Quick. Quality. Printing On Feb 12, 2008, at 12:19 PM, John Gross wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Or........., fold with the bump on the inside. Sort of counter > intuitive > really. > > John A. Gross > Technigraphics, Inc > Iowa City, Iowa 52240 > techiowa.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Dan Huntingford > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 11:06 AM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Score direction for folding > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Sheet face up. Score down so that the pushed down part of the score > is like > a hinge on the inside. If the sheet tends to fold up after > scoring, you are > > pushing it back down when folding, or yes folding against the score. > Having built a few cabinets, I remember it that way. You want the > hinge on > the inside, hidden when folded. > > Dan Huntingford > SOS Printing > 2319 Washington Street > Port Townsend, WA 98368 > Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF > sos@olympus.net > (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From robin at protypeonline.com Tue Feb 12 15:29:35 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Tue Feb 12 15:29:40 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ikon 650 & Variable Data Message-ID: <0906305A-F8BD-4D40-A864-8E86FDE9C30A@protypeonline.com> I know this has been discussed and I know I printed it all out and gave to my staff, but....one employee out sick and the other can't find the info and we are reluctant to rummage too much. We have a one- sided full color flyer to print on our Ikon CPP650 and we have an excel file with names, addresses. We want to imprint a return address and the address on side 2. My one dtp employee that is still new, said the steps to do this in InDesign are "many" and confusing. I told her we just need to purchase Fusion Pro and "get on with it" but the other (home sick) employee wants to research more before purchasing. YES, I am frustrated -- we have the Fiery Rip, no complaints, but I am now to the point that I want one of you experienced users to just tell me what to buy and then I'll do it and they can use it...NOW! Robin Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From smc at sorrentomesa.com Tue Feb 12 15:43:14 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Tue Feb 12 15:44:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ikon 650 & Variable Data In-Reply-To: <0906305A-F8BD-4D40-A864-8E86FDE9C30A@protypeonline.com> References: <0906305A-F8BD-4D40-A864-8E86FDE9C30A@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <200802122043.m1CKhq9M094486@i2bnetworks.com> Buy Fusiion Pro and get on with it...but you already knew that.... S. At 12:29 PM 2/12/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I know this has been discussed and I know I printed it all out and >gave to my staff, but....one employee out sick and the other can't >find the info and we are reluctant to rummage too much. We have a >one- sided full color flyer to print on our Ikon CPP650 and we have an >excel file with names, addresses. We want to imprint a return address >and the address on side 2. My one dtp employee that is still new, said >the steps to do this in InDesign are "many" and confusing. I told her >we just need to purchase Fusion Pro and "get on with it" but the other >(home sick) employee wants to research more before purchasing. >YES, I am frustrated -- we have the Fiery Rip, no complaints, but I am >now to the point that I want one of you experienced users to just tell >me what to buy and then I'll do it and they can use it...NOW! >Robin > >Robin Niewold >Pro-Type Printing, Inc. >130 N. Market Street >Paxton, IL 60957 >217.379.4715 >robin@protypeonline.com > > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2870 (20080212) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From championprinting at yahoo.com Tue Feb 12 15:57:52 2008 From: championprinting at yahoo.com (Ted Gelletly) Date: Tue Feb 12 15:58:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ikon 650 & Variable Data Message-ID: <722148.71506.qm@web38913.mail.mud.yahoo.com> You don't say how many, but if it's a substantial amount, you first will want to presort it in your mailing program in order to get postal discounts. If mailing is not your thing, or if it's a short run, print labels. I'm not sure FusionPro is valuable to a firm that lacks the ability to send automated mail unless you print variable collateral that is not mailed. Ted Gelletly Champion Printing 5401 New Expansion Drive Eldersburg MD 21784 410-795-6464 ext.4 Fax 410-795-6488 ted@championprintingonline.com ----- Original Message ---- From: Scott Cappel To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 3:43:14 PM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Ikon 650 & Variable Data ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Buy Fusiion Pro and get on with it...but you already knew that.... S. At 12:29 PM 2/12/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I know this has been discussed and I know I printed it all out and >gave to my staff, but....one employee out sick and the other can't >find the info and we are reluctant to rummage too much. We have a >one- sided full color flyer to print on our Ikon CPP650 and we have an >excel file with names, addresses. We want to imprint a return address >and the address on side 2. My one dtp employee that is still new, said >the steps to do this in InDesign are "many" and confusing. I told her >we just need to purchase Fusion Pro and "get on with it" but the other >(home sick) employee wants to research more before purchasing. >YES, I am frustrated -- we have the Fiery Rip, no complaints, but I am >now to the point that I want one of you experienced users to just tell >me what to buy and then I'll do it and they can use it...NOW! >Robin > >Robin Niewold >Pro-Type Printing, Inc. >130 N. Market Street >Paxton, IL 60957 >217.379.4715 >robin@protypeonline.com > > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2870 (20080212) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From craig at newhavenprint.com Tue Feb 12 16:25:48 2008 From: craig at newhavenprint.com (Craig Dellinger) Date: Tue Feb 12 16:22:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ikon 650 & Variable Data In-Reply-To: <0906305A-F8BD-4D40-A864-8E86FDE9C30A@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <20080212212211.00AF3E0C5F6@rb.enter.net> Hey Robin, If doing this in InDesign confuses this person, they're probably not the one to figure it out in FusionPro. InDesign Data Merge is about as simple as it gets. Anyway, I'd be glad to talk them through it if you want to have them call me. Craig Dellinger New Haven Print & Copy 7531 US 930 East Fort Wayne, IN 46803 260.493.3844 / Fax 260.493.3579 www.newhavenprint.com I know this has been discussed and I know I printed it all out and gave to my staff, but....one employee out sick and the other can't find the info and we are reluctant to rummage too much. We have a one- sided full color flyer to print on our Ikon CPP650 and we have an excel file with names, addresses. We want to imprint a return address and the address on side 2. My one dtp employee that is still new, said the steps to do this in InDesign are "many" and confusing. I told her we just need to purchase Fusion Pro and "get on with it" but the other (home sick) employee wants to research more before purchasing. YES, I am frustrated -- we have the Fiery Rip, no complaints, but I am now to the point that I want one of you experienced users to just tell me what to buy and then I'll do it and they can use it...NOW! Robin Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From brian at designotype.com Tue Feb 12 16:37:34 2008 From: brian at designotype.com (Brian Helminen) Date: Tue Feb 12 16:35:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Beware of stock prices References: <20080117170005.11DD0D7B905@rb.enter.net> <20AE6845-1CED-4089-9186-2B7E9AFA88F2@perfpress.com> Message-ID: <014001c86dbf$7aea84b0$6a01a8c0@brianspc> Last year, we brokered out an order of 40,000 #9 blue envelopes, printed in black ink on one side. Last week we got the job again, but this time, since our press work was slow I thought we'd be better off printing them in house so we ordered the blank stock and printed them ourselves. When the job was all finished, I looked at the costs. Last July the printed (brokered job) was $21 /M Today the BLANK stock cost me $34/M + we spent almost a day printing them. Lesson learned, for large envelope jobs, check prices closely, don't assume you can print them in house and make more $$$ Brian Helminen Designotype Printers, Inc. 22950 Airpark Blvd. Calumet, MI 49913 From DanF at MMSNY.com Tue Feb 12 16:52:32 2008 From: DanF at MMSNY.com (Dan Flatt) Date: Tue Feb 12 16:46:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study Message-ID: John, No sign of the study yet up here. FYI Dan Flatt owner Multi Media Services 11136-40 River Road Corning, NY 14830 main 607-936-3186 CELL 607-331-7217 PLEASE CALL MY CELL FIRST! Fax 877-684-3043 www.mmsny.com Isn't it time that you had a business printer printing for your business? Other contacts: Rick Bartholomew president -Manufacturing 607-769-8111 Belinda Wilcox vp-Finance & CSR's 607-936-3186 Rose Flatt VP - Creative 607-331-1555 Dick Shelford Sunset Operations 607-331-5775 Patty Carlson Strategic accounts 607-331-5314 Jenna Nailer IR operations liaison 607-331-5314 Dave Satterly IR operations 570-882-0485 Ralph Begeal CSR 607-331-5572 Steve Mullen CSR / paper 607-936-3186 Margaret Puffer Major accounts / mailing 607-936-318 Emily Colletta creative 607-331-7068 Judy Pruyne creative 607-331-5963 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com Sent: Monday, February 11, 2008 4:42 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** In a message dated 2/11/2008 4:03:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: So far, an excellent study. Only major boo boo I found was... Considering an effort of this magnitude and value, I would say that once again you've done a fabulous job John. Well folks, I have just written Scott an angry, private email filled, as I do occasionally, with obscenities informing him that somehow his copy must have been the only copy where the tables were switched and that they are perfectly fine on all the other copies! There was probably a mystery spike in the electrical connects or maybe the fact that we were using a Fiery Rip instead of a Creo Rip that would cause something this disastrous to occur. Seriously, I can't believe the proofing that is done on something like this only to have two tables totally switched... sort of like proofing a daily newspaper just before it goes to press only to miss the glaring spelling error in the main headline on page 1 as the papers come off the web. Anyway, thanks Scott for pointing out that mistake as well as your compliments. As I told Scott, I really don't know whether we should attempt to insert a small erratum notice in the books that are awaiting fulfillment up at NAPL headquarters, or just wait for the few other nitpickers like Scott to catch this error. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From QKCONSULT at aol.com Tue Feb 12 17:04:37 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Tue Feb 12 17:04:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study Message-ID: In a message dated 2/12/2008 4:48:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, DanF@MMSNY.com writes: John, No sign of the study yet up here. FYI Dan Flatt owner Multi Media Services Dan, Just checked the list quickly and did not see your name. Did you submit by mail or complete it on-line? Did you retain a copy before submitting it AND did you complete the majority of questions? If the answer is Yes no big deal.... fax me a copy of your survey and we will get a copy out to you ASAP. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Tue Feb 12 17:26:12 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Tue Feb 12 17:26:18 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Beware of stock prices In-Reply-To: <014001c86dbf$7aea84b0$6a01a8c0@brianspc> References: <20080117170005.11DD0D7B905@rb.enter.net> <20AE6845-1CED-4089-9186-2B7E9AFA88F2@perfpress.com> <014001c86dbf$7aea84b0$6a01a8c0@brianspc> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802121426v24632c1end842787c5c015f21@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 12, 2008 4:37 PM, Brian Helminen wrote: > > Lesson learned, for large envelope jobs, check prices closely, don't assume > you can print them in house and make more $$$ If you're going to limit your lesson learned to "large envelope jobs," you're bound to have to learn many more lessons individually. Here's a safer lesson: NEVER assume. ALWAYS review costs when you change job specs, especially on a reorder that has a price history/expectation. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From slb at inkspot.net Tue Feb 12 17:28:39 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Tue Feb 12 17:29:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] ASN question In-Reply-To: <039701c86d88$2b23de90$6d01a8c0@KELLY> Message-ID: <47B1D747.16895.7B1F389@slb.inkspot.net> How about installing the Standard version in prepress, and the Premium for the web designer? As I recall, we have separate serial numbers for CS3 and Acrobat 8, so you should be able to install CS3 Standard and Acrobat 8 in prepress, if needed. JAT, Steve > > Does anyone know if it's possible to install just one part of CS3(Design > Premium) from the ASN package on a different computer? I have the package > installed on one Mac in prepress, but I have another designer who I want to > work on some design in Flash, and I only have CS3 Standard on his computer. > I really don't want to have to spend another $700 to get another copy of > Flash(unless there is a cheaper way to upgrade my CS3 Standard package, > which I haven't seemed to find). > > Kelly Crom > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > > We've Moved!!! > 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 > Plymouth, MN 55441 > New Phone: (763)231-6970 > kellycrom@gmail.com > www.applied-graphics.com > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2870 (20080212) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From scott at usacolor.com Tue Feb 12 17:32:32 2008 From: scott at usacolor.com (scott) Date: Tue Feb 12 17:30:44 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47B21E80.3070407@usacolor.com> Got mine Tuesday! Scott Balsiger, President USA Color Printing Inc. www.usacolor.com 791 Manhomen Dr. Bemidji, MN 56601 800-759-9126 218-759-9126 218-759-2883(fax) 218-556-5505(cell) QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >In a message dated 2/12/2008 4:48:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >DanF@MMSNY.com writes: > >John, >No sign of the study yet up here. FYI > >Dan Flatt >owner >Multi Media Services > > > >Dan, > >Just checked the list quickly and did not see your name. Did you submit by >mail or complete it on-line? > >Did you retain a copy before submitting it AND did you complete the majority >of questions? If the answer is Yes no big deal.... fax me a copy of your >survey and we will get a copy out to you ASAP. > > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy >Awards. Go to AOL Music. >(http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > From printer at ptialaska.net Tue Feb 12 17:46:20 2008 From: printer at ptialaska.net (Charles A. Lincoln) Date: Tue Feb 12 17:46:28 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] ASN question In-Reply-To: <47B1D747.16895.7B1F389@slb.inkspot.net> References: <47B1D747.16895.7B1F389@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <2C405F7E-18C8-4B92-8EBB-B19EC32F4D7B@ptialaska.net> On Feb 12, 2008, at 1:28 PM, Steve Blatman wrote: >> >> Does anyone know if it's possible to install just one part of >> CS3(Design >> Premium) from the ASN package on a different computer? I have the >> package >> installed on one Mac in prepress, but I have another designer who I >> want to >> work on some design in Flash, and I only have CS3 Standard on his >> computer. >> I really don't want to have to spend another $700 to get another >> copy of >> Flash(unless there is a cheaper way to upgrade my CS3 Standard >> package, >> which I haven't seemed to find). REPLY: You can install it on more than one computer, but you can only use it on one at a time. If it is networked it will not let you run it on more than one at the same time... _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Charles Lincoln ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY 612 30th Avenue Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 (907) 451-1111 fax (907) 451-4511 _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ From kellycrom at gmail.com Tue Feb 12 17:54:38 2008 From: kellycrom at gmail.com (Kelly Crom at Applied Graphics) Date: Tue Feb 12 17:54:34 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] ASN question In-Reply-To: <47B1D747.16895.7B1F389@slb.inkspot.net> References: <039701c86d88$2b23de90$6d01a8c0@KELLY> <47B1D747.16895.7B1F389@slb.inkspot.net> Message-ID: <043601c86dca$3f845e40$6d01a8c0@KELLY> I thought about that, but the mess with having to de-activate and un-install from both machines, THEN, for the CS3 Standard I will have to track down my old CS install info since the CS3 Standard was an upgrade. I checked ebay for Flash CS3 Pro, and found many copies under $400, but if you read the fine print, they are all academic versions, and I really don't feel like going back to school. Kelly Crom Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. We've Moved!!! 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 Plymouth, MN 55441 New Phone: (763)231-6970 kellycrom@gmail.com www.applied-graphics.com > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Steve Blatman > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 4:29 PM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] ASN question > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > How about installing the Standard version in prepress, and the > Premium for the web designer? As I recall, we have separate serial > numbers for CS3 and Acrobat 8, so you should be able to install CS3 > Standard and Acrobat 8 in prepress, if needed. > > JAT, > Steve > > > > > > Does anyone know if it's possible to install just one part > of CS3(Design > > Premium) from the ASN package on a different computer? I > have the package > > installed on one Mac in prepress, but I have another > designer who I want to > > work on some design in Flash, and I only have CS3 Standard > on his computer. > > I really don't want to have to spend another $700 to get > another copy of > > Flash(unless there is a cheaper way to upgrade my CS3 > Standard package, > > which I haven't seemed to find). > > > > Kelly Crom > > Applied Graphics Associates, Inc. > > > > We've Moved!!! > > 2405 Annapolis Lane N, #250 > > Plymouth, MN 55441 > > New Phone: (763)231-6970 > > kellycrom@gmail.com > > www.applied-graphics.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > > > > > __________ NOD32 2870 (20080212) Information __________ > > > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > > Steve Blatman > Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. > 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA > Tel: 610-647-0776 > Fax: 610-647-4560 > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From bob at rjmprinting.com Tue Feb 12 18:01:28 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Tue Feb 12 18:02:08 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Indigo 1050 Message-ID: Hi, I have an opportunity to buy a used Indigo 1050. We currently have a KM 500 and a GTO 4C. Our product mix is going more digital but I am not familiar with the Indigo. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks! Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com From craig at newhavenprint.com Tue Feb 12 18:31:33 2008 From: craig at newhavenprint.com (Craig Dellinger) Date: Tue Feb 12 18:27:55 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] ASN question In-Reply-To: <2C405F7E-18C8-4B92-8EBB-B19EC32F4D7B@ptialaska.net> Message-ID: <20080212232754.649F5E0CC19@rb.enter.net> Actually, each license is capable of running on two computers on the same network at the same time. At least on CS3. If I hadn't already purchased 4 full licenses prior to CS3 (when it wouldn't work to have two running at the same time), I'd be tempted. Adobe has even admitted on several forums that it expects people to be running CS3 on two computers at once. Two is the limit though for activation. Craig Dellinger New Haven Print & Copy 7531 US 930 East Fort Wayne, IN 46803 260.493.3844 / Fax 260.493.3579 www.newhavenprint.com > REPLY: > You can install it on more than one computer, but you can > only use it on one at a time. If it is networked it will not > let you run it on more than one at the same time... > Charles Lincoln > ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY From ep101 at technaprint.com Tue Feb 12 18:31:01 2008 From: ep101 at technaprint.com (Eric Pearson) Date: Tue Feb 12 18:31:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Wikis for internal use... Message-ID: One of our people has thrown out the idea of using a "wiki" service for operations and procedures matters--an electronic ops manual if you will. The suggestion is that the folks would be more disposed to going on-line and updating pages having to do with client job problems, imaging or file-prep procedures and the like than they would to communicate via email or other means. My initial reaction to this is I'm not real excited about it from a security standpoint. Also, what happens should the service you're using go away all of the sudden. On the other hand, I would see people contributing in this way much more readily and timely than firing off an email to a "gatekeeper" internally to update a printed resource. Does anyone have any experience with this type of thing? The one that's been suggested by my staff is http://www.wetpaint.com/. Is there software out there whereby we could host a similar service on our own server? Eric Pearson President/C.E.O. ------------ TechnaPrint, Inc. 909 Garfield Street Eugene, OR 97402-2706 (541) 344-4062 (541) 344-1765 Fax ep101@technaprint.com www.technaprint.com From jim at visaliaidea.com Tue Feb 12 18:36:18 2008 From: jim at visaliaidea.com (James Laber) Date: Tue Feb 12 18:36:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study In-Reply-To: <20080212223043.B6D00E0C927@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <018d01c86dd0$10e1d580$5501a7c0@visaliaidea.local> Received mine last Friday. Jim Laber Idea! Printing & Graphics Inc 1921 E Main St Visalia CA 93292 559-733-4149 X118 Fax: 559-636-3690 jim@visaliaidea.com http://www.visaliaidea.com/ From sales at datelinedigitalprinting.com Tue Feb 12 19:26:19 2008 From: sales at datelinedigitalprinting.com (Date-Line Digital Printing) Date: Tue Feb 12 19:27:55 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study In-Reply-To: <47B21E80.3070407@usacolor.com> References: <47B21E80.3070407@usacolor.com> Message-ID: <000001c86dd7$0f372e90$2da58bb0$@com> Got ours on Friday Travis Lewis Date-Line Digital Printing -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of scott Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 1:33 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Comments about newly released 4C Pricing Study ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Got mine Tuesday! Scott Balsiger, President USA Color Printing Inc. www.usacolor.com 791 Manhomen Dr. Bemidji, MN 56601 800-759-9126 218-759-9126 218-759-2883(fax) 218-556-5505(cell) QKCONSULT@aol.com wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >In a message dated 2/12/2008 4:48:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >DanF@MMSNY.com writes: > >John, >No sign of the study yet up here. FYI > >Dan Flatt >owner >Multi Media Services > > > >Dan, > >Just checked the list quickly and did not see your name. Did you submit by >mail or complete it on-line? > >Did you retain a copy before submitting it AND did you complete the majority >of questions? If the answer is Yes no big deal.... fax me a copy of your >survey and we will get a copy out to you ASAP. > > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy >Awards. Go to AOL Music. >(http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From acepm2 at gmail.com Wed Feb 13 07:09:18 2008 From: acepm2 at gmail.com (Thom Gulyas) Date: Wed Feb 13 07:09:25 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Ami Pro to Word 2007 Doc Message-ID: Well, now it it MY turn to have someone convert a file for me! Can someone out there help me convert a small Ami Pro doc to a Word 2007, 2003 or some darned thing I can open please? I know somebody out there still has Ami Pro running on a dusty computer.... I'll forward the file if you contact me directly. Thanks.... Thom -- Thom Gulyas ACE Printing & Mailing Berlin, Maryland 21811 www.acepm.com From copythatnyc at aol.com Wed Feb 13 09:44:29 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Wed Feb 13 09:44:41 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs Message-ID: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> I've been a PC user since 86'.? Have dabbled with the Mac.? What's the preferred format with my peers.? I have a customer explaining how stupid it is to be using PC's.? That we are at the mercy of pure luck, when it comes to virus's.? He said that the new Mac's will work faster & better than any PC & will not have Microsoft OS hurting me.? I've been wanting to change over, but not for that reason, more for the graphic's.? Any opinions will help. Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 13 09:48:53 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 13 09:49:42 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> You don't change over Tommy, you learn to use both. That way you support whatever your clients are using, no matter who they are. S. At 06:44 AM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I've been a PC user since 86'.? Have dabbled with the Mac.? What's >the preferred format with my peers.? I have a customer explaining >how stupid it is to be using PC's.? That we are at the mercy of pure >luck, when it comes to virus's.? He said that the new Mac's will >work faster & better than any PC & will not have Microsoft OS >hurting me.? I've been wanting to change over, but not for that >reason, more for the graphic's.? Any opinions will help. > > > >Copy That, Inc. >"Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" >3515 E. Tremont Avenue >Bronx, N.Y. 10465 >718.892.1859 >718.892.2315 Fax >www.copythatnyc.com > >________________________________________________________________________ >More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - >http://webmail.aol.com >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2871 (20080213) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From k_graham at hotmail.com Wed Feb 13 10:13:36 2008 From: k_graham at hotmail.com (k_graham@hotmail.com) Date: Wed Feb 13 10:13:58 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: > You don't change over Tommy, you learn to use both. > > That way you support whatever your clients are using, no matter who they > are. I tried buying a Mac a few years ago, all that ever came of it was the college provided a few jobs, everyone else used PC's. Now the college submits with PDF and it doesn't matter. Corel Draw forever, PCs . Give the Mac 5 more years and they may be PC's On the other hand if you are surrounded by designers, you may have a different consideration. Ken Graham CommunityPrinters 250-782-7108 From info at desktopsxm.com Wed Feb 13 10:23:30 2008 From: info at desktopsxm.com (Joel Brint) Date: Wed Feb 13 10:22:24 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <65639648-F142-43AE-86D8-39806DA6256F@desktopsxm.com> PC users will say PC Mac users will say mac One advantage that the mac has over both is that you can have both PC OS and Mac OS on it. To some this is advantageous, to others they don't care. TO ME, MAC FOREVER Joel Brint Desktop Imaging St. Maarten Tel 542-4044 fax 543-1100 "The Printshop with a Difference" On Feb 13, 2008, at 11:13 AM, wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >> You don't change over Tommy, you learn to use both. >> >> That way you support whatever your clients are using, no matter >> who they are. > > I tried buying a Mac a few years ago, all that ever came of it was > the college provided a few jobs, everyone else used PC's. Now the > college submits with PDF and it doesn't matter. > > Corel Draw forever, PCs . Give the Mac 5 more years and they may be > PC's > > On the other hand if you are surrounded by designers, you may have > a different consideration. > > Ken Graham > CommunityPrinters > 250-782-7108 > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 13 10:24:17 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 13 10:25:02 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou In-Reply-To: <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <200802131524.m1DFOurg061857@i2bnetworks.com> I'd like to express my appreciation to everyone who replied to my request for information last week regarding CD/DVD duplication. I'd especially like to single out Bob Molacek who graciously spent some time with me on the phone to answer some specific questions and was kind of enough to send me some of his printed disk samples. Thanks to that guidance I avoided making a mistake in the selection of equipment for this new aspect of the business. We ended up with a high performance burning tower which went operational yesterday http://tinyurl.com/yvowy2 a 10 tower burner. There is a huge difference between the commercial level of this type of product, and the type of product that comes in catalogs like the the "Diskmaker" catalog. Thank you to Bob for opening my eyes to the this. We're currently running CD labels though the bizhubs and applying them by hand for current projects, but as we ramp up this side of the business we've narrowed down to a few choices for a either a high volume inkjet or dye sublimation printer for actually imaging on disks. We'll probably make that decision in the near future. My how the printing business has changed..... S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From dennisewing at satx.rr.com Wed Feb 13 10:40:50 2008 From: dennisewing at satx.rr.com (Dennis Ewing) Date: Wed Feb 13 10:41:12 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <47B30F82.4090400@satx.rr.com> You should have both, but believe me the mac is no better than the PC. They are tools. Treat them as such. If I could I would be all PC, but I have a Mac for the few who have them. Macs can get viruses too, it's just that the creeps that write them tend to write for the PC since there are so many of them. They are starting to write more for the Mac and Linux as the platforms take hold. Just do what works for your shop. I get several files a month on Macs, but I get more for PC. I'll take a PC over a Mac any day. Dennis W. Ewing Sr Ewing and Sons Printing 12000 Crownpoint, #130 San Antonio, TX 78233 dennisewing@satx.rr.com ewingandsons@satx.rr.com 210/650-5311 210/650-9916 Fax Tommy Melendez wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I've been a PC user since 86'.? Have dabbled with the Mac.? What's the preferred format with my peers.? I have a customer explaining how stupid it is to be using PC's.? That we are at the mercy of pure luck, when it comes to virus's.? He said that the new Mac's will work faster & better than any PC & will not have Microsoft OS hurting me.? I've been wanting to change over, but not for that reason, more for the graphic's.? Any opinions will help. > > > > From slb at inkspot.net Wed Feb 13 10:48:14 2008 From: slb at inkspot.net (Steve Blatman) Date: Wed Feb 13 10:48:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <47B2CAEE.3059.B69B6A1@slb.inkspot.net> Tommy, The programs we use (mostly Adobe CSx) run almost identically on Macs and PCs. The main differences I see are 1. that I can work the menus from the keyboard on a PC, and I have to memorize all of the damned shortcuts on the Mac, and 2. that Suitcase will open fonts automatically on the Mac, while I have to do it manually in Type Manager on the PC. The trouble, though, with going cross-platform with customers' files (opening a customer's Mac Illustrator file on a PC, for example) is that the fonts don't always translate well. If a font's spacing tables are different, and the last half of a phone number wraps to a line that falls out of the bottom of a text box, you're eating a reprint. You need both, so you can always open (and modify, if needed) your customers' files on whatever platform they used to create them. For your internal typesetting and design, you can work with whichever one you prefer. That's a longer-winded explanation of "you need both." YMMV, Steve > > I've been a PC user since 86'.? Have dabbled with the Mac.? What's the > preferred format with my peers.? I have a customer explaining how > stupid it is to be using PC's.? That we are at the mercy of pure luck, > when it comes to virus's.? He said that the new Mac's will work faster > & better than any PC & will not have Microsoft OS hurting me.? I've > been wanting to change over, but not for that reason, more for the > graphic's.? Any opinions will help. > > > > Copy That, Inc. > "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" > 3515 E. Tremont Avenue > Bronx, N.Y. 10465 > 718.892.1859 > 718.892.2315 Fax > www.copythatnyc.com > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > __________ NOD32 2871 (20080213) Information __________ > > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. > http://www.eset.com > > Steve Blatman Ink Spot Printing & Copy Center, Inc. 14 Church Road, Frazer, PA 19355 USA Tel: 610-647-0776 Fax: 610-647-4560 From cpyxpres at bellsouth.net Wed Feb 13 11:25:02 2008 From: cpyxpres at bellsouth.net (Ben Travis) Date: Wed Feb 13 11:25:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: Test In-Reply-To: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <44D595CD-D27C-4AAE-BE2A-BABAE4D0D2A6@bellsouth.net> Test... Ben Travis Copy Express 4004-A South Blvd. Charlotte, NC 20209 cpyxpres@bellsouth.net 704-527-1750 From sos at olympus.net Wed Feb 13 11:38:29 2008 From: sos at olympus.net (Dan Huntingford) Date: Wed Feb 13 11:39:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com><200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <002c01c86e5e$dcff28f0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> > I tried buying a Mac a few years ago, all that ever came of it was the > college provided a few jobs, everyone else used PC's. Now the college > submits with PDF and it doesn't matter. > ======================== That's pretty much my situation as well. We have one Mac and six Windows PCs. Very few customers use Macs. Your situation may vary. As Scott says, the goal is to handle customer files as easily and reliably as possible. Use whatever you need to accomplish that. A high end Windows work station is every bit as good and reliable a computer as a high end Mac workstation.. . In my experience. El cheapo Windows PCs can be nothing but trouble, which has unfairly given Windows PCs a bad rep. Dan Huntingford SOS Printing 2319 Washington Street Port Townsend, WA 98368 Member NAQP/NAPL/PIA/GATF sos@olympus.net (360) 385-4194 Fax (360) 385-5860 From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Wed Feb 13 11:59:23 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Wed Feb 13 11:59:43 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <002c01c86e5e$dcff28f0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com><200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> <002c01c86e5e$dcff28f0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> Message-ID: <47B321EB.8000708@sugarloafprint.com> Did you ever notice that Mac people try and push Macs by saying they'll run PCs. -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From Susan at cdandp.net Wed Feb 13 12:02:55 2008 From: Susan at cdandp.net (Susan Compton) Date: Wed Feb 13 12:03:41 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? Message-ID: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> Dear Printowner Friends, I really hate to ask a pricing question, but I am in a bit of a quandry here. I do consumables printing for one of the local universities. The print shop and the university set up a contract each year setting the prices for the next year (one of those things I inherited). Of course, the previous owner was giving away these letterhead, envelopes and business cards so that he could get some of the other printing. Of course, the university has done the research and sends all the other printing (the most lucrative) to printers outside the area with 40-inch 4-color presses. We'd be perfectly happy with this if we could just get a decent price for the consumables. What I did for this year was to take everything up a percentage, but we're still barely breaking even. I need to know what your prices would be for the following in quantities of 500, 1000 and 2500: Neenah bond letterhead and No. 10 envelopes in 2 PMS colors as well as 100 lb. white opaque business cards, also in 2 PMS colors. Rather than clutter up the list, if those who would be willilng to share could email me offlist. Thank you for your help! Susan Wells Compton Compton Design & Printing Inc. 109 South Jefferson Street Lexington, VA 24450 540-463-9232 540-464-4329 Fax Susan@cdandp.net www.cdandp.net From printer at ptialaska.net Wed Feb 13 12:06:44 2008 From: printer at ptialaska.net (Charles A. Lincoln) Date: Wed Feb 13 12:06:55 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <47B321EB.8000708@sugarloafprint.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com><200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> <002c01c86e5e$dcff28f0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47B321EB.8000708@sugarloafprint.com> Message-ID: <7EB869D4-F447-4BA2-9D97-1B5666CCF2FE@ptialaska.net> On Feb 13, 2008, at 7:59 AM, Ron Sardo wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > Did you ever notice that Mac people try and push Macs by saying > they'll run PCs. REPLY: True statement, and faster than pc hardware as well. Read this article: http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,136649-page,3-c,notebooks/article.html _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Charles Lincoln ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY 612 30th Avenue Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 (907) 451-1111 fax (907) 451-4511 _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Wed Feb 13 12:12:13 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Wed Feb 13 12:12:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? In-Reply-To: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802130912w3360b7b5o79035a22e967aa27@mail.gmail.com> Susn -- Sorry for one of those non-answers, but -- what's the point? Why not tell them what you told us? If none of their other printing is likely to come your way, then why bother with this other stuff unless you are making an amount that's worth your while? Regardless of one's feelings about using loss-leaders in the first place, there's certainly no incentive here not to price for a fair margin. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon On Feb 13, 2008 12:02 PM, Susan Compton wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Dear Printowner Friends, > > I really hate to ask a pricing question, but I am in a bit of a quandry > here. I do consumables printing for one of the local universities. The > print shop and the university set up a contract each year setting the > prices > for the next year (one of those things I inherited). Of course, the > previous owner was giving away these letterhead, envelopes and business > cards so that he could get some of the other printing. Of course, the > university has done the research and sends all the other printing (the > most > lucrative) to printers outside the area with 40-inch 4-color presses. We'd > be perfectly happy with this if we could just get a decent price for the > consumables. What I did for this year was to take everything up a > percentage, but we're still barely breaking even. I need to know what > your > prices would be for the following in quantities of 500, 1000 and 2500: > Neenah bond letterhead and No. 10 envelopes in 2 PMS colors as well as 100 > lb. white opaque business cards, also in 2 PMS colors. > > Rather than clutter up the list, if those who would be willilng to share > could email me offlist. > > Thank you for your help! > > Susan Wells Compton > Compton Design & Printing Inc. > 109 South Jefferson Street > Lexington, VA 24450 > 540-463-9232 > 540-464-4329 Fax > Susan@cdandp.net > www.cdandp.net > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From russ at mobile-print.com Wed Feb 13 12:34:04 2008 From: russ at mobile-print.com (Russ Peters) Date: Wed Feb 13 12:34:49 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <47B32A0C.4040703@mobile-print.com> We have both Macs & PCs in Graphics. We just put in a new Mac Pro & updated all our software. We tend to receive Mac files from designers, other printers & large corporations with a graphics department. We tend to receive PC files from non-profits, small businesses & individuals. We charge more to process these files as 98% of the time they will need additional work to make them printable. The Mac gets used WAY more than the PC - it's far easier to operate & maintain, and connects very easily to the various RIPs. The PC is ok once set up, but took much longer to get up to speed. The office computers are all PCs - mainly because I can build them very inexpensively. Russ Peters MOBILE PRINT, INC. 201 W. Central Road Mount Prospect, IL 60056 Phone: 847.398.6155 Fax: 847.398.0788 E: Russ@Mobile-Print.com W. www.Mobile-Print.com Tommy Melendez wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I've been a PC user since 86'.? Have dabbled with the Mac.? What's the preferred format with my peers.? I have a customer explaining how stupid it is to be using PC's.? That we are at the mercy of pure luck, when it comes to virus's.? He said that the new Mac's will work faster & better than any PC & will not have Microsoft OS hurting me.? I've been wanting to change over, but not for that reason, more for the graphic's.? Any opinions will help. > > > From armand at curryonline.com Wed Feb 13 12:53:35 2008 From: armand at curryonline.com (Armand Girard) Date: Wed Feb 13 12:53:50 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <06d101c86e69$5abc4b10$1034e130$@com> Scott is right, you have to be able to support both. Even with PDFs, you still need the ability to read both MAC and PC files for maximum compatibility. Computers are inexpensive enough, why not have both? Armand Girard Curry Printing & Mailing 31 Mill St Auburn, ME 04210 email: armand@curryonline.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 9:49 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** You don't change over Tommy, you learn to use both. That way you support whatever your clients are using, no matter who they are. S. At 06:44 AM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I've been a PC user since 86'.? Have dabbled with the Mac.? What's >the preferred format with my peers.? I have a customer explaining >how stupid it is to be using PC's.? That we are at the mercy of pure >luck, when it comes to virus's.? He said that the new Mac's will >work faster & better than any PC & will not have Microsoft OS >hurting me.? I've been wanting to change over, but not for that >reason, more for the graphic's.? Any opinions will help. > > > >Copy That, Inc. >"Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" >3515 E. Tremont Avenue >Bronx, N.Y. 10465 >718.892.1859 >718.892.2315 Fax >www.copythatnyc.com > >________________________________________________________________________ >More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - >http://webmail.aol.com >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2871 (20080213) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From Minmandon at aol.com Wed Feb 13 12:57:37 2008 From: Minmandon at aol.com (Minmandon@aol.com) Date: Wed Feb 13 12:57:58 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? Message-ID: In a message dated 2/13/2008 12:15:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com writes: Why not tell them what you told us? If none of their other printing is likely to come your way, then why bother with this other stuff unless you are making an amount that's worth your while? I agree with Michael. I don't agree that any job should be done at a loss. I do reduce my profit margin in an effort to get additional work. I don't do any work at a loss!!! Killer service is a key. My experience has been that the bigger the company the less they are impressed with great service. Don Carney Minuteman Press Deerfield 954 421-9904 **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 13 13:08:13 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 13 13:09:02 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? In-Reply-To: <98f5b19a0802130912w3360b7b5o79035a22e967aa27@mail.gmail.co m> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <98f5b19a0802130912w3360b7b5o79035a22e967aa27@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200802131808.m1DI8q5E092629@i2bnetworks.com> Loss leaders are a waste of time and resources (and a philosophy I personally do not believe in) unless there is something to gain. In this case, there is nothing to gain. Susan, you are too nice of a person to run around giving things away and barely breaking even on this stuff. These "customers" are taking advantage of you. You should find a way to get connected with clients who will value you for what you can offer them, and not use for what they can get out of you. You're worth more than this nonsense. S. At 09:12 AM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Susn -- > >Sorry for one of those non-answers, but -- what's the point? > >Why not tell them what you told us? If none of their other printing is >likely to come your way, then why bother with this other stuff unless you >are making an amount that's worth your while? Regardless of one's feelings >about using loss-leaders in the first place, there's certainly no incentive >here not to price for a fair margin. > >-- >Michael Vogel >Sir Speedy Printing >9 Research Drive >Milford, CT 06460 >tel 203-877-1231 >fax 203-878-2679 >mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com >www.eSirSpeedy.com >==================================== >Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to >criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. > ~Lord Bacon > > > >On Feb 13, 2008 12:02 PM, Susan Compton wrote: > > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > > Dear Printowner Friends, > > > > I really hate to ask a pricing question, but I am in a bit of a quandry > > here. I do consumables printing for one of the local universities. The > > print shop and the university set up a contract each year setting the > > prices > > for the next year (one of those things I inherited). Of course, the > > previous owner was giving away these letterhead, envelopes and business > > cards so that he could get some of the other printing. Of course, the > > university has done the research and sends all the other printing (the > > most > > lucrative) to printers outside the area with 40-inch 4-color presses. We'd > > be perfectly happy with this if we could just get a decent price for the > > consumables. What I did for this year was to take everything up a > > percentage, but we're still barely breaking even. I need to know what > > your > > prices would be for the following in quantities of 500, 1000 and 2500: > > Neenah bond letterhead and No. 10 envelopes in 2 PMS colors as well as 100 > > lb. white opaque business cards, also in 2 PMS colors. > > > > Rather than clutter up the list, if those who would be willilng to share > > could email me offlist. > > > > Thank you for your help! > > > > Susan Wells Compton > > Compton Design & Printing Inc. > > 109 South Jefferson Street > > Lexington, VA 24450 > > 540-463-9232 > > 540-464-4329 Fax > > Susan@cdandp.net > > www.cdandp.net > > > > _______________________________________________ > > PrintOwners Discussion List > > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2872 (20080213) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 13 13:11:43 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 13 13:12:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200802131812.m1DICMfA093400@i2bnetworks.com> I disagree Don, you don't connect with "companies" you connect with people. And if you connect with people and overwhelm them with superior service, well, large companies buy a lot more printing than small companies. And large companies have more people to impress within the organization than small companies. Its all about the quality of your connection. Something to think about. S. >My experience has been that the bigger the company >the less they are impressed with great service. >Don Carney _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From copythatnyc at aol.com Wed Feb 13 13:17:05 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Wed Feb 13 13:17:33 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <7EB869D4-F447-4BA2-9D97-1B5666CCF2FE@ptialaska.net> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com><200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> <002c01c86e5e$dcff28f0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47B321EB.8000708@sugarloafprint.com> <7EB869D4-F447-4BA2-9D97-1B5666CCF2FE@ptialaska.net> Message-ID: <8CA3C83C5D4679C-9C4-2BA@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> Charles that is some advertisement from PC World! Thanks Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Charles A. Lincoln To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 12:06 pm Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? ? On Feb 13, 2008, at 7:59 AM, Ron Sardo wrote:? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? > Did you ever notice that Mac people try and push Macs by saying > they'll run PCs.? ? REPLY:? True statement, and faster than pc hardware as well. Read this article: http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,136649-page,3-c,notebooks/article.html? ? _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/? ? Charles Lincoln? ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY? 612 30th Avenue? Fairbanks, Alaska 99701? (907) 451-1111? fax (907) 451-4511? ? _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/? ? _______________________________________________? PrintOwners Discussion List? Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org? Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners? ? ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From brianoday at eprint.us Wed Feb 13 13:52:22 2008 From: brianoday at eprint.us (Brian O'Day) Date: Wed Feb 13 13:54:28 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou In-Reply-To: <200802131524.m1DFOurg061857@i2bnetworks.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com><200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> <200802131524.m1DFOurg061857@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: <003501c86e71$9164a0b0$800101df@eprint.local> Scott What was your investment in this. Brian O'Day ePrint 9970 SW Greenburg Rd Portland, Oregon brianoday@eprint.us 503-684-2679 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 7:24 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I'd like to express my appreciation to everyone who replied to my request for information last week regarding CD/DVD duplication. I'd especially like to single out Bob Molacek who graciously spent some time with me on the phone to answer some specific questions and was kind of enough to send me some of his printed disk samples. Thanks to that guidance I avoided making a mistake in the selection of equipment for this new aspect of the business. We ended up with a high performance burning tower which went operational yesterday http://tinyurl.com/yvowy2 a 10 tower burner. There is a huge difference between the commercial level of this type of product, and the type of product that comes in catalogs like the the "Diskmaker" catalog. Thank you to Bob for opening my eyes to the this. We're currently running CD labels though the bizhubs and applying them by hand for current projects, but as we ramp up this side of the business we've narrowed down to a few choices for a either a high volume inkjet or dye sublimation printer for actually imaging on disks. We'll probably make that decision in the near future. My how the printing business has changed..... S. _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From bherion at bucksdigital.com Wed Feb 13 13:57:53 2008 From: bherion at bucksdigital.com (Bob Herion) Date: Wed Feb 13 13:58:15 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Re: Not Another Printing Question!!? In-Reply-To: <20080213180907.93841E0F4A3@rb.enter.net> References: <20080213180907.93841E0F4A3@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20080213135103.032348b8@bucksdigital.com> At 01:09 PM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >but we're still barely breaking even. Unless this account, on the whole, makes you a profit you can live with give it up. You need to charge what makes you a profit. It makes no difference what anyone else would charge. Bob Herion - Ask me about variable data printing on our iGen3's Bucks Digital Printing v.215.579.4200 f.215-579-9510 90 Walker Lane Newtown, PA 18940 www.bucksdigital.com From QKCONSULT at aol.com Wed Feb 13 14:14:16 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Wed Feb 13 14:14:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? Message-ID: In a message dated 2/13/2008 1:16:14 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: Its all about the quality of your connection. Something to think about. Scott, Without getting into details of specific situations, you need to remember that there are many markets where there is a paucity of large customers. I know that is hard to believe when looking at the San Diego market but there are indeed many small towns and communities with few if any large customers to impress and work on the "quality of your connections." I am not trying to rationalize or make excuses for others, but I do believe that while there are far more similarities than differences when it comes to pricing and profits from one market to the next, that is not to say that there are not vast differences from one market to the next when it comes to the size and type of available customers. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From ed at graphicprintersinc.com Wed Feb 13 14:35:04 2008 From: ed at graphicprintersinc.com (Ed Pierce) Date: Wed Feb 13 14:35:25 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002301c86e77$88b05440$5a01a8c0@fileserver> Now I am really shocked! John, are you saying all markets aren't the same? I can't believe what I just read! I'm just kidding of course but there are distinct differences in the quality of print buyers in different markets. In Meridian there are 4 companies (I think) that have either district headquarters or corporate headquarters located here and operate outside of the local community. This means the buyers aren't usually as sophisticated or savvy about new trends or technology and in fact may very well be suspicious of both. It's a lot of fun for sure and requires even more hands on relationship building in order to earn their trust and confidence. In a market like mine you are either the cheapest or present yourself as the guru with cutting edge technology while continually building up trust. I realize this is what Scott is preaching and he is correct but I promise you it is much harder in a market like mine compared to a San Diego or Orlando market. The principal is the same though. Ed Pierce Graphic Print & Communication Meridian MS 601-485-7088 ed@graphicprintersinc.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of QKCONSULT@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 1:14 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** In a message dated 2/13/2008 1:16:14 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: Its all about the quality of your connection. Something to think about. Scott, Without getting into details of specific situations, you need to remember that there are many markets where there is a paucity of large customers. I know that is hard to believe when looking at the San Diego market but there are indeed many small towns and communities with few if any large customers to impress and work on the "quality of your connections." I am not trying to rationalize or make excuses for others, but I do believe that while there are far more similarities than differences when it comes to pricing and profits from one market to the next, that is not to say that there are not vast differences from one market to the next when it comes to the size and type of available customers. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners __________ NOD32 2872 (20080213) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com From oren66 at sbcglobal.net Wed Feb 13 15:22:23 2008 From: oren66 at sbcglobal.net (Arie Teomi) Date: Wed Feb 13 15:23:09 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Mailing list work Message-ID: <679603.23180.qm@web83414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> A customer wants us to update a list and eliminate all the ceceased people and bad addresses. AccuZip suggested DMA Supression but could not give me any more information. Anybody familiar with this process or any other that can get the list up to date? Thanks Arie Arie Teomi LASTING IMPRESSION DIRECT 23500 Mercantile Rd., Suite F Cleveland, OH 44122 P:216-464-1960 F:216-464-1660 www.LastingImpressionDirect.com Your Full Service PRINTING, COPYING and MAILING partner From oren66 at sbcglobal.net Wed Feb 13 15:27:56 2008 From: oren66 at sbcglobal.net (Arie Teomi) Date: Wed Feb 13 15:28:14 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Mailing list work In-Reply-To: <679603.23180.qm@web83414.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <281043.46577.qm@web83409.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Should be deceased --- Arie Teomi wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > A customer wants us to update a list and eliminate > all > the ceceased people and bad addresses. > AccuZip suggested DMA Supression but could not give > me > any more information. > Anybody familiar with this process or any other that > can get the list up to date? > > Thanks > Arie > > > > Arie Teomi > LASTING IMPRESSION DIRECT > 23500 Mercantile Rd., Suite F > Cleveland, OH 44122 > P:216-464-1960 > F:216-464-1660 > > www.LastingImpressionDirect.com > > Your Full Service > PRINTING, COPYING and MAILING partner > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: > http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > Arie Teomi LASTING IMPRESSION DIRECT 23500 Mercantile Rd., Suite F Cleveland, OH 44122 P:216-464-1960 F:216-464-1660 www.LastingImpressionDirect.com Your Full Service PRINTING, COPYING and MAILING partner From info at aeroprinting.com Wed Feb 13 15:40:34 2008 From: info at aeroprinting.com (Carl Core) Date: Wed Feb 13 15:41:02 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Acrobat to Word Message-ID: <008601c86e80$af6992a0$6501a8c0@aero> Just had a request to convert a large pdf file to a Word document. Can this be done? Carl Core, Jr. Aero Printing, Inc. 710 Elida Ave Delphos, OH 45833 Ph. 419-695-2931 Fax 419-695-9930 info@aeroprinting.com www.aeroprinting.com From russ at mobile-print.com Wed Feb 13 15:43:19 2008 From: russ at mobile-print.com (Russ Peters) Date: Wed Feb 13 15:44:07 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <7EB869D4-F447-4BA2-9D97-1B5666CCF2FE@ptialaska.net> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com><200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> <002c01c86e5e$dcff28f0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47B321EB.8000708@sugarloafprint.com> <7EB869D4-F447-4BA2-9D97-1B5666CCF2FE@ptialaska.net> Message-ID: <47B35667.60603@mobile-print.com> One thing for sure - Macs are better built than most PCs. Most PCs I have used & seen are made with rather flimsy sheet metal, rickety covers, cheap plastic faceplates and a host of 'off the shelf' components. My new Mac Pro is a marvel of engineering, with a heavy duty aluminum casing, snap-in hard drive holders, pop out memory board, etc., etc. It's just built to a higher standard than most PCs. And when you plug it in, it just works fine, right out of the box. Russ Peters MOBILE PRINT, INC. 201 W. Central Road Mount Prospect, IL 60056 Phone: 847.398.6155 Fax: 847.398.0788 E: Russ@Mobile-Print.com W. www.Mobile-Print.com From carole at wordcatering.com Wed Feb 13 16:03:04 2008 From: carole at wordcatering.com (Carole M. Rike) Date: Wed Feb 13 16:33:54 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Acrobat to Word In-Reply-To: <008601c86e80$af6992a0$6501a8c0@aero> References: <008601c86e80$af6992a0$6501a8c0@aero> Message-ID: <000601c86e83$d3456250$6501a8c0@carol3ceeaab4a> PDF scan (with Omni Page) will do this. Carole M. Rike Word Catering, Ltd. PRINTING SOLUTIONS 48299 Stafford Road . Tickfaw, LA 70466 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Carl Core Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 2:41 PM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Acrobat to Word ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Just had a request to convert a large pdf file to a Word document. Can this be done? Carl Core, Jr. Aero Printing, Inc. 710 Elida Ave Delphos, OH 45833 Ph. 419-695-2931 Fax 419-695-9930 info@aeroprinting.com www.aeroprinting.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners __________ NOD32 2872 (20080213) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com From si at ria.net Wed Feb 13 16:47:19 2008 From: si at ria.net (Doug Shelton) Date: Wed Feb 13 16:48:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Acrobat to Word In-Reply-To: <008601c86e80$af6992a0$6501a8c0@aero> References: <008601c86e80$af6992a0$6501a8c0@aero> Message-ID: <20080213134806.E5942717@dm37.mta.everyone.net> In Acrobat you should be able to save as a Word document... File --> Save As --> Save As Type = Microsoft Word Document (*.doc) Generally works OK for standard text documents, but doesn't always work well if there is complex formatting in the document. Doug At 03:40 PM 2/13/2008, Carl Gore wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Just had a request to convert a large pdf file to a Word document. >Can this be done? Doug Shelton Superior Impressions, Inc. Toledo, Ohio mailto:si@ria.net From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 13 16:49:19 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 13 16:50:47 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200802132149.m1DLnwig038928@i2bnetworks.com> Yes I know, and I totally agree with you. Markets are indeed different, and opportunities within markets can vary. But I do subscribe to the notion that whatever market you happen to be located in...people tend to buy from people they like. And no matter what size company you are dealing with, people in small companies and large ones as well will usually act the same.... They will give the business to people they like. and If you give them extraordinary service, they will like you. You like me! You like me! Sally Field S. At 11:14 AM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > >In a message dated 2/13/2008 1:16:14 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >smc@sorrentomesa.com writes: > >Its all about the quality of your connection. > >Something to think about. > > > >Scott, > >Without getting into details of specific situations, you need to remember >that there are many markets where there is a paucity of large >customers. I know >that is hard to believe when looking at the San Diego market but there are >indeed many small towns and communities with few if any large customers to >impress and work on the "quality of your connections." > >I am not trying to rationalize or make excuses for others, but I do believe >that while there are far more similarities than differences when it comes to >pricing and profits from one market to the next, that is not to say that >there are not vast differences from one market to the next when >it comes to the >size and type of available customers. > >John Stewart >Q. P. Consulting, Inc. >Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > >by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > >2110 S. Dairy Road >West Melbourne, FL 32904 >321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 >Cell: 321-794-6259 >_www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) >"Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > >**************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy >Awards. Go to AOL Music. >(http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2872 (20080213) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Wed Feb 13 16:27:19 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Wed Feb 13 17:03:54 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <47B35667.60603@mobile-print.com> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com><200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> <002c01c86e5e$dcff28f0$6900a8c0@DANIEL> <47B321EB.8000708@sugarloafprint.com> <7EB869D4-F447-4BA2-9D97-1B5666CCF2FE@ptialaska.net> <47B35667.60603@mobile-print.com> Message-ID: <47B360B7.3080909@sugarloafprint.com> The only real difference is the operating system. PCs and Macs can use the same hardware nowadays. You just can't compare a $200 PC to a Mac... But you can compare a $2000 PC to a Mac. You get what you pay for > > One thing for sure - Macs are better built than most PCs. > > Most PCs I have used & seen are made with rather flimsy sheet metal, > rickety covers, cheap plastic faceplates and a host of 'off the shelf' > components. > > My new Mac Pro is a marvel of engineering, with a heavy duty aluminum > casing, snap-in hard drive holders, pop out memory board, etc., etc. > It's just built to a higher standard than most PCs. And when you plug > it in, it just works fine, right out of the box. -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From robin at protypeonline.com Wed Feb 13 17:19:44 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Wed Feb 13 17:19:58 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? Message-ID: <7A804691-DDFA-4448-97D6-75C17B2CCDC2@protypeonline.com> Susan, Michael, Scott and the others are 10,000% correct! Cut them loose but first share with them exactly what you shared with us. And, don't burn any bridges because you can sell them your service and the fact that you have the files and can fill the orders much more easily and with much less chance of error than if they change, but if they do -- you completely understand -- you sell service not price and you can tell them you are sure they would rather have it done right and on time than save a penny! :)))) sometimes we ALL have to cut one of these customers loose. You already said that there is not future growth for you with this customer, so why put up with them if you aren't making a decent profit? Answer: you don't -- don't get into that rut ! Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 13 17:25:56 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 13 17:26:46 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou In-Reply-To: <003501c86e71$9164a0b0$800101df@eprint.local> References: <8CA3C6612DB56FE-C50-3D83@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> <200802131449.m1DEnWGj055588@i2bnetworks.com> <200802131524.m1DFOurg061857@i2bnetworks.com> <003501c86e71$9164a0b0$800101df@eprint.local> Message-ID: <200802132226.m1DMQZNi046822@i2bnetworks.com> $1235 plus tax and shipping. This one has an internal hard drive so you can burn image to disk and is daisy chainable to scale up to 10 units (100 burners) Average burn time for CD is 3 min/tray DVD 7 min/tray but it does depend on the amount of content (I think) Rock solid (thank you Bob). We're also looking at several high capacity standalone disk printers, I have ink jet samples and dye sub samples...not sure which way we'll go yet. Dyes subs are very pretty (imagine color printing with a UV coat) Still investigating.... S. At 10:52 AM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Scott >What was your investment in this. > >Brian O'Day >ePrint >9970 SW Greenburg Rd >Portland, Oregon >brianoday@eprint.us >503-684-2679 > >-----Original Message----- >From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >[mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel >Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 7:24 AM >To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >Subject: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >I'd like to express my appreciation to everyone who replied to my >request for information last week regarding CD/DVD duplication. I'd >especially like to single out Bob Molacek who graciously spent some >time with me on the phone to answer some specific questions and was >kind of enough to send me some of his printed disk samples. > >Thanks to that guidance I avoided making a mistake in the selection >of equipment for this new aspect of the business. > >We ended up with a high performance burning tower which went >operational yesterday http://tinyurl.com/yvowy2 a 10 tower burner. >There is a huge difference between the commercial level of this type >of product, and the type of product that comes in catalogs like the >the "Diskmaker" catalog. Thank you to Bob for opening my eyes to the this. > >We're currently running CD labels though the bizhubs and applying >them by hand for current projects, but as we ramp up this side of the >business we've narrowed down to a few choices for a either a high >volume inkjet or dye sublimation printer for actually imaging on >disks. We'll probably make that decision in the near future. > >My how the printing business has changed..... > >S. > > > > >_____________________________________________ > >Scott Cappel > >Sorrento Mesa Printing >7398 Trade Street >San Diego, CA 92121-2422 >858-527-0800 >858-527-1740 FAX >http://www.sorrentomesa.com > >LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > >Direct Links for Learning: >http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html >http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html >http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > >Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider >Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider >Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level >Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > >Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2872 (20080213) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From bob at rjmprinting.com Wed Feb 13 17:41:48 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Wed Feb 13 17:42:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou In-Reply-To: <200802132226.m1DMQZNi046822@i2bnetworks.com> Message-ID: No problem. I would be interested in hearing what printer you decide on when you get to that point. As you see from our samples the inkjet looks good but I'm sure there are better methods. Also, the way you are starting out is a very good approach. Low capital outlay and running the labels on the color copier. Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 4:26 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** $1235 plus tax and shipping. This one has an internal hard drive so you can burn image to disk and is daisy chainable to scale up to 10 units (100 burners) Average burn time for CD is 3 min/tray DVD 7 min/tray but it does depend on the amount of content (I think) Rock solid (thank you Bob). We're also looking at several high capacity standalone disk printers, I have ink jet samples and dye sub samples...not sure which way we'll go yet. Dyes subs are very pretty (imagine color printing with a UV coat) Still investigating.... S. At 10:52 AM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Scott >What was your investment in this. > >Brian O'Day >ePrint >9970 SW Greenburg Rd >Portland, Oregon >brianoday@eprint.us >503-684-2679 > >-----Original Message----- >From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >[mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Scott Cappel >Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 7:24 AM >To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only >Subject: [PrintOwners] A Hearty ThankYou > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >I'd like to express my appreciation to everyone who replied to my >request for information last week regarding CD/DVD duplication. I'd >especially like to single out Bob Molacek who graciously spent some >time with me on the phone to answer some specific questions and was >kind of enough to send me some of his printed disk samples. > >Thanks to that guidance I avoided making a mistake in the selection >of equipment for this new aspect of the business. > >We ended up with a high performance burning tower which went >operational yesterday http://tinyurl.com/yvowy2 a 10 tower burner. >There is a huge difference between the commercial level of this type >of product, and the type of product that comes in catalogs like the >the "Diskmaker" catalog. Thank you to Bob for opening my eyes to the this. > >We're currently running CD labels though the bizhubs and applying >them by hand for current projects, but as we ramp up this side of the >business we've narrowed down to a few choices for a either a high >volume inkjet or dye sublimation printer for actually imaging on >disks. We'll probably make that decision in the near future. > >My how the printing business has changed..... > >S. > > > > >_____________________________________________ > >Scott Cappel > >Sorrento Mesa Printing >7398 Trade Street >San Diego, CA 92121-2422 >858-527-0800 >858-527-1740 FAX >http://www.sorrentomesa.com > >LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa > >Direct Links for Learning: >http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html >http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html >http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html > >Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider >Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider >Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level >Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider > >Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2872 (20080213) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From Susan at cdandp.net Wed Feb 13 18:00:09 2008 From: Susan at cdandp.net (Susan Compton) Date: Wed Feb 13 18:00:52 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? References: <7A804691-DDFA-4448-97D6-75C17B2CCDC2@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <022b01c86e94$2ea57670$8302a8c0@Robbin> Dear Michael, Scott, Robin, John Stewart and everyone else: Thanks for all the help. I am going to do exactly as you said. I figure if they say OK I'll make more money and, if they don't, then either we can keep doing what we've been doing or reorganize here to absorb the loss (right now about 15% of our income). Just a little background to help you understand the dilemma I am under. This is a private university that has a Publications Department which controls all design, pricing, ordering, etc. They had their own print shop, which closed two or three years ago (they couldn't keep a press operator). Anyway, this university has a really big ego, and we are just 31,000 (size of our county) yokels who either have moved here to work for them or we don't have any idea what we are doing. I would love to be in an area where I could pick and choose my customers, but it ain't gonna happen here. I will go to them some time in the next week (gotta plan my speech) armed with the 2-color offset printing page from the most recent pricing survey (Thanks, John!) and have a little chat with them. The prices they are currently receiving are almost half of what the prices on the pricing survey are. Then it's up to them. I hope for the sake of my employees that they see the light. I'll keep you posted! Susan Wells Compton Compton Design & Printing Inc. 109 South Jefferson Street Lexington, VA 24450 540-463-9232 540-464-4329 Fax Susan@cdandp.net www.cdandp.net From copythatnyc at aol.com Wed Feb 13 19:16:09 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Wed Feb 13 19:16:27 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Digital paper Message-ID: <8CA3CB5EED09418-9C4-1909@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> WHat are you paying for 13 x 19 12pt Digital paper and whom do you purchase from??? I have x250 great quality but I tried to run regular coated & the paper is curling like crazy.? I guess it's the moisture being suck'd out.? It's real fun trying to cut them. Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From robin at protypeonline.com Wed Feb 13 19:18:15 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Wed Feb 13 19:18:28 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper Message-ID: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> We did the layout and design of a full page ad being run in our local newspaper -- customer was a local non-profit group and they did not trust the paper to do it the way they wanted, so they paid us to get it exactly as they wanted. Took the pdf file down the street yesterday and their "layout" person as they called her, popped the CD into the side of her Mac monitor, opened the pdf and wham! She was thrilled to pieces and she was very complimentary -- she said everything was "good to go". Today, 4:30pm, we get a phone call from the advertising person saying there was a problem with the file. When THEY printed (on what I don't know), they were getting either black boxes or white boxes instead of one of the headlines and a couple of the pictures. QUESTION: this is a pdf file and it was correctly composed. I have MUCH more confidence in my staff's capabilities than the newspaper's staff. So, before we contact them tomorrow, thought I would get some input from the collective wisdom on this list. Yes, we are a pc shop and the newspaper is a mac shop. But the pdf opened perfectly ON HER SCREEN. Advertising person said she had some notes about, "turning off hyperlinks before creating the pdf and screen fonts not being available"? Like I said, I have a competent and knowledgeable staff -- THEY DO NOT. So, what's the scoop. ????? Robin p.s. we printed numerous proofs on our epson 7600 and they printed quickly and easily with everything, headlines and photos, printing as designed. Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From david.doost at gmail.com Wed Feb 13 19:22:58 2008 From: david.doost at gmail.com (David Doost) Date: Wed Feb 13 19:23:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47b389de.0f0c360a.0940.2fdd@mx.google.com> This might be of some interest to anyone planning on major purchases or improvements this year: http://money.cnn.com/2008/02/13/smbusiness/stimulus_small_biz.fsb/index.htm? postversion=2008021316 or http://tinyurl.com/ywfons By Neil deMause February 13 2008: 4:29 PM EST "The key addition affecting small businesses is an expansion of "bonus depreciation," which allows investments in tangible property, computer software, or improvements to leased property to be more speedily depreciated, adding to a business' tax savings. Businesses of all sizes will be allowed to depreciate in this tax year 50% of the cost of an asset put into use in 2008." David Doost Printing Impression Kennesaw, GA 30144 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From printer at ptialaska.net Wed Feb 13 19:27:44 2008 From: printer at ptialaska.net (Charles A. Lincoln) Date: Wed Feb 13 19:28:05 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper In-Reply-To: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> References: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <7665B13E-B382-408C-90C9-52065930E930@ptialaska.net> On Feb 13, 2008, at 3:18 PM, Robin Niewold wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > We did the layout and design of a full page ad being run in our > local newspaper -- customer was a local non-profit group and they > did not trust the paper to do it the way they wanted, so they paid > us to get it exactly as they wanted. Took the pdf file down the > street yesterday and their "layout" person as they called her, > popped the CD into the side of her Mac monitor, opened the pdf and > wham! She was thrilled to pieces and she was very complimentary -- > she said everything was "good to go". > Today, 4:30pm, we get a phone call from the advertising person > saying there was a problem with the file. When THEY printed (on what > I don't know), they were getting either black boxes or white boxes > instead of one of the headlines and a couple of the pictures. > QUESTION: this is a pdf file and it was correctly composed. I have > MUCH more confidence in my staff's capabilities than the newspaper's > staff. So, before we contact them tomorrow, thought I would get some > input from the collective wisdom on this list. > Yes, we are a pc shop and the newspaper is a mac shop. But the pdf > opened perfectly ON HER SCREEN. > Advertising person said she had some notes about, "turning off > hyperlinks before creating the pdf and screen fonts not being > available"? > Like I said, I have a competent and knowledgeable staff -- THEY DO > NOT. So, what's the scoop. REPLY: It sounds like a font issue. Always convert the text to OUTLINES, then pdf... _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Charles Lincoln ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY 612 30th Avenue Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 (907) 451-1111 fax (907) 451-4511 _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ From smc at sorrentomesa.com Wed Feb 13 20:16:33 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Wed Feb 13 20:17:25 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper In-Reply-To: <7665B13E-B382-408C-90C9-52065930E930@ptialaska.net> References: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> <7665B13E-B382-408C-90C9-52065930E930@ptialaska.net> Message-ID: <200802140117.m1E1HCXk077371@i2bnetworks.com> For your own protection, always export your PDF as a PDF-X or a PDF-A and you're fully compliant with the blind-handshake handoff (especially to dumbass newspapers). http://tinyurl.com/28fczp If you don't do that then its finger pointing time.... S. At 04:27 PM 2/13/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >On Feb 13, 2008, at 3:18 PM, Robin Niewold wrote: > >>***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** >> >>We did the layout and design of a full page ad being run in our >>local newspaper -- customer was a local non-profit group and they >>did not trust the paper to do it the way they wanted, so they paid >>us to get it exactly as they wanted. Took the pdf file down the >>street yesterday and their "layout" person as they called her, >>popped the CD into the side of her Mac monitor, opened the pdf and >>wham! She was thrilled to pieces and she was very complimentary -- >>she said everything was "good to go". >>Today, 4:30pm, we get a phone call from the advertising person >>saying there was a problem with the file. When THEY printed (on what >>I don't know), they were getting either black boxes or white boxes >>instead of one of the headlines and a couple of the pictures. >>QUESTION: this is a pdf file and it was correctly composed. I have >>MUCH more confidence in my staff's capabilities than the newspaper's >>staff. So, before we contact them tomorrow, thought I would get some >>input from the collective wisdom on this list. >>Yes, we are a pc shop and the newspaper is a mac shop. But the pdf >>opened perfectly ON HER SCREEN. >>Advertising person said she had some notes about, "turning off >>hyperlinks before creating the pdf and screen fonts not being >>available"? >>Like I said, I have a competent and knowledgeable staff -- THEY DO >>NOT. So, what's the scoop. > > >REPLY: >It sounds like a font issue. Always convert the text to OUTLINES, then >pdf... > >_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > >Charles Lincoln >ADVANCE PRINTING COMPANY >612 30th Avenue >Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 >(907) 451-1111 >fax (907) 451-4511 > >_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2873 (20080213) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com > _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From char at themasterspress.com Wed Feb 13 21:29:21 2008 From: char at themasterspress.com (Charlene Sims) Date: Wed Feb 13 21:29:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? In-Reply-To: <022b01c86e94$2ea57670$8302a8c0@Robbin> References: <7A804691-DDFA-4448-97D6-75C17B2CCDC2@protypeonline.com> <022b01c86e94$2ea57670$8302a8c0@Robbin> Message-ID: <005f01c86eb1$6814f5d0$0b01a8c0@CharXP> Susan you have to remember you are in business to make a profit, whether they like it or not. If you loose 15% of your income with doing it for such a low price maybe you will actually make more profit for less work. They are not going to find it at the prices you have been giving them. Sell them and let them know what an advantage it is for YOU to stay in business so you can keep on serving them. Good luck. ch Charlene Sims The Master's Press, Inc. 14550 Midway Road Dallas, Tx 75244 972-387-0046 fax 972-404-0317 www.TheMastersPress.com char@themasterspress.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Susan Compton Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 5:00 PM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Not Another Printing Question!!? ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Dear Michael, Scott, Robin, John Stewart and everyone else: Thanks for all the help. I am going to do exactly as you said. I figure if they say OK I'll make more money and, if they don't, then either we can keep doing what we've been doing or reorganize here to absorb the loss (right now about 15% of our income). Just a little background to help you understand the dilemma I am under. This is a private university that has a Publications Department which controls all design, pricing, ordering, etc. They had their own print shop, which closed two or three years ago (they couldn't keep a press operator). Anyway, this university has a really big ego, and we are just 31,000 (size of our county) yokels who either have moved here to work for them or we don't have any idea what we are doing. I would love to be in an area where I could pick and choose my customers, but it ain't gonna happen here. I will go to them some time in the next week (gotta plan my speech) armed with the 2-color offset printing page from the most recent pricing survey (Thanks, John!) and have a little chat with them. The prices they are currently receiving are almost half of what the prices on the pricing survey are. Then it's up to them. I hope for the sake of my employees that they see the light. I'll keep you posted! Susan Wells Compton Compton Design & Printing Inc. 109 South Jefferson Street Lexington, VA 24450 540-463-9232 540-464-4329 Fax Susan@cdandp.net www.cdandp.net _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From ssheers at sheergraphics.com Wed Feb 13 21:53:08 2008 From: ssheers at sheergraphics.com (Simon Sheers) Date: Wed Feb 13 21:53:26 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Windows - Macs In-Reply-To: <20080213202818.9A774E0FD5F@rb.enter.net> References: <20080213202818.9A774E0FD5F@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <8823522C-DC8E-4B99-930D-71BFBEC21BA0@sheergraphics.com> We have PC RIPs and computers that we use daily for UPS, AccuZip and ..... er, um ..... Having just purchased a new MacBook and experienced the 'oh so smooth' transfer of settings, preferences, programs and datafrom an elderly PowerBook, here is a link for people to see what the Mac OS X 10.5.x offers in productivity. If one purchases Macs, the price is higher, but the cost of ownership is lower. With one machine an operator can use PC only programs, or Mac programs. So many times I visit a customer struggling with the Windows operating system's visible file handling, unable to find what they are seeking, or getting lost in a maze of icons or weird warning windows. It surely frustrates me when I sit at a PC. I want to DRIVE the machine, not be under the hood! We run our whole company on Macintosh machines and networking is so less 'geeky' with a Mac server that our PCs easily access. I cannot remember the last time a customer supplied file had to be opened on a PC, because of some quirky program or file, prior to manipulation on a Mac. The exception would be Microsoft's Publisher files. > Charles that is some advertisement from PC World! Please reply to Simon Sheers at: Sheer Graphics Inc. 47 Chestnut Avenue, Westmont, IL 60559-1127 Tel: (630) 654-4422 Printing the message . . . and a whole lot more From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Wed Feb 13 22:08:43 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Wed Feb 13 22:08:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Digital paper In-Reply-To: <8CA3CB5EED09418-9C4-1909@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CA3CB5EED09418-9C4-1909@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802131908q50fe10fbs48dcad0711c8dc29@mail.gmail.com> On Feb 13, 2008 7:16 PM, Tommy Melendez wrote: > > WHat are you paying for 13 x 19 12pt Digital paper and whom do you purchase from??? I have x250 great quality but I tried to run regular coated & the paper is curling like crazy.? I guess it's the moisture being suck'd out.? It's real fun trying to cut them. What "regular coated" paper are you running that's giving you trouble. Our KM C500 will run just about anything we put in it without curling problems. About the only thing it doesn't love is 11x17 and 12x18 80# Opus Gloss text; 100# is no problem. We regularly run 12 pt Kromekote and Carolina C1S and C2S with no issues. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From craig at newhavenprint.com Thu Feb 14 07:30:54 2008 From: craig at newhavenprint.com (Craig Dellinger) Date: Thu Feb 14 07:27:21 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper In-Reply-To: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <20080214122720.0047AE1235C@rb.enter.net> Several possibilities Robin. One is that some of the fonts didn't embed when you made the pdf file. There are a few fonts that have a code telling Acrobat that they can't embed their code. The only way to get around that is to convert them in a font program (Fontographer or similar), or convert the text to paths before you make the pdf. The other possibility is transparency issues. They can rear their ugly head no matter how new your rip is. Sometimes when that happens, we'll change the default in Acrobat Distiller to save as Postscript Level 2. That will "dumb down" the file and it usually works. There are other options involving overprint preview and a few more, but I think one of the first two will work for you. And yes, the pdf can display perfectly and print crappy. Here's the easiest solution for you today - especially for a newspaper reproduction. Just open the pdf in Acrobat, do a save as, and save it as a tiff. That makes it into a bunch of dots and they won't have any issues with reproduction. 300 dpi is plenty for newspaper printing. 600 would look better if you were printing it. Craig Dellinger New Haven Print & Copy 7531 US 930 East Fort Wayne, IN 46803 260.493.3844 / Fax 260.493.3579 www.newhavenprint.com > We did the layout and design of a full page ad being run in > our local newspaper -- customer was a local non-profit group > and they did not trust the paper to do it the way they > wanted, so they paid us to get it exactly as they wanted. > Took the pdf file down the street yesterday and their > "layout" person as they called her, popped the CD into the > side of her Mac monitor, opened the pdf and wham! She was > thrilled to pieces and she was very complimentary -- she said > everything was "good to go". > Robin Niewold > Pro-Type Printing, Inc. From gamble at choiceonemail.com Thu Feb 14 07:47:45 2008 From: gamble at choiceonemail.com (Rick Bird) Date: Thu Feb 14 07:47:59 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper In-Reply-To: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> References: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <01d201c86f07$cc590760$0301a8c0@RICK> Robin, This is going to sound odd but I have had this happen in my shop. Have them open the document again and save as a PDF to a different file name. It tends to work for me will look great on screen go to a printer and it gives me smiley faces and boxes, pictures out of color range. First time it happened I was not so smiley faced the girl ran the whole job never looking at the copy outputting. Oh well lesson learned. HTH Rick Bird Gamble Printing & Mailing Inc. 3649 California Road Orchard Park, NY 14127 (716) 662-1515 (716) 662-5917 - Fax gamble@choiceonemail.com - email -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Robin Niewold Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 7:18 PM To: printowners printowners Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** We did the layout and design of a full page ad being run in our local newspaper -- customer was a local non-profit group and they did not trust the paper to do it the way they wanted, so they paid us to get it exactly as they wanted. Took the pdf file down the street yesterday and their "layout" person as they called her, popped the CD into the side of her Mac monitor, opened the pdf and wham! She was thrilled to pieces and she was very complimentary -- she said everything was "good to go". Today, 4:30pm, we get a phone call from the advertising person saying there was a problem with the file. When THEY printed (on what I don't know), they were getting either black boxes or white boxes instead of one of the headlines and a couple of the pictures. QUESTION: this is a pdf file and it was correctly composed. I have MUCH more confidence in my staff's capabilities than the newspaper's staff. So, before we contact them tomorrow, thought I would get some input from the collective wisdom on this list. Yes, we are a pc shop and the newspaper is a mac shop. But the pdf opened perfectly ON HER SCREEN. Advertising person said she had some notes about, "turning off hyperlinks before creating the pdf and screen fonts not being available"? Like I said, I have a competent and knowledgeable staff -- THEY DO NOT. So, what's the scoop. ????? Robin p.s. we printed numerous proofs on our epson 7600 and they printed quickly and easily with everything, headlines and photos, printing as designed. Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From kathy at mpcny.com Thu Feb 14 08:06:17 2008 From: kathy at mpcny.com (Kathy Henry) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:06:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls In-Reply-To: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> Message-ID: <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been involved in a sales meeting. Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top of his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his office at all. The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would come to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves our working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship (he is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent working relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my marriage vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to pay for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances. 1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car. 2. I learned never to expect what you expect. HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never occur to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some men think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I understand printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of conduct that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any of you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk, but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely unusual from both of them. Thank you all in advance for your help on this! Kathleen Henry Mitchell Printing & Mailing kathy@mpcny.com "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding 125 East First Street PO Box 815 Oswego, NY 13126 (315) 343-3531 (315) 343-3577 (fax) (315) 532-0943 (cell) No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.4/1277 - Release Date: 2/13/2008 8:00 PM From sherwood at ctsbroadband.com Thu Feb 14 08:25:52 2008 From: sherwood at ctsbroadband.com (Bob Sherwood) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:32:22 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll Message-ID: <002f01c86f0d$20345e20$01fea8c0@cumberla1> I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we do ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that in line with other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here everyday and is worth her pay. Bob Sherwood Cumberland Printing P.O. Box 313 Monticello, KY 42633 606-348-4517 From brian at designotype.com Thu Feb 14 08:42:20 2008 From: brian at designotype.com (brian@designotype.com) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:42:32 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll Message-ID: <44732.192.168.1.35.1202996540.webmail@192.168.1.35> 35% is WAAAY high. Excluding one owner your payroll shoould be no more than 28% of gross sales. Even 28% would be on the high side. Brian Helminen -----Original Message----- From: Bob Sherwood Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 8:25am To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we do ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that in line with other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here everyday and is worth her pay. Bob Sherwood Cumberland Printing P.O. Box 313 Monticello, KY 42633 606-348-4517 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From bob at rjmprinting.com Thu Feb 14 08:46:07 2008 From: bob at rjmprinting.com (Bob Molacek) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:46:23 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll In-Reply-To: <002f01c86f0d$20345e20$01fea8c0@cumberla1> Message-ID: Bob, Our payroll and benefits run under 25% including a reasonable salary assumption for my wife. It really depends on what the rest of you numbers look like. You could be: Cost of Goods 25%, Payroll 35% and Overhead 20% leaving a 20% Owners Comp 5 years ago ours used to be: Cost of Goods 30%, Payroll 35% and Overhead 25% leaving no money and a hell of a lot of stress. In my opinion payroll including benefits should be around 25%. Bob Molacek Sir Speedy Printing 7793 Ranchers Road Fridley, MN 55432 763-571-4608 bob@rjmprinting.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Bob Sherwood Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 7:26 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we do ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that in line with other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here everyday and is worth her pay. Bob Sherwood Cumberland Printing P.O. Box 313 Monticello, KY 42633 606-348-4517 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From brian at designotype.com Thu Feb 14 08:46:24 2008 From: brian at designotype.com (brian@designotype.com) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:46:37 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls Message-ID: <56848.192.168.1.70.1202996784.webmail@192.168.1.70> Kathy: I think you did the right thing. Every day I am reminded how so many in this world have such low morals. Brian Helminen -----Original Message----- I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been involved in a sales meeting. Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top of his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his office at all. The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would come to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves our working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship (he is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent working relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my marriage vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to pay for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances. 1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car. 2. I learned never to expect what you expect. HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never occur to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some men think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I understand printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of conduct that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any of you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk, but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely unusual from both of them. From huntleyw at bellsouth.net Thu Feb 14 08:48:29 2008 From: huntleyw at bellsouth.net (Bill Huntley) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:47:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: <004d01c86f10$495b9e00$cde50641@bills4drj3ddzy> Your story reminds me of the old adage that men fall in love with their waitress and women fall in love with their doctor. And personally, with as many waitresses as I have fallen in love with over the years, I have been able to contain my impulses. However, I will bet that you are a good listener and emote a sympathetic demeanor, both of which may tend to make men think you "like" them. But I have found that if a woman even just smiles at a man, most men's next thought is "I bet she wants to sleep with me." I think I can safely say that no scientist has yet to pinpoint the exact time that a man's brain switches off and another part of the anatomy starts to do the thinking. Because this sort of thing has happened to me quite frequently, I have learned to respond with "I'm sorry, but I am very in love with my wife, and I wouldn't do anything to jepordize that relationship." Good luck, Hottie. Bill Huntley Universal Copies Columbia, SC ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kathy Henry" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 8:06 AM Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can > get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be > brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I > can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with > my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations > on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or > flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been > involved in a sales meeting. > > Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make > sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good > customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg > underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top of > his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me > following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his > office at all. > > The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would come > to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked > if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make > the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the > project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this > client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We > get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and > begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me > attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves our > working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said > he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship (he > is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent working > relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my marriage > vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he > totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just > keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to pay > for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable > silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances. > > 1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car. > 2. I learned never to expect what you expect. > > HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never occur > to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some men > think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I understand > printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of conduct > that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any of > you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out > there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it > was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk, > but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely unusual > from both of them. > > Thank you all in advance for your help on this! > > > > Kathleen Henry > Mitchell Printing & Mailing > kathy@mpcny.com > > > "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding > > > 125 East First Street > PO Box 815 > Oswego, NY 13126 > (315) 343-3531 > (315) 343-3577 (fax) > (315) 532-0943 (cell) > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.4/1277 - Release Date: 2/13/2008 > 8:00 PM > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From scott at usacolor.com Thu Feb 14 08:50:06 2008 From: scott at usacolor.com (Scott Balsiger) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:50:26 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls In-Reply-To: <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: <47B4470E.1030008@usacolor.com> This happens for several reasons, one is that some female sales reps will do sexual favors for business. I've owned a few business over the years and have had to deal with customers who wouldn't take an ad out in my newspaper because my competition worked "under his desk". The other is that some guys are pigs and would ask any good looking gal for sex, including their employees. Scott Balsiger President USA Color Printing Inc. www.usacolor.com 791 Manhomen Dr. Bemidji, MN. 56601 218-759-9126 800-759-9126 218-556-5505(Cell) 218-759-2883(fax) Kathy Henry wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can >get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be >brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I >can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with >my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations >on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or >flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been >involved in a sales meeting. > >Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make >sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good >customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg >underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top of >his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me >following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his >office at all. > >The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would come >to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked >if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make >the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the >project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this >client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We >get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and >begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me >attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves our >working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said >he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship (he >is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent working >relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my marriage >vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he >totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just >keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to pay >for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable >silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances. > >1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car. >2. I learned never to expect what you expect. > >HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never occur >to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some men >think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I understand >printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of conduct >that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any of >you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out >there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it >was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk, >but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely unusual >from both of them. > >Thank you all in advance for your help on this! > > > >Kathleen Henry >Mitchell Printing & Mailing >kathy@mpcny.com > > > "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding > > >125 East First Street >PO Box 815 >Oswego, NY 13126 >(315) 343-3531 >(315) 343-3577 (fax) >(315) 532-0943 (cell) > > > >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.4/1277 - Release Date: 2/13/2008 >8:00 PM > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > From cyndy at pioneerprintinginc.com Thu Feb 14 08:52:08 2008 From: cyndy at pioneerprintinginc.com (Cyndy Wendt) Date: Thu Feb 14 08:52:28 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll In-Reply-To: <002f01c86f0d$20345e20$01fea8c0@cumberla1> Message-ID: On 2/14/08 7:25 AM, "Bob Sherwood" wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we do > ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that in line with > other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here everyday > and is worth her pay. I would agree with Brian - that is very high even if it includes an owner. Mine runs about 31% with and 21% without my salary. Those numbers include all payroll expenses. Cyndy -- Cyndy Wendt Harkins President Pioneer Printing, Inc. 3133 S. 7th., Suite D Lincoln, Nebraska 68502 cyndy@pioneerprintinginc.com 402.483.7575 From smc at sorrentomesa.com Thu Feb 14 09:09:48 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Thu Feb 14 09:10:57 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls In-Reply-To: <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: <200802141410.m1EEASKH078821@i2bnetworks.com> Hmmm. I think this is the human condition. Guys are pretty much always horny, most of us can contain ourselves, some of us can't. That being said, it is unfortunate that you have to think about this, you'd expect everyone to be professional right? I think that if this happened to you twice, it will probably happen again. And you are right to take precautions in the future. You drive, you control the situation, you pick the place to eat etc. etc. I don't think this is normal, but then again I'm a guy and have never been hit on in the sales process (not hot enough I guess) so what do I know... I think you just have to be discreet with these two in the future, and make sure you always wear your ring. I wouldn't let this stop you from continuing to do things exactly as you do them. Men can be pigs. S. At 05:06 AM 2/14/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can >get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be >brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I >can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with >my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations >on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or >flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been >involved in a sales meeting. > >Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make >sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good >customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg >underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top of >his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me >following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his >office at all. > >The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would come >to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked >if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make >the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the >project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this >client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We >get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and >begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me >attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves our >working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said >he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship (he >is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent working >relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my marriage >vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he >totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just >keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to pay >for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable >silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances. > >1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car. >2. I learned never to expect what you expect. > >HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never occur >to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some men >think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I understand >printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of conduct >that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any of >you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out >there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it >was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk, >but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely unusual >from both of them. > >Thank you all in advance for your help on this! > > > >Kathleen Henry >Mitchell Printing & Mailing >kathy@mpcny.com > > > "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding > > >125 East First Street >PO Box 815 >Oswego, NY 13126 >(315) 343-3531 >(315) 343-3577 (fax) >(315) 532-0943 (cell) > > > >No virus found in this outgoing message. >Checked by AVG Free Edition. >Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.4/1277 - Release Date: 2/13/2008 >8:00 PM > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2874 (20080214) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From copythatnyc at aol.com Thu Feb 14 09:11:35 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Thu Feb 14 09:12:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz In-Reply-To: <47b389de.0f0c360a.0940.2fdd@mx.google.com> References: <47b389de.0f0c360a.0940.2fdd@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <8CA3D2AA4ACEB74-B7C-2A3F@WEBMAIL-DF15.sysops.aol.com> Does that investment require a minimum amount of $$? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: David Doost To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Sent: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 7:22 pm Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** This might be of some interest to anyone planning on major purchases or improvements this year: http://money.cnn.com/2008/02/13/smbusiness/stimulus_small_biz.fsb/index.htm? postversion=2008021316 or http://tinyurl.com/ywfons By Neil deMause February 13 2008: 4:29 PM EST "The key addition affecting small businesses is an expansion of "bonus depreciation," which allows investments in tangible property, computer software, or improvements to leased property to be more speedily depreciated, adding to a business' tax savings. Businesses of all sizes will be allowed to depreciate in this tax year 50% of the cost of an asset put into use in 2008." David Doost Printing Impression Kennesaw, GA 30144 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From robin at protypeonline.com Thu Feb 14 09:22:12 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Thu Feb 14 09:22:31 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper Message-ID: <99CFD18F-8B58-4727-B881-E88953A7B128@protypeonline.com> Scott, GREAT info. re: PDF-X on the link you sent .....and written so that even I could understand! Shoot .....I bet Charlene could even understand! (we are both a bit challenged by technology -- not that it stops us from using!!!! :))) ) For those of you that missed or just elected to pass up the info. ...... http://tinyurl.com/28fczp Good Stuff! :) robin Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From copythatnyc at aol.com Thu Feb 14 09:26:09 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Thu Feb 14 09:27:01 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Digital paper In-Reply-To: <98f5b19a0802131908q50fe10fbs48dcad0711c8dc29@mail.gmail.com> References: <8CA3CB5EED09418-9C4-1909@MBLK-M19.sysops.aol.com> <98f5b19a0802131908q50fe10fbs48dcad0711c8dc29@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CA3D2CAD591773-B7C-2B0C@WEBMAIL-DF15.sysops.aol.com> It's paper I purchased from X-partner which he uses to run on his press.? Parent size 22 x 35 cut -down to 13 x 19 Brand-X <---LOL? Gee wonder why now!? I called Xpedx & they didn't have 13 x 19 cut sheets.? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Michael Vogel To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 10:08 pm Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] RE: Digital paper ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** On Feb 13, 2008 7:16 PM, Tommy Melendez wrote: > > WHat are you paying for 13 x 19 12pt Digital paper and whom do you purchase from??? I have x250 great quality but I tried to run regular coated & the paper is curling like crazy.? I guess it's the moisture being suck'd out.? It's real fun trying to cut them. What "regular coated" paper are you running that's giving you trouble. Our KM C500 will run just about anything we put in it without curling problems. About the only thing it doesn't love is 11x17 and 12x18 80# Opus Gloss text; 100# is no problem. We regularly run 12 pt Kromekote and Carolina C1S and C2S with no issues. -- Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From ray at capitol-copy.com Thu Feb 14 09:33:13 2008 From: ray at capitol-copy.com (Ray Sziber) Date: Thu Feb 14 09:33:29 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Inappropriate behavior In-Reply-To: <20080214133226.C556BE129A4@rb.enter.net> Message-ID: <001701c86f16$889bba90$9e00000a@CapitolCopy.local> Kathleen: Sorry to hear about we now call "sexual harrassment." Both of these cads are clearly out of line. It looks as though they are using their power as major clients to advance their interests. Many times we as business owners are faced with decisions that involve ethics, the law or just plain shady deals. We have to ask ourselves: is the money it worth it? I can remember a few times when I told an unethical client to go away and never come back. My reputation and peace of mind are far more important. I'm a 58 year old guy and was raised in a family environment that prescribed respect for one another. Over the years, the workplace has been become more casual, while at the same time employees/employers/vendors are suing each other for most inane things. In one year we lost 2 great employees because of threats of harrassment charges. It was really a misunderstanding but there was no other solution but to dismiss. Again, I am sorry for the lousy treatment you suffered. >>>>>>>>>I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been involved in a sales meeting.<<<<<<<<<<<< Ray Sziber Capitol Copy Service NAQP NAPL 116 West State Street Trenton NJ 08608 Ph 609-989-8776 Fx609-989-9570 www.Capitol-Copy.com Now Offering Large Format Printing! verkin tala From robin at protypeonline.com Thu Feb 14 09:35:38 2008 From: robin at protypeonline.com (Robin Niewold) Date: Thu Feb 14 09:35:56 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls Message-ID: <7D7EA228-9340-420C-B820-9A51BA59DBC4@protypeonline.com> Kathy, I don't think I can type fast enough to convey all the different thoughts running through my head. First one is -- report the jerk to their superiors -- other owners, board of directors -- because this person is opening up the entire company to a big-time law suit -- don't mean to play down your attractiveness!!!! BUT, if they are doing it to you, they are doing it to others. You can state you have no intention of suing, you want to continue with business relationship -- you know what to say -- BUT, as a partner in their success and future, you thought it was important they know! Not sure if I should be jealous or thankful! Sure never had this happen to me -- well, yes, I did -- once. Short, bald, extremely overweight guy with saliva coming out side of his mouth all the time......and I DID tell his co-worker she needed to get him to stop! She did and he has "calmed down". ICK! Okay....I'M THANKFUL!!!! And....just an afterthought -- I don't think I would have shared my personal relationship, loving John, marriage vows -- none of their DAMN business -- BUT, who knows what I might have said if I had been you and not had the benefit of thinking about it! What did John say? I can't imagine him taking this very calmly!!!!!!!! Will we be reading about an Oswego printer who shot some guy with a shotgun?????? robin p.s. Debra Thompson -- are you out there?????? Robin Niewold Pro-Type Printing, Inc. 130 N. Market Street Paxton, IL 60957 217.379.4715 robin@protypeonline.com From peter at keystonepress.com Thu Feb 14 09:52:00 2008 From: peter at keystonepress.com (Peter Church) Date: Thu Feb 14 09:53:36 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll In-Reply-To: <44732.192.168.1.35.1202996540.webmail@192.168.1.35> Message-ID: <002c01c86f19$285da370$7d01a8c0@key.local> Are you including workers' comp insurance, company paid portion of health insurance, FUTA, company paid portion of FICA and Medicare, State unemployment Tax, and any state taxes that are based on payroll expense? Peter Church Keystone Press, LLC 9 Old Falls Road Manchester, NH 03103 phone: 603-622-5222 fax: 603-622-9432 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of brian@designotype.com Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 8:42 AM To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Payroll ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** 35% is WAAAY high. Excluding one owner your payroll shoould be no more than 28% of gross sales. Even 28% would be on the high side. Brian Helminen -----Original Message----- From: Bob Sherwood Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 8:25am To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we do ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that in line with other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here everyday and is worth her pay. Bob Sherwood Cumberland Printing P.O. Box 313 Monticello, KY 42633 606-348-4517 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From QKCONSULT at aol.com Thu Feb 14 10:13:18 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:13:38 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll Message-ID: In a message dated 2/14/2008 9:54:52 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, peter@keystonepress.com writes: Are you including workers' comp insurance, company paid portion of health insurance, FUTA, company paid portion of FICA and Medicare, State unemployment Tax, and any state taxes that are based on payroll expense? Peter is certainly correct in that to properly report "payroll" it should include all of the above. Also included in payroll are the wages/salary paid to a working partner/spouse. The average payroll ratio for the top 25% in the industry is 27.44%. Remember this is the average of the top quartile so the payroll percentage for all companies in the top 25% probably 23% to 28% or thereabouts. At the other end of the spectrum, actually the bottom two quartiles, you will find companies reporting payroll in the 32-37% range. As someone else noted, it is extremely difficult to produce any type of reasonable owner's compensation when payroll even approaches the 30% range. Payroll is by far the most controllable of all expenses in the printing industry. General overhead, by its very nature, tends to be fixed within most companies. The same for COG, although the latter can be modified as well through higher markups, lower costs, higher pricing, lower amounts for brokered services, etc. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From david.doost at gmail.com Thu Feb 14 10:14:20 2008 From: david.doost at gmail.com (David Doost) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:14:40 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz In-Reply-To: <8CA3D2AA4ACEB74-B7C-2A3F@WEBMAIL-DF15.sysops.aol.com> References: <47b389de.0f0c360a.0940.2fdd@mx.google.com> <8CA3D2AA4ACEB74-B7C-2A3F@WEBMAIL-DF15.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <47b45acd.2787460a.79c3.ffffde86@mx.google.com> >From the article: Another provision that now becomes law will increase the level of so-called "Section 179" deductions that small businesses can expense instead of depreciate. Initially included in the House of Representatives' stimulus bill, this language allows businesses with up to $800,000 in annual revenue to deduct investments in any tangible business purchases (not including buildings, but including computer software) of up to $250,000, instead of depreciating them. These caps are increases from the $500,000 annual revenue maximum and $125,000 deduction limit under current law. David Doost Printing Impression Kennesaw, GA 30144 -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Tommy Melendez Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 9:12 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Does that investment require a minimum amount of $$? Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: David Doost To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' Sent: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 7:22 pm Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** This might be of some interest to anyone planning on major purchases or improvements this year: http://money.cnn.com/2008/02/13/smbusiness/stimulus_small_biz.fsb/index.htm? postversion=2008021316 or http://tinyurl.com/ywfons By Neil deMause February 13 2008: 4:29 PM EST "The key addition affecting small businesses is an expansion of "bonus depreciation," which allows investments in tangible property, computer software, or improvements to leased property to be more speedily depreciated, adding to a business' tax savings. Businesses of all sizes will be allowed to depreciate in this tax year 50% of the cost of an asset put into use in 2008." David Doost Printing Impression Kennesaw, GA 30144 _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From sherwood at ctsbroadband.com Thu Feb 14 10:18:27 2008 From: sherwood at ctsbroadband.com (Bob Sherwood) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:18:53 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll References: <002c01c86f19$285da370$7d01a8c0@key.local> Message-ID: <008701c86f1c$e07a2d90$01fea8c0@cumberla1> Included all but worker's comp insurance and payroll taxes I guess my part. We dont have health insurance at $1700 per month for a family rate beleive that would break the bank. 2007 we did $163,000 Gross $ 60,000 payroll including my wife, (none for me) $ 4,900 payroll taxes $ 40,000 cost of goods sold (mostly paper $35,000) $ 6,000 utilities and such Those are the biggest ones when you get done $18,000 net profit. Just don't seem like much. All according to Quickbooks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Church" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 9:52 AM Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Payroll > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > Are you including workers' comp insurance, company paid portion of health > insurance, FUTA, company paid portion of FICA and Medicare, State > unemployment Tax, and any state taxes that are based on payroll expense? > > > Peter Church > Keystone Press, LLC > 9 Old Falls Road > Manchester, NH 03103 > phone: 603-622-5222 > fax: 603-622-9432 > > -----Original Message----- > From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org > [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of > brian@designotype.com > Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 8:42 AM > To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only > Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Payroll > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > 35% is WAAAY high. Excluding one owner your payroll shoould be no more > than > 28% of gross sales. Even 28% would be on the high side. > Brian Helminen > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bob Sherwood > Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 8:25am > To: printowners@printweb.org > Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll > > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we > do > ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that in line with > other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here > everyday > and is worth her pay. > > Bob Sherwood > Cumberland Printing > P.O. Box 313 > Monticello, KY 42633 > 606-348-4517 > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com Thu Feb 14 10:28:12 2008 From: mv.sirspeedy at gmail.com (Michael Vogel) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:28:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll In-Reply-To: <002f01c86f0d$20345e20$01fea8c0@cumberla1> References: <002f01c86f0d$20345e20$01fea8c0@cumberla1> Message-ID: <98f5b19a0802140728s2667dbe7gf8030304aa8e6c5a@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Feb 14, 2008 at 8:25 AM, Bob Sherwood wrote:**** > > > I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we > do ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that in line with > other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here everyday > and is worth her pay. We're at a tick over 20% all in (excluding me). Keeping the graphics department from being a black hole is consequential factor in achieving a lower payroll percentage, as is other activity-based pricing. With payroll at 35%, your people are either being grossly underutilized, or your prices are too low. I'm surprised nobody else pointed you in this direction: http://www.quickconsultant.com/06-07%20Operating%20Ratio%20Study.htm Get yourself a copy of John Stewart's indispensable Operating Ratio Study as the starting point in getting your ratios in line. We are very fortunate to have this kind of information so readily available. Michael Vogel Sir Speedy Printing 9 Research Drive Milford, CT 06460 tel 203-877-1231 fax 203-878-2679 mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com www.eSirSpeedy.com ==================================== Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. ~Lord Bacon From greg at pressexpress.org Thu Feb 14 10:29:39 2008 From: greg at pressexpress.org (Greg Weinfurter) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:30:09 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] PC PDF & MAC Local Newspaper In-Reply-To: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> References: <061330DF-F44E-442A-8727-A21CFA6DEC94@protypeonline.com> Message-ID: <7498CC65-397C-4DDF-9954-EDAC10E3E729@pressexpress.org> I have had a situation when a pdf views and prints on the pc fine, but the fonts weren't embedded properly. Amazingly the pdf knew enough to link to the fonts that reside on the pc for printing/viewing. Viewed fine on the pc, viewed fine on the mac, but when ripped, the link to the fonts were missing. It has to be a font issue. Greg On Feb 13, 2008, at 6:18 PM, Robin Niewold wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > We did the layout and design of a full page ad being run in our > local newspaper -- customer was a local non-profit group and they > did not trust the paper to do it the way they wanted, so they paid > us to get it exactly as they wanted. Took the pdf file down the > street yesterday and their "layout" person as they called her, > popped the CD into the side of her Mac monitor, opened the pdf and > wham! She was thrilled to pieces and she was very complimentary -- > she said everything was "good to go". > Today, 4:30pm, we get a phone call from the advertising person > saying there was a problem with the file. When THEY printed (on what > I don't know), they were getting either black boxes or white boxes > instead of one of the headlines and a couple of the pictures. > QUESTION: this is a pdf file and it was correctly composed. I have > MUCH more confidence in my staff's capabilities than the newspaper's > staff. So, before we contact them tomorrow, thought I would get some > input from the collective wisdom on this list. > Yes, we are a pc shop and the newspaper is a mac shop. But the pdf > opened perfectly ON HER SCREEN. > Advertising person said she had some notes about, "turning off > hyperlinks before creating the pdf and screen fonts not being > available"? > Like I said, I have a competent and knowledgeable staff -- THEY DO > NOT. So, what's the scoop. > ????? > Robin > > p.s. we printed numerous proofs on our epson 7600 and they printed > quickly and easily with everything, headlines and photos, printing > as designed. > > Robin Niewold > Pro-Type Printing, Inc. > 130 N. Market Street > Paxton, IL 60957 > 217.379.4715 > robin@protypeonline.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From smc at sorrentomesa.com Thu Feb 14 10:32:51 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:33:49 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz In-Reply-To: <47b45acd.2787460a.79c3.ffffde86@mx.google.com> References: <47b389de.0f0c360a.0940.2fdd@mx.google.com> <8CA3D2AA4ACEB74-B7C-2A3F@WEBMAIL-DF15.sysops.aol.com> <47b45acd.2787460a.79c3.ffffde86@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <200802141533.m1EFXWjZ093306@i2bnetworks.com> David, the limits of $500,000 (now $800,000) for electing 179 treatment are not annual revenue limits. Those limits are for the value of equipment purchased and placed into production. If you buy a press for $500,000 you can elect 179 treatment, if you buy a press for $1,000,000 you can't (because the value of the press exceeds the limit). Like previously mentioned, the checks are for the worker bees and to get votes, the real meat of this bill is the 179 increases, the bonus depreciation clause, and for us out here in expensive real estate land, where everybody has jumbo loans on their homes, most of us now can refinance our homes with conforming Fannie Mae loans. This means most people here will save at least a half a point right off the top and as rates continue to creep down this year could amount to a substantial decrease in cost of home ownership. Also completely reinvigorates the mortgage loan business..I'm sure the phones will be ringing off the hook for those guys. S. At 07:14 AM 2/14/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >From the article: > >Another provision that now becomes law will increase the level of so-called >"Section 179" deductions that small businesses can expense instead of >depreciate. Initially included in the House of Representatives' stimulus >bill, this language allows businesses with up to $800,000 in annual revenue >to deduct investments in any tangible business purchases (not including >buildings, but including computer software) of up to $250,000, instead of >depreciating them. These caps are increases from the $500,000 annual revenue >maximum and $125,000 deduction limit under current law. > > > >David Doost >Printing Impression >Kennesaw, GA 30144 > > >-----Original Message----- >From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org >[mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Tommy Melendez >Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 9:12 AM >To: printowners@printweb.org >Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >Does that investment require a minimum amount of $$? > > > > > > > >Copy That, Inc. >"Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" >3515 E. Tremont Avenue >Bronx, N.Y. 10465 >718.892.1859 >718.892.2315 Fax >www.copythatnyc.com > > >-----Original Message----- >From: David Doost >To: 'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only' > >Sent: Wed, 13 Feb 2008 7:22 pm >Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Stimulus bill: Tax breaks for small biz > > > >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > >This might be of some interest to anyone planning on major purchases or >improvements this year: > >http://money.cnn.com/2008/02/13/smbusiness/stimulus_small_biz.fsb/index.htm? >postversion=2008021316 >or >http://tinyurl.com/ywfons >By Neil deMause >February 13 2008: 4:29 PM EST > > > >"The key addition affecting small businesses is an expansion of "bonus >depreciation," which allows investments in tangible property, computer >software, or improvements to leased property to be more speedily >depreciated, adding to a business' tax savings. Businesses of all sizes will >be allowed to depreciate in this tax year 50% of the cost of an asset put >into use in 2008." > > >David Doost >Printing Impression >Kennesaw, GA 30144 > > > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > > >________________________________________________________________________ >More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - >http://webmail.aol.com >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2874 (20080214) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From ron at printingconcepts.com Thu Feb 14 11:04:13 2008 From: ron at printingconcepts.com (Ron Taggart) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:56:10 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Inappropriate behavior In-Reply-To: <001701c86f16$889bba90$9e00000a@CapitolCopy.local> Message-ID: This certainly comes under the heading, "And the printing business isn't complicated enough already?" Anyone who uses his position as a buyer to importune a woman is a guy who lacks power with women in his personal life, so he tries to use his business power to gain access to women who ordinarily wouldn't give him the time of day. It is pathetic. On the other side, I know of a woman sales rep who has had at least two affairs with customers, despite the fact that her company strictly forbids it. I'd also bet that the men's companies wouldn't be too happy about it as well. I would do exactly as you have done and no further. Telling him you love your husband gives a weak person like this a way to save face with himself and not be mad at you for rejecting him. It is perverse to even consider worrying about these clowns' feelings, but I would still have my eye on maintaining the business. Is turning these accounts over to another person in the company an option?? Recipients of this E-mail should note that the quotations that appear below should not be construed as a personal message, nor are they in any manner a statement regarding the recipient's character, and are meant for the general edification of this writer's friends and correspondents. If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you. --Don Marquis People ask for criticism, but they only want praise. -- W. Somerset Maugham The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others. --Bertrand Russell Ron Taggart, President PRINTING CONCEPTS, INC. 4246 Hudson Drive Stow, Ohio 44224 330-572-8200 fax. 330-572-8201 www.printingconcepts.com ron@printingconcepts.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org]On Behalf Of Ray Sziber Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 9:33 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Inappropriate behavior ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Kathleen: Sorry to hear about we now call "sexual harrassment." Both of these cads are clearly out of line. It looks as though they are using their power as major clients to advance their interests. Many times we as business owners are faced with decisions that involve ethics, the law or just plain shady deals. We have to ask ourselves: is the money it worth it? I can remember a few times when I told an unethical client to go away and never come back. My reputation and peace of mind are far more important. I'm a 58 year old guy and was raised in a family environment that prescribed respect for one another. Over the years, the workplace has been become more casual, while at the same time employees/employers/vendors are suing each other for most inane things. In one year we lost 2 great employees because of threats of harrassment charges. It was really a misunderstanding but there was no other solution but to dismiss. Again, I am sorry for the lousy treatment you suffered. >>>>>>>>>I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been involved in a sales meeting.<<<<<<<<<<<< Ray Sziber Capitol Copy Service NAQP NAPL 116 West State Street Trenton NJ 08608 Ph 609-989-8776 Fx609-989-9570 www.Capitol-Copy.com Now Offering Large Format Printing! verkin tala _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From po-lists at sugarloafprint.com Thu Feb 14 10:56:06 2008 From: po-lists at sugarloafprint.com (Ron Sardo) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:56:22 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls In-Reply-To: <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: <47B46496.6060505@sugarloafprint.com> As goofy as this sounds, this happened to me once. Being a guy I was kinda flattered, (if you knew what I looked like you would understand). Anyway, I flipped open the the cell phone and said, "My wife would enjoy lunch too, let me give her a call" She backed tracked pretty quickly BTW, this person knew my wife and knew we worked together. -- Ron Sardo Sugarloaf Print Shop mailto:po-lists@sugarloafprint.com www.sugarloafprint.com 570-788-5099 ? Fax: 570-788-6077 From smc at sorrentomesa.com Thu Feb 14 10:56:37 2008 From: smc at sorrentomesa.com (Scott Cappel) Date: Thu Feb 14 10:58:06 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll In-Reply-To: <98f5b19a0802140728s2667dbe7gf8030304aa8e6c5a@mail.gmail.co m> References: <002f01c86f0d$20345e20$01fea8c0@cumberla1> <98f5b19a0802140728s2667dbe7gf8030304aa8e6c5a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200802141557.m1EFvrdj097434@i2bnetworks.com> I'm with Michael on this. We're also right around 20%. My average employee wage here is well above average, but they're all incredibly efficient and experienced and are very productive so I need less people. Plus we sell value and our prices are not low, on anything. You prices are probably too low, and you definitely have too many people either running around working feverishly on low margin work, or not running around and sapping the life out of your company. You should be making at least 2-3X what you are making now. You should hire John Stewart to come in and evaluate your situation. He will cost you some $ but in the end you'll probably make 10-20X his fees just this year in your pocket... he'll jump start you right out of this mess. Then use the operating ratio study to guide you after the major corrections have been made. You need to act now or you'll surely burn out. This business is not getting any easier...... S. At 07:28 AM 2/14/2008, you wrote: >***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > >On Thu, Feb 14, 2008 at 8:25 AM, Bob Sherwood >wrote:**** > > > > > > I have been in business for 21 years dont know much about finance, but we > > do ok. Was wondering our payroll runs 35% of our gross. Is that > in line with > > other print shops, that does include my wifes pay, but she is here everyday > > and is worth her pay. > > > >We're at a tick over 20% all in (excluding me). >Keeping the graphics department from being a black hole is consequential >factor in achieving a lower payroll percentage, as is other activity-based >pricing. With payroll at 35%, your people are either being grossly >underutilized, or your prices are too low. > >I'm surprised nobody else pointed you in this direction: >http://www.quickconsultant.com/06-07%20Operating%20Ratio%20Study.htm >Get yourself a copy of John Stewart's indispensable Operating Ratio Study as >the starting point in getting your ratios in line. We are very fortunate to >have this kind of information so readily available. > > >Michael Vogel >Sir Speedy Printing >9 Research Drive >Milford, CT 06460 >tel 203-877-1231 >fax 203-878-2679 >mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com >www.eSirSpeedy.com >==================================== >Read not to accept nor to deny nor to agree nor to >criticize or condemn but to weigh and consider. >~Lord Bacon >_______________________________________________ >PrintOwners Discussion List >Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org >Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > > >__________ NOD32 2874 (20080214) Information __________ > >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. >http://www.eset.com _____________________________________________ Scott Cappel Sorrento Mesa Printing 7398 Trade Street San Diego, CA 92121-2422 858-527-0800 858-527-1740 FAX http://www.sorrentomesa.com LinkedIn Profile: www.linkedin.com/in/sorrentomesa Direct Links for Learning: http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/educarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/techarchives.html http://www.sorrentomesa.com/extra/infoarchives.html Authorized QuarkAlliance Solutions Provider Authorized Adobe Solutions Network Provider Corel Approved Service Bureau Strategic Level Authorized Microsoft Publisher 2003 Solutions Provider Commercial and Digital Color Printing for San Diego From QKCONSULT at aol.com Thu Feb 14 11:00:04 2008 From: QKCONSULT at aol.com (QKCONSULT@aol.com) Date: Thu Feb 14 11:00:32 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll Message-ID: In a message dated 2/14/2008 10:29:55 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com writes: We're at a tick over 20% all in (excluding me). Keeping the graphics department from being a black hole is consequential factor in achieving a lower payroll percentage, as is other activity-based pricing. With payroll at 35%, your people are either being grossly underutilized, or your prices are too low. Unfortunately, one of the inherent problems associated with firms with relatively low sales (say $350,000 and less) is that they typically have higher payroll costs because of the necessity for minimum staffing. It is almost impossible to run any type of printing business without at least three if not four individuals, and this is true regardless of how low the sales. You typically have a working owner, minimum of one person in production, possibly a PT person doing bindery and delivery, a person who doubles up doing graphic arts and CSR duties, and most likely one other CSR or front counter person who might also help with billing, and other accounting tasks. These "minimums" typically result in lower SPEs yet higher overall percentages for labor. The only offsetting factor is that small firms typically pay less per hour and are often located smaller towns and communities where it is possible to have lower overhead expenses. COG expenses, on the other hand, can go from one extreme to the next when you compare rural markets to large metro areas. Just some thoughts. John Stewart Q. P. Consulting, Inc. Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) by Larry Hunt & John Stewart 2110 S. Dairy Road West Melbourne, FL 32904 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 Cell: 321-794-6259 _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy Awards. Go to AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) From jgross at techiowa.com Thu Feb 14 11:20:08 2008 From: jgross at techiowa.com (John Gross) Date: Thu Feb 14 11:20:55 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Inappropriate behavior In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <003a01c86f25$7a2b4bb0$1e00000a@tech.local> A smart policy might be in response to a surprise invitation to lunch or any social activity with a client - delay and reschedule for a future time and show up with your husband or male colleague. John A. Gross Technigraphics, Inc Iowa City, Iowa 52240 techiowa.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org] On Behalf Of Ron Taggart Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 10:04 AM To: printowners Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] RE: Inappropriate behavior ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** This certainly comes under the heading, "And the printing business isn't complicated enough already?" Anyone who uses his position as a buyer to importune a woman is a guy who lacks power with women in his personal life, so he tries to use his business power to gain access to women who ordinarily wouldn't give him the time of day. It is pathetic. On the other side, I know of a woman sales rep who has had at least two affairs with customers, despite the fact that her company strictly forbids it. I'd also bet that the men's companies wouldn't be too happy about it as well. I would do exactly as you have done and no further. Telling him you love your husband gives a weak person like this a way to save face with himself and not be mad at you for rejecting him. It is perverse to even consider worrying about these clowns' feelings, but I would still have my eye on maintaining the business. Is turning these accounts over to another person in the company an option?? Recipients of this E-mail should note that the quotations that appear below should not be construed as a personal message, nor are they in any manner a statement regarding the recipient's character, and are meant for the general edification of this writer's friends and correspondents. If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you. --Don Marquis People ask for criticism, but they only want praise. -- W. Somerset Maugham The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others. --Bertrand Russell Ron Taggart, President PRINTING CONCEPTS, INC. 4246 Hudson Drive Stow, Ohio 44224 330-572-8200 fax. 330-572-8201 www.printingconcepts.com ron@printingconcepts.com -----Original Message----- From: printowners-bounces@printweb.org [mailto:printowners-bounces@printweb.org]On Behalf Of Ray Sziber Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 9:33 AM To: printowners@printweb.org Subject: [PrintOwners] RE: Inappropriate behavior ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** Kathleen: Sorry to hear about we now call "sexual harrassment." Both of these cads are clearly out of line. It looks as though they are using their power as major clients to advance their interests. Many times we as business owners are faced with decisions that involve ethics, the law or just plain shady deals. We have to ask ourselves: is the money it worth it? I can remember a few times when I told an unethical client to go away and never come back. My reputation and peace of mind are far more important. I'm a 58 year old guy and was raised in a family environment that prescribed respect for one another. Over the years, the workplace has been become more casual, while at the same time employees/employers/vendors are suing each other for most inane things. In one year we lost 2 great employees because of threats of harrassment charges. It was really a misunderstanding but there was no other solution but to dismiss. Again, I am sorry for the lousy treatment you suffered. >>>>>>>>>I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been involved in a sales meeting.<<<<<<<<<<<< Ray Sziber Capitol Copy Service NAQP NAPL 116 West State Street Trenton NJ 08608 Ph 609-989-8776 Fx609-989-9570 www.Capitol-Copy.com Now Offering Large Format Printing! verkin tala _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners _______________________________________________ PrintOwners Discussion List Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners From sherwood at ctsbroadband.com Thu Feb 14 11:24:47 2008 From: sherwood at ctsbroadband.com (Bob Sherwood) Date: Thu Feb 14 11:25:19 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Payroll References: Message-ID: <00ea01c86f26$26cf4f60$01fea8c0@cumberla1> You hit that right on the nail head, without even knowing us. There are four of us. I do the graphic arts and some CSR, wife does CSR which includes u-haul rentals, and most of the accounting, proofing. 1 full time employee (40hrs @ $10.50 a hour), the other about 35 hrs @ $8.50, who does bindery, delivery, hookes up u-hauls, sometimes he run a press too. We stay fairly busy most of the time, keep about 1 to 1.5 weeks worth of work in house usally. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 11:00 AM Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Payroll > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > > In a message dated 2/14/2008 10:29:55 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > mv.sirspeedy@gmail.com writes: > > We're at a tick over 20% all in (excluding me). > Keeping the graphics department from being a black hole is consequential > factor in achieving a lower payroll percentage, as is other > activity-based > pricing. With payroll at 35%, your people are either being grossly > underutilized, or your prices are too low. > > > > Unfortunately, one of the inherent problems associated with firms with > relatively low sales (say $350,000 and less) is that they typically have > higher > payroll costs because of the necessity for minimum staffing. It is almost > impossible to run any type of printing business without at least three if > not four > individuals, and this is true regardless of how low the sales. > > You typically have a working owner, minimum of one person in production, > possibly a PT person doing bindery and delivery, a person who doubles up > doing > graphic arts and CSR duties, and most likely one other CSR or front > counter > person who might also help with billing, and other accounting tasks. > These > "minimums" typically result in lower SPEs yet higher overall percentages > for > labor. > > The only offsetting factor is that small firms typically pay less per hour > and are often located smaller towns and communities where it is possible > to > have lower overhead expenses. COG expenses, on the other hand, can go > from one > extreme to the next when you compare rural markets to large metro areas. > Just > some thoughts. > > John Stewart > Q. P. Consulting, Inc. > Featuring - _"Print Shop For Sale"_ (http://www.printshopsforsale.net/) > > by Larry Hunt & John Stewart > > 2110 S. Dairy Road > West Melbourne, FL 32904 > 321-727-2442 Fax 321-727-2166 > Cell: 321-794-6259 > _www.quickconsultant.com_ (http://www.quickconsultant.com/) > "Winners analyze, losers rationalize." > > > > **************The year's hottest artists on the red carpet at the Grammy > Awards. Go to AOL Music. > (http://music.aol.com/grammys?NCID=aolcmp00300000002565) > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From dennisewing at satx.rr.com Thu Feb 14 11:27:18 2008 From: dennisewing at satx.rr.com (Dennis Ewing) Date: Thu Feb 14 11:27:25 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls In-Reply-To: <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: <47B46BE6.3040608@satx.rr.com> They both sound like scum to me. This is not appropriate in any circumstance. I can't believe anyone with a working brain would do such a thing. I don't care if you are a major babe or a hag you should be respected for the position you are in. Sales calls are not pick up bars. What you experienced in the first case would have been grounds for a police report. Were you my wife I might have an inclination to do bodily harm to the fool. Conduct like this has no place in a business environment, Makes me wonder what they do with their female employees. They may go down in flames one day from a harassment suit. I would never cross their threshold again if I were you. Hearing this makes me angry. I can't imagine how angry your husband was when you told him. I'm assuming you had to handcuff him to keep him from killing the slimes. Dennis W. Ewing Sr Ewing and Sons Printing 12000 Crownpoint, #130 San Antonio, TX 78233 dennisewing@satx.rr.com ewingandsons@satx.rr.com 210/650-5311 210/650-9916 Fax Kathy Henry wrote: > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I can > get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be > brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I > can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run with > my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer relations > on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or > flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been > involved in a sales meeting. > > Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make > sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good > customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg > underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top of > his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me > following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his > office at all. > > The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would come > to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked > if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make > the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the > project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this > client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We > get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and > begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me > attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves our > working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said > he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship (he > is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent working > relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my marriage > vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he > totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just > keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to pay > for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable > silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances. > > 1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car. > 2. I learned never to expect what you expect. > > HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never occur > to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some men > think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I understand > printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of conduct > that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any of > you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out > there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it > was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk, > but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely unusual > from both of them. > > Thank you all in advance for your help on this! > > > > Kathleen Henry > > From jodib at blackfoot.net Thu Feb 14 11:32:22 2008 From: jodib at blackfoot.net (Jodi Bowser) Date: Thu Feb 14 11:32:45 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> Message-ID: <005f01c86f27$2e28e9a0$0101a8c0@JodiPC> Kathy: First of all I am in shock (as I am sure you are) and appalled at the very idea that they could approach you this way. My second reaction is to bop them in the nose. Have you discussed this with your husband? Personally speaking, this could be construed as harassment and the fact that these incidences are always there, would make me either find another person (your husband) who could do the sales calls to these businesses, OR stop doing their printing. Of course, we are in business to stay in business and it appears they are a good printing account. (?) That said, I would then consider an additional handling charge (NO PUN INTENDED) to manage these accounts. I'd like to think we, as women business owners, would receive the respect that we deserve. My husband is great at printing but I am the one who has the personality to sell the work and deal with our customers and I am the one attending the chamber meetings and other business meetings (one of the a Businesswomen's Network) It is disheartening to hear that we are not, but it makes me more determined to prove them they are wrong. Do you have an attorney (that you maybe do printing for) that you could discuss this with without naming names, just to obtain a sense of how to protect you and your business? Or another trusted women business owner? I am sorry you have to go through this........but do keep us posted and if you would like to discuss anything off line, my number and email are below! Jodi Bowser Pyramid Printing - Missoula, Montana www.pyramidprintingmt.com jodib@blackfoot.net Member NAQP #205787 Member Garden City BNI 406-728-1503 fax 406-728-0505 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kathy Henry" To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 6:06 AM Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message ***** > > I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I > can > get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be > brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I > can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run > with > my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer > relations > on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or > flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been > involved in a sales meeting. > > Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make > sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good > customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg > underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top > of > his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me > following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his > office at all. > > The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would > come > to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked > if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make > the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the > project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this > client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We > get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and > begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me > attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves > our > working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said > he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship > (he > is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent > working > relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my > marriage > vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he > totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just > keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to > pay > for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable > silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances. > > 1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car. > 2. I learned never to expect what you expect. > > HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never > occur > to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some > men > think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I > understand > printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of > conduct > that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any > of > you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out > there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it > was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk, > but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely > unusual > from both of them. > > Thank you all in advance for your help on this! > > > > Kathleen Henry > Mitchell Printing & Mailing > kathy@mpcny.com > > > "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding > > > 125 East First Street > PO Box 815 > Oswego, NY 13126 > (315) 343-3531 > (315) 343-3577 (fax) > (315) 532-0943 (cell) > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.4/1277 - Release Date: 2/13/2008 > 8:00 PM > > > _______________________________________________ > PrintOwners Discussion List > Post: PrintOwners@printweb.org > Info: http://rb.enter.net/mailman/listinfo/printowners > From copythatnyc at aol.com Thu Feb 14 12:33:07 2008 From: copythatnyc at aol.com (Tommy Melendez) Date: Thu Feb 14 12:33:30 2008 Subject: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls In-Reply-To: <005f01c86f27$2e28e9a0$0101a8c0@JodiPC> References: <00e101c86e62$4716dc30$8302a8c0@Robbin> <005501c86f0a$62b90d70$017ba8c0@mpcnycore> <005f01c86f27$2e28e9a0$0101a8c0@JodiPC> Message-ID: <8CA3D46CBACFD97-BCC-274@WEBMAIL-DF15.sysops.aol.com> Kathy, I got to say you are as strong as they come.? John is very lucky to have found you.? Just the mere fact that you posted this, shows worlds of strength.? I applaud you for the way you handled the situation.? Professional to the very end!? I've had the reverse done to me here.? Where the salesperson try to sell me ad space &? a little service, and?she works for a?BIG local paper.? ? My only responce was I have two woman in my life, my daughter Sheridyn & my business.? Needless to say, I have a new salesperson that sells me the ad space.? Stay strong & don't let this stupidity affect your way of doing business. P.S. John's called me twice before to help me.? I'm only 40 min's away from you.? You say the word & I'll have some boys from Da' Bronx re-arrange, "ahem"?I mean arrange?an ethic class for them.? : ) Copy That, Inc. "Where the only thing you can't copy is our service" 3515 E. Tremont Avenue Bronx, N.Y. 10465 718.892.1859 718.892.2315 Fax www.copythatnyc.com -----Original Message----- From: Jodi Bowser To: Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only Sent: Thu, 14 Feb 2008 11:32 am Subject: Re: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? ? Kathy:? ? First of all I am in shock (as I am sure you are) and appalled at the very idea that they could approach you this way. My second reaction is to bop them in the nose.? Have you discussed this with your husband?? ? Personally speaking, this could be construed as harassment and the fact that these incidences are always there, would make me either find another person (your husband) who could do the sales calls to these businesses, OR stop doing their printing.? ? Of course, we are in business to stay in business and it appears they are a good printing account. (?) That said, I would then consider an additional handling charge (NO PUN INTENDED) to manage these accounts.? ? I'd like to think we, as women business owners, would receive the respect that we deserve. My husband is great at printing but I am the one who has the personality to sell the work and deal with our customers and I am the one attending the chamber meetings and other business meetings (one of the a Businesswomen's Network) It is disheartening to hear that we are not, but it makes me more determined to prove them they are wrong.? ? Do you have an attorney (that you maybe do printing for) that you could discuss this with without naming names, just to obtain a sense of how to protect you and your business?? Or another trusted women business owner?? ? I am sorry you have to go through this........but do keep us posted and if you would like to discuss anything off line, my number and email are below!? ? ? Jodi Bowser? Pyramid Printing - Missoula, Montana? www.pyramidprintingmt.com? jodib@blackfoot.net? Member NAQP #205787? Member Garden City BNI? 406-728-1503? fax 406-728-0505? ? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kathy Henry" ? To: "'Discussion List for Printing Business Owners Only'" ? Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2008 6:06 AM? Subject: RE: [PrintOwners] Inappropriate conduct during sales calls? ? > ***** This is a PrintOwners List Message *****? >? > I am posting this to this list because I am really angry and hope that I > can? > get responses from both males and females here. I know you will all be? > brutally honest with me and I really want to know your feelings so that I? > can find out how to handle this. I do sales for our company which I run > with? > my husband, John. Generally, I handle all the sales calls/customer > relations? > on my own. I do not dress provocatively nor do I attempt to play coy or? > flirty, I am friendly and professional. At no time has alcohol ever been? > involved in a sales meeting.? >? > Yet, for two times in the past 6 months I have had two male customers make? > sexual advances to me during a sales call. Both of the men are very good? > customers of ours. The first guy actually put his sock foot up my leg? > underneath my skirt at a conference table. I stuck my stiletto in the top > of? > his foot hard. He then received a dressing down in an e-mail from me? > following the incident, and remains a customer, yet I do not go to his? > office at all.? >? > The second incident happened yesterday when a customer asked if I would > come? > to his facility for a tour and to discuss a rather large project. He asked? > if I would have time to have lunch afterward. Seems innocent right? I make? > the hour journey to his plant, did the tour, met the staff, discussed the? > project, and he said lets go to lunch, he will drive. I have known this? > client for 3 years, never had any indication there could be a problem. We? > get to the restaurant, he tells the waiter that we were in no rush, and? > begins to tell me he thinks I am extremely beautiful and that he finds me? > attractive because I am a woman in a position of power. He said he loves > our? > working relationship, yet would like to take it to the next level. He said? > he expected us to be completely discreet and have a sexual relationship > (he? > is married, he also knows John well) while maintaining our excellent > working? > relationship. I told him that I was in love with my husband and my > marriage? > vows were extremely important to me and I would not break them. He said he? > totally understood, but he was open for a relationship in the future, just? > keep it in mind. I then go to get up, he pushes the check over to me to > pay? > for, and I now have to ride back to the plant with him in an uncomfortable? > silence. Luckily I got there without any further advances.? >? > 1. I learned never to go to a sales lunch without my own car.? > 2. I learned never to expect what you expect.? >? > HOWEVER, am I being naive about the sales relationship? It would never > occur? > to me to come on to the ink sales guy or the FedEx dude, yet why do some > men? > think that this is an acceptable form of behavior in business? I > understand? > printing has been a man's world for many years - is there a code of > conduct? > that I am not familiar with? Are they all still in high school? Have any > of? > you ever had this happen, and if so, how did you handle it? Any men out? > there find the reverse happen to them with the female counterpart? If it? > was any guy on the street he would be picking himself up off the sidewalk,? > but these two are very good customers and the behavior was extremely > unusual? > from both of them.? >? > Thank you all in advance for your help on this!? >? >? >? > Kathleen Henry? > Mitchell Printing & Mailing? > kathy@mpcny.com? >? >? > "Service is the Supreme Commitment of Life" Warren G.Harding? >? >? > 125 East First Street? > PO Box 815? > Oswego, NY 13126? > (315) 343-3531? > (315) 343-3577 (fax)? > (315) 532-0943 (cell)? >? >? >? > No virus found in this outgoing message.? > Checked by AVG Free Edition.? > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.20.4/1277 - Release Date: 2/13/2008? > 8:00 PM? >? >? > _______________________________________________? > PrintOwners Dis